DP went to a strip club on a stag do, and I'm like "this is over"

[OhYikesThisIsBad]

So DP [of c.5 years] went to European resort stag do last weekend. I'll be honest: I was fretful, but assumed he has aligned views on women cavorting for men's pleasure.

For context: we're chums with bride and groom, the wedding's fairly soon. DP and I haven't seen each other til tonight, through work travel.

He announces tonight, as we begin our third drink, "yes well there was a strip club".

Apparently he and another chum "went along with everyone" and sat at the bar because they felt "uncomfortable". The groom had a dance "but paid for by someone else!". I asked: DP thinks the bride and groom should still get married.

I'm very very sad, very angry, have told him this is a no go, relationship ender, etc. I loathe strip clubs.

Dunno what i want really - possibly someone to say "no you're wrong, he's a good lad", "he only went along with the crowd". Maybe a hand hold. Is there any way back from this? I was really looking forward to this bank hol. #fuckssake

You're angry at him because you are viewing sex workers as victims, women who are incapable of making the choice to do sex work and so must have been forced into it.

Totally agree deadpool well said

@OhYikesThisIsBad I imagine your head is all over the place.

I hope you're genuinely happy whatever you decide.

You don't owe anyone here an explanation for your thought process.

I think most people in long relationships would say there are far worse things to weather. That yes he's fucked up, but on balance is this a battle you're prepared to win at the expense of a happy relationship?

Ladydeadpool, the whole point is you can’t tell! Therefore you’re risking that they are trafficked just so you can enjoy yourself.

I’m no good at maths but even with your figures there would be a what 7% chance they were trafficked?

Let me help you out 'petal'

But the point is it’s not the strip club that’s the issue. It’s wether she trusts him (to not go) or not. That’s the issue.

How is the strip club not the issue? It's the whole fucking issue. It is what the thread is about. Why would she trust him not to go again when he has already shown her that he is ok with them? Even if he never steps foot in one again he still went and has still shown that their values are completely different in this area.

The fact that you think every man watches porn and visits strip clubs tells me exactly what kind of person you are anyway.

Given that NONE of the girls in the clubs I went to were foreign and the ones I spoke to were either studying or started part time and dropped the other job cos they could make more in a night at the club than they made in a week in the other job Storm, I think you need to stop catastrophising and assuming because you have experience with women who have been forced in to it that every women who does it is in the same boat. That just isn't true.

The OP asked for opinions and I gave her mine. My husband was taken to a strip club for his stag do and was threatened with removal for refusing a dance and telling the girl he "had better at home". Meanwhile at my hen night at the other side of the city, I had 2 male strippers and was having an absolute riot. By your reckoning I am a terrible person who is feeding into the sex trade and should be hung drawn and quartered!!! No I am a normal female having a laugh with 2 hunky guys dressed up as a fireman and a naval officer. They were giving me a private dance that's for sure. My husband saw the video of it and thought it was hilarious. In my eyes there is no difference in what I was doing and what my husband was doing (although he said he couldn't be bothered, he just wanted to leave so he could get a pizza!!)

The abuse of women should not be ignored. But neither should the abuse of men. If you do not see the similarities between the girls in the clubs and the guys at my hen do then I think your opinion is somewhat skewed. Yes women have rights - so do men. I am sick of hearing that men are perverts and can't look at women or compliment them because they are making women uncomfortable. I have a son and a daughter and both are being brought up to be respectful of others regardless of their race, gender, sexuality, religion, occupation or appearance. But I worry for my son becoming a man in this world as soon they will be unable to breathe without having to explain themselves.

There are some horrible men out there but they are not all horrible. Equally there are some horrible women but we are not all horrible. There are 4500 genetic differences between men and women and that means we think and act differently. I am not aiming this at you Storm but my experience is that a lot of feminists I have met simply hate men, most often because they have had an asshole treat them badly or had a traumatising experience at the hands of a man. There are things men and women do that are just instinct. Away from societal constrictions we are all living breathing mammals who are genetically predisposed to be a certain way. Men will never be equal to men the same as men will never be equal to women. It is impossible. We are different. As it should be. We should all, as humans, be treated with respect and dignity. Some people of both genders don't subscribe to this. That is the problem. If we figure out a way to deal with disrespect and hatred, regardless of the origin or the victim, we have cracked it.

Sorry this post has turned into a rant. Fully expect to be flamed but this is my opinion. I may not agree with what some posters say but I will defend to the death your right to say it!

I would be very disappointed in DP if I found out he went to a strip club as he has always said he doesn't like them. I think I would end our relationship as he wouldn't be the person he had told me he was.

If this is something that you feel strongly about (even if it wasn't) you have every right to end your relationship. It is probably better now than after marriage and children.

Hateloggingin

The people included in those statistics included those who were not currently being trafficked but were at risk of it - children under the age of 18 who were homeless/drug addicts, children of illegal immigrants whose parents were prostitutes etc.

They aren't something that give me a warm cosy feeling either but it seems as though it would have been an awkward situation for your dp

As soon as they read the Op i knew this thread would be full of stupid people babbling on about man hating.
The striped club wasnt in the uk so all your crap about stip clubs here means fuck all.

So many posters reading the Op and pretending her issues is envy. The fuck is wrong with you?

The thing is, Lady Deadpool, at the point of 'purchase' it's not possible to say with any certainty whether or not a woman has been trafficked.

And let's not forget that vulnerability goes well beyond the trafficking issue: many UK born women in the sex industry have experienced sexual, physical and emotional abuse in childhood and adulthood. Then of course there's poverty: I'm guessing very few strippers are from privileged backgrounds.

So it's impossible to know on what basis these women are consenting to what's happening to them.

