AIBU - Stag Do - Two Young DC's + Money Priorities

[WinterNightsByCandleLight]

• Hoping this works this time as it's my third attempt at posting this thread, only to keep discovering it doesn't actually post and mysteriously vanishes! -

Right, so, OH is going on a stag do in May from the Friday morning to the Monday evening. We have two young DC's who, by that time, will be 2.5yrs and 1.4yrs

Neither of our DC's sleep well at all and I have little to no hope of that drastically changing within 5 or so months. DC1 has been the world's worst sleeper from the get-go and DC2 has just started teething which of course, lasts for months on end and wreaks havoc on night wakings. I'd say that on an average night, each of them wake up anywhere between 3-6 times and that's not including the times that one wakes the other up (they share a room) and scream the place down in unison.

I'm not thrilled about having to do four days and three nights completely on my own while our DC's are still so young. A standard Mon-Fri week at home with them is difficult and draining enough, without missing out on the help at the weekend and having to somehow manage both DC's night wakings alone.
I told OH about my concerns, but he assured me that "I'll be okay!" - useful and constructive..

My second annoyance is coming from the financial side -

This trip will cost OH somewhere in the region of £500-£600 (transport, accommodation, food, activities etc), yet up until now OH has always bleated on about how rubbish he is at saving money. It's why we never do anything nice for our birthdays, anniversaries, valentines, no random 'date night' restaurant outings, we've had one trip away in the four years we've been together and that was two nights stay somewhere in England not overly far from where we live. We've never taken the kids on holiday or for a short break... you catch my drift!

When I questioned OH exactly how he's planning on saving over half a grand in what's in essence, not a huge amount of time, he told me "he's got it figured out, he'll manage, he'll be able to do it". So that leaves me thinking, hang on a minute, if he's capable of saving a relatively large lump sum, why don't we do nice things? Why don't we go out for birthday dinners, special occasions or take the kids to Butlins?!
My final kick in the teeth surrounding the cost of this trip, comes from the fact I've been wanting OH and I to get engaged for some time now (I know, I know, I could propose, but I'd like for him to be the one to get down on one knee!) yet I've always been told that he can't afford the ring that I picked out and fell in love with way back when we first started dating. We've spoken about marriage a lot and are both equally adamant that it's definitely in our future, so I've shown him - many a time - rings that are far, far cheaper than the first one I saw, in fact, they cost less than he'll be blowing on this stag do! But it seems that saving up for this trip is evidently more of a priority than the likes of an engagement ring, or a family break away, or doing nice things for the special occasions..

AIBU to be a bit begrudged by any of this?
I'm expecting Aunt Flo any day now so I know I'm being more cranky and sensitive than usual, but it's still niggling away at me!

Thank you if you've read this far, I hadn't intended to waffle so much

Him throwing his toys out of the pram is his way of shutting you down and trying to stop you from ever raising this again.

He is a selfish dickhead.

What sausage said. As an unmarried sahm you are in a horribly vulnerable position. All his actions display he is not that bothered about you. The stag weekend is the least of your problems

As PP have said, start looking for a job ASAP and make plans to leave him. He has arranged things - probably quite deliberately - so that he can just bin you if he gets bored. He has no intention of marrying you; you're a convenient domestic appliance and producer/minder of children, you're not a person as far as he's concerned. The only thing that matters to him is him.

The issue in your life isn’t the stag do. Starting your discussion by talking about the stag do, made it about the stag do. It ended with him saying he isn’t going on the stag do. But he will, after a few days of huffing when you give in and apologise. He will make vague promises and you will tell him to go.

The problem is that you are not being treated like an equal partner in the relationship who jointly makes decisions, knows the household income and expenses along with your capacity to save and capacity to have luxuries (holidays, dinners, presents for anybody but the children). You have no standing in the home other than to look after his children and keep house.

Frankly you don’t need to get married if you have security of your own home as tenant or an owner. But you do need your own income or equal control over his. It is reasonable to ask for this. More reasonable than to expect somebody to bear and raise 2 children for you.

You have 2 kids so your time for rainbows and unicorns is over. Your an adult and that means taking control of your own destiny and not leaving it to the whim or benevolence of a man. Forget about romantic proposals and big weddings that may never happen. Plan a holiday for you and your children that you make happen. It make years for you to be able to afford it but at least you won’t have to wait for a selfish dick to offer.

Firstly my baby isn’t sleeping atm so I totally get the lack of sleep issue. Virtual hugs, hang in there hopefully we both get some 😴sleep soon!

Secondly your partner sounds horrible.
Why couldn’t you go to a Hens party if he can afford to go on a stag weekend??

I’d be fuming if my hubby prioritized a stag do over spending money on the family, but the difference is my hubby wouldn’t consider spending money on himself as selfishly as your partner has.

He has no plans on marrying you and to be honest it’s probably a good thing. Start to look for work and gain some financial freedom. 🌸💕

We have various linked accounts. $2000 in one for emergencies which we are aiming to grow to 3 months wages in case of injury or redundancy.
60% of income goes 8nto everyday account for mortgage, food and bills.
20% into a splurge account for dinners out etc. $200 limit or consultation required.
20% into savings for holidays, new car that sort of thing. We are finding that we don’t spend splurge much so that extra will go into building the 3 months wages in savings.
Good luck

As PPs have said, I would start looking to get your foot back in the door work wise. And I would also suggest that you take over managing finances as he is clearly incapable if you don't have £40 saved somewhere to go out for a meal!? What happens if the boiler gets condemned next week. You have kids who can't be living in a house without one until you can find a few K for a replacement.

My immediate concern would be that your whole financial position as a family sounds very very precarious. It's not clear if he's a low earner- in which case it does take some discipline to get any money saved (and spending it on a stag do is stupid!) Nd maybe you would just be better at that. But as he has managed to save that money I am assuming he is on an average or moderate wage so is just being plain bad with the money.

I do agree your priorities are wrong. If you don't have any savings, to the extent you can't afford a meal out, then it would be incredibly unwise to be spending even £100 on an engagement ring or big money (like beyond the bare minimun) on a wedding or even a UK holiday (which still add up). Get some financial stability pronto. On your own or with him.

I really think you need to tell him how you feel. Every point you made is valid.

The one that stands out for me is the money side. Trips away with mates are on top of family holidays or treats. It's extremely selfish to do something for yourself and the family have nothing.

The sleeping part can be solved but you need support and you need to do the strategies consistently.

I'd just like to add - as it seems to have come up a few times - should anything go wrong or break down within the property, it's down to our landlord to sort out. We're both on the tenancy agreement and my Mum was put down as a guarantor when we moved in a few years back, so regarding anything breaking and needing to shell out a chunk of money, that doesn't massively apply here. We also receive UC which goes in to my personal account, so if the worst was to happen, the kids and I would still have a roof over our heads and some money to help get us by until I got back in to employment.

OH isn't exactly what I'd call a 'moderate or high' earner. His role is the highest paid in the borough for what he does, but its still not a lot really in comparison to most, hence the UC payments.

It's also not that he isn't capable of saving much smaller amounts - someone mentioned something about 40 quid or so for dinner - that, he can do. For example, if we want a day out with the kids and take them to the kiddie soft play area of our local amusement park, we'll do that, then grab some lunch for us all and maybe get the eldest a new little toy. Things that like are doable and he's managed to spend a fair amount on both DC's for Xmas this year - well, a relative amount considering they're both still too young to even know what Christmas is yet!

It's just my main and biggest issue is his new found ability to save up a big sum of money within a small space of time for something entirely for himself, yet putting money in to our relationship so we can enjoy time as a couple or taking our relationship to the next step by becoming engaged seems less important right now.

December I will say, is a hectic month for us moneywise. Obviously it's Christmas, his nieces birthday, our anniversary and DC1's birthday too. So we have a lot to cough up for around this time of year. But it's not like the actual date of our anniversary is some big mystery until the week or so before when it's finally revealed, yknow? Why can't we go out for a nice meal the month before to celebrate early and reconnect!? (I've seen plenty of deals on Groupon that look lovely and wouldn't break the bank in the slightest).

I'm just a bit annoyed and am fully expecting to be made to look like the bad guy for airing my opinion last night. I slept in a different room as I was so mad that he just shut the conversation down by storming off rather than listening to me, that I really didn't fancy being in the same bed. So it looks like this shit is being dragged out over another day when it could've been reasonably and responsibly spoken about and (mostly) sorted yesterday!

Don't feel bad about standing your ground. There are many partners who would flatly refuse. I wish I had done this when my partner went off on all his dive trips. Start as you mean to go on.

Oh I don't definitely don't feel bad about saying any of this! If I have a problem or something I feel needs to be discussed, I'll just blurt it out there and then. I like to try and talk things through and fix problems as they arise so we can all move on from it and be happier. But I suspect OH will see last nights talk as me being purely selfish.

Though I don't personally feel celebrating an anniversary or wanting the occasional date night is a selfish ask. I think doing little things like that go a long way towards how happy you are as a couple and I think it's important to have 'adult time', especially given our kids are so young so understandably a lot of the time our relationship is put on the back burner while we focus on the DC. But one meal out every few months to reconnect and chat about stuff would be lovely 🤷🏻‍♀️ not to mention working towards saving up for a nice little trip away as a family!

It sounds like you have had the time to think things through now. Your last post was clear and articulate regarding what is concerning you.

PP was correct to advise you to separate the 2 issues - the stag do and your position in the relationship. The stag do has really just highlighted the problems you have.

You will cope for 3 nights but I would expect him to truly appreciate how hard it will be. Could anyone stay over a night or two or even take the dc out for a few hours so you can catch up on sleep. Sounds like you will need the help if it's available.

When is the stag do?