Ladydeadpool - ok I take your point, however if there is even a 1% risk of the person grinding on you being trafficked, why would you take that risk? It’s not a risk that has to be taken, it’s going to a lap dancing club, they’re quite easy to avoid.

Would you enter somewhere you didn’t need to if there was a chance you entering resulted in a child being abused? I would assume not. So why is it different if a woman is at risk? And in some cases they are children not women anyway. This is a genuine question, I would like to understand

Massive x post with Hateloggingin!

Typeractive put it much better than I did

DH went on a European stag do last weekend and sat out of some.of the others going to see strippers, he thinks it is gross.

I did ask him if he would have been so firm.if it was just him (4 or 5 of 16 wanted no part in it) he said yes, but who knows?!

The groom .and bride are both very good friends of mine, but I havent asked if groom got involved in anything... I would think differently of him as a person if he did but it's not my place to police what goes on in others relationships or assume or judge what their boundaries are. I would assume that as they are getting married they have discussed this stuff and trust each other

40, what were the jobs these women resigned to dedicate more time to stripping? Were they barristers? Doctors?

No, thought not.

It's not OK to use poor women as sexual entertainment.

Yes it's going to be tough after all this time.

But - you want a life with someone you respect. Not someone you ignore the basic fundamental opinions of because other stuff is good and you want to respect them.

It's either there or it's not. Them being that person you really truly respect for the views they hold - not the ones they spout that they know you expect from them but well, she's not there...

Sounds like him being 'supportive of your feminist gubbins' simply amounts to a new 2010s version of 'that's nice dear.'

It's pointless if you're policing him. You don't want to anyway. You want him to be the kind of person who wouldn't go. The kind of person you can genuinely respect and feel you're a kindred spirit to.

They are out there. I'm laughing at some of the comments here 'it's a stag... that's what happens' etc. No it doesn't. It does with shitheads and misogynists and their friendship groups. It doesn't with decent people. My DH has been on loads of stags. Pubs, paintballing, brewery tour then gig, cycling weekend... yep you name it... lads on tour ending up at a strip club? Nope. Because he'd find it fucking horrific. And yes, no one would need to tell him or any of his/our friends who are all professional grown ups who read newspapers and have a vague grasp of the world that women in strip clubs are not there because it's fun and sexy.

I went out with a really nice guy through uni, before DH. Nice as in nice enough, kind, loving, fun. He'd have probably gone along with it, though. He'd have nodded along to me 'being all feminist' and then bantered with 'ver lads' when I wasn't there. So we eventually finished, as deep down he wasn't enough.

How old are you? And your P?

As for the groom and the dance. No, I wouldn't be able to go to the wedding. And if asked I would say that was why. You say she's a friend of yours - I would think really hard, really honestly with yourself where this leaves you if you don't tell her.

Consoling myself that the exit polls - not the count yet - for the Irish abortion ref look to be a landslide in favour of Yes/Repeal. twitter.com/CompletePol/status/1000146180268023808

thank you for your posts you lot. I'm going to dig out some links to give (ex?)DP some reading on trafficked women, consent and on women as sexual objects. Will be useful even if he only uses the info for his next relationship.

Suggestions for links welcome.

Many years ago I came home to find a very tipsy boyfriend sleeping on my floor. He'd been out with his colleagues, as I knew.
"Oh, God," he groaned, "they made me go to a strip club and got this woman to do a dance. I've had a spotty arse waved in my face.."
He is the most loving, caring, thoughtful of men and we've been together 23 years, married for 11 of them. It wouldn't have occurred to me to have chucked him over something stupid that his mates made him do, and I'm really glad it didn't.
I wouldn't stay with someone who made a habit of it. I'd be pissed off with someone who wasn't uncomfortable with it. But this isn't that.

Well hurry up and dump him op!

Why are you wasting valuable time on MN?

Hopefully he will find someone a touch more liberal

Good luck. And honestly please realise men have fantasies, admire women all the time - alll day long (some of them) and you will never ever imo meet a fella who doesn’t. Men love sex, women, scantily clad women.

It is a fact you will have to live with. Feminist or not.

Thanks Fizzy - we're mid 30s. I like your post - he's not a "bantz" lad but will ponder.

Musing on "food poisoning" to get out of the wedding.

I would lose all respect for a man who went into one of those places.

This would not bother me at all if he didnt have a dance? Unfortunately they are pretty much par for the course with stags, it doesn’t sound like he was the instigator..

Italian greyhound, it would be far too outing for me to disclose my job. Clients are usually in physical pain and in a position of vulnerability, and amid small talk, a whole manner of unusual subjects tend to spill out, and I’m just a neutral person there for them to disclose to. As far as I’m aware it’s not for ‘thrills.’ Men and women alike will talk about family, bowel movements, past traumatic events, Netflix habits - you name it.

Men and women enjoy looking at people that they find attractive, and most men wouldn’t think twice about stepping into a strip club, unless they thought they would be punished in some way by their partner. Also it’s legal, so in their minds they are not doing anything ‘wrong.’

I just checked a yougov poll, to make sure that I didn’t have a skewed perspective on this subject, and it confirmed that less than 20% of men interviewed would refuse to visit a strip club because they felt uncomfortable.

I cant answer your question on whether I think ‘it’s right,’ it’s too broad a question on a very difficult subject.

Mellie please have my first MN

When will those women stop talking among themselves about their tedious internal lives, eh?

Should shut up and put up.

There are some very long responses here so I’m not going to lie, I’ve not read them all!
However, for me going to a strip club really shouldn’t be a deal breaker.
More often then not men go because they’re in a crowd and don’t want to be the one to refuse or not go. No, it’s not ideal but unless they sleep with a stripper (which I know can sometimes happen) then I don’t think watching some dances or having a laugh with their friends should be too much of a problem.