I would be tempted to put the discussion on hold until after that. Let him prove that he is capable of saving the money then have a discussion regarding his attitude towards you and the relationship. He is taking you for granted and that can happen when your life is consumed by 2 young dc. Once the stag do is over the discussion can't be derailed and you have evidence that he can actually save. I would also avoid the engagement ring discussion as that needs to come from him. It's really another side issue like the stag do. He needs to fundamentally change his priorities regarding the relationship.

If he truly is awful at saving I would want to see evidence of where he made savings. I would be wary that he takes out a payday loan or borrows the money from a friend.

I also think he is going to fund this stag do via a loan of some sort, which will mean no treats for you or the DC for quite some time while he is paying it back...

I think doing little things like that go a long way towards how happy you are as a couple and I think it's important to have 'adult time', especially given our kids are so young so understandably a lot of the time our relationship is put on the back burner while we focus on the DC. But one meal out every few months to reconnect and chat about stuff would be lovely 🤷🏻‍♀️ not to mention working towards saving up for a nice little trip away as a family!

He doesn't feel the same way and his actions show this. Date nights and dinners and holidays as a family are secondary to niece's birthday party and stag do to him.

My guess is he'll borrow from a friend or take some kind of loan for the stag do then it'll be no dinners or the like for you all because he has to make paying the loan back a priority. So again, you're not a priority.

It could've been reasonably and responsibly spoken about and (mostly) sorted yesterday!
No it couldn’t have. Because fundamentally he thinks he deserves this and he can find money for his priorities, you aren’t one of them.

Well, it could have if he wasn't an arse.
He came in from work this evening, didn't say two words to me. The DC's were screaming (as they always are an hour before bedtime) so he decided to go and sit in the bedroom rather than help me deal with them. Great.
After I get DC2 to sleep, OH goes in to the nursery with DC1 to get him to sleep. He does this, then straight away heads to the bathroom and takes a long bath. Again, virtually zero words exchanged by this point.
Following the bath, he goes straight to the bedroom - still not saying anything to me - and lays on the bed in the dark (this can't have been any later than 8:30pm).. I ask him if he's going to sleep, if so, I'd need to grab some stuff out of the bedroom. He said yes. I grabbed what I needed and have returned to the other room to sleep away from him once more.

He is an absolute twat. He is doing his best to make you feel so awful that you never challenge him over his behaviour again.

I know what he's doing. He's waiting for me to go to him and be all "Can we talk about last night?" and be the one to initiate the 'smoothing things over' process.

But I'm sick of being the one to have to follow up after arguments, especially seeing as this particular time it really didn't need to escalate to this whatsoever as all I was after was a calm, adult chat about money and making an effort to do more couple oriented things.

He can drag this out and ignore me for as long he likes now. I'm actually quite comfy in the other room - not having to listen to his snoring or constantly having to fight for the duvet.

The financial side of your argument I totally agree with.. That would really piss me right off!!!

Love it when they behave like that winternights, makes you want to smother them!!

He's ignoring you because (in his worldview) you are in the wrong and he's waiting for a humble apology. How dare you suggest that he consider you and the DC rather than just doing what he wants? You are only a woman, and therefore need to understand that your role is to obey your lord and master and be grateful he sees that you are fed and housed...

What an arse. Hope he comes grovelling shortly.

You’ve already worked it out you and the kids are not a priority that’s really not nice to discover.

Two kids and no marriage proposal to me would mean he’s never going to ask you.

I’d ensure I had a girls weekend away and make him experience four days with two kids, don’t allow him to put you behind him and his wants.

YABU - May is 6 months away - who knows what have changed by then? If we were talking about next week, given the current circumstances and money, that would be reasonable. However it's over 26 weeks away...

I would discuss and explain that you have concerns, but given it's 6 months away you want to work towards him going. Firstly he can prove this by starting to save £20 a week towards the do (cut cigarettes, one less night out a week etc).

If a month out he either has not saved or the kids are still sleeping badly, then yes I think you need to have serious conversation about him only going for one night or not going etc. If you introduce that caveat now, it won't be a huge shock to him when you raise it.

In terms of engagement/marriage etc - that a different matter. From your post there is a lot of emphasis on the 'ring'. Engagement is a declaration of love and a commitment to marry each other, the 'ring' Is largely irrelevant if your truly love each other. Sure I get it's nice to have something to show off to people, but you can always get something small now to get formally engaged and buy a more traditional ring in the years to come. The bigger question is whether he wants to get married and/or whether you are marrying for the right reasons?

Also remember once you get engaged, it potentially starts the marriage wheel which is a very expensive ride indeed. Maybe he wants to be more financially secure before you start that journey. I think you probably need to have a serious talk.

You poor love, it really should not be this hard.

I think you are approaching it in the right way. His reaction speaks volumes. Don't let him act like you've said he can't go to distract from the bigger money and commitment issues.

If I were you I would get myself a job and work on becoming financially independent from him. With him or without him, you're alone in this and you really need to have something to fall back on.

He doesn't sound like a decent or supportive Guy. You do realise you deserve better right?

Youre in a difficult position with the two young children now and no marriage. There's no point me trying to convince you of what I think would be best for you to do. Youll just do what you want to do. I wish you luck.