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Original poster

13 year old DD saying awful things to other children.... Please help!

173 replies

CelestialBean · 21/04/2018 16:21

DD s 13. DP has a 4 year old DD who stays with us but doesn't live with us.

We had a lot of stress with DP's ex and have just been through a massive and very stressful court case. DD was aware of how difficult and stressful it was.

DD has a habit of saying very spiteful things when she is annoyed or upset. So yesterday she told DP's DD that her mother was dead......

DP's DD asked me if it was true, luckily she doesn't really understand the concept and I was able to explain that of course she's not and that she's absolutely fine.

DP was furious with my DD (as was I). DP didn't shout at her, he left it for me to deal with her which i was glad of. DD then stormed to the bottom of the garden and howled loudly. DP had to carry her into the house at 9pm (sent straight to her room) where she drew all over her face and arms in red pen and wrote him a note saying how horrible he is and he makes her want to kill herself and has done many times....

She is a bit sheepish and quiet today. DP is still very angry. He's asked how I plan to punish her.

She's had therapy before after her father left to live 200 miles away and start a new family a year ago. She was very upset about this and had lots of rages where she'd threaten to hurt herself or jump out of a window. She has calmed down a lot since though.

OP posts:
MarvelleGazelle · 21/04/2018 21:50

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

SeaEagleFeather · 21/04/2018 22:02

Agreed she needs to apologise to the little girl.

It sounds to me like she's struggling very badly and she needs both boundaries and a lot of attention and support. If she's attached to her stepdad, being told even by a 4yo that he isn't her dad is going to hurt and it'll be a reminder that her own dad left.

fwiw, after my mum died when I was 11, a 12 year old said to me in a quarrel that she was glad my mum had died. Now mum dying devastated my life, but I do remember that girl saying sorry to me and that made it ok, in fact we became friends after. The apology took the sting away.

I certainly don't think you need to take it to extremes like a previous poster suggested because if you humiliate your daughter, she'll remember and resent it.

Possibly she'll resent the 4yo more too, if you inflict humiliation on her. I can't see anything constructive about humiliation and quite a lot that is destructive.

Consequences are in order - I'd take the phone away for longer than a week, for sure, and I'd be looking for some sort of consequence beyond that.

SeaEagleFeather · 21/04/2018 22:03

also the 12 year old was a perfectly normal girl who said something in the heat of the moment. I don't for a moment think there is anything that unusual about nasty comments from angry teens; what's important is how you deal with them.

Mimco · 21/04/2018 22:30

I've been thinking. Perhaps it would be an idea to get her to do some research on bullying and how words can hurt other people then write about it. Either in a letter or story. She is quite creative and it might help the message to sink in as well as get her feeling a bit more empathy. This and no phone for two weeks.

MarvelleGazelle · 21/04/2018 22:38

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Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Smeddum · 21/04/2018 22:46

That sounds good OP, especially the research about the impact on others. I hope it helps all of you. Smile

bbpp · 21/04/2018 22:53

She needs therapy. I can remember loosing control at that age and I was it was the start of a very severe mental illness.

The drawing on red pen is a tip to stop self-harmers cutting, as a way to get the anger out and look like you have. If she feels suicidal and is googling that she wants to hurt herself she will have come across it. If the emotional issues aren't dealt with she may progress. Not to mention she's telling you she wants to die. Take her seriously.

Mimco · 22/04/2018 09:17

Thank you for all the advice and support guys Thanks

So I've spoken to DP and we've decided. No phone for 2 weeks and researching and writing about how bullying and hurtful words can have a long lasting effect on people. Also researching and writing about the reasons why people say hurtful things to each other and bully.

Mimco · 22/04/2018 09:18

And back to therapy. Apparently she wasn't very forthcoming in sessions with the male therapist so I'm wondering if perhaps she had a female therapist she may feel more comfortable.

Smeddum · 22/04/2018 10:03

@Mimco that all sounds hugely positive and I’m glad you and your DP are on the same page. At 13 sometimes it’s bloody hard to see someone else’s point of view or the impact your behaviour can have on them so I think the ideas you’ve come up with are strong enough to get the point across without being harsh or OTT.
The idea about a female therapist is a good one, I wouldn’t have been comfortable with a strange (as in stranger) male at that age.

Hopefully this will help your DD to work through her emotions in a positive way, and enable her to process and also show them in a different way. Which is massively important too.
Fair play to you Mimco it’s been a rough thread for you, and can’t have been easy to read at times. I’ve learned a lot from this thread that I’ll use in my own life.

All the best to you and your family Smile

Mimco · 22/04/2018 10:19

She's just punched her 7 year old brother in the face because he threw a ball at her (that's the game they were playing)... The whole side of his face has swollen up and a massive purple bruise is forming, I feel like phoning the police AngryAngryAngry

Smeddum · 22/04/2018 10:21

@Mimco oh no, your poor boy Sad have her school said anything about behaviour in school? (Sorry if this has already been covered) is there some support they could put in place within school alongside what you’re doing at home so she’s getting help everywhere?

Mimco · 22/04/2018 10:22

She's fine at school, she's doing very well and always perfectly behaved if a little shy.

I'm just so angry at her right now.

Smeddum · 22/04/2018 10:26

I don’t blame you, I would be too. How is your son?

Adversecamber22 · 22/04/2018 10:44

As much as your DD behaviour is awful she is very clearly distressed she is moving in to the realms of more than just a usual pain in the backside teenager.

Unless you have been a child in a blended family it's really hard to describe just how much some dc absolutely hate it and how distressing it is for them. Obviously her actual Father leaving and not having contact is the main reason but she sees the relationship between her stepfather and his DD and it is a painful reminder of how unwanted she is every single time. This was my childhood, I just withdrew in to a fantasy world which is less distressing for others around but was very lonely and these days have zero relationship with my Mother.

You need to get your DD counselling and if you can afford it just go straight down the private route. This is the kind of scenario that at worst can trigger a long term MH issue, lead children in to innapropriate relationships as they seek comfort or like me lead to a lifelong rift.

KriticalSoul · 22/04/2018 11:06

Ok, lets talk boundaries.

Why does your 13yo think its ok to tell an already abused child that her mother is dead?

  • Does she know how unacceptable it is? Not now, I mean before, does she really understand how horrible it is to say something like that?
  • More to the point, does she understand how horrible it is to say it to a baby? because at 4yo, whatever she said to YOUR dd about HER daddy, she's only 4.

Why was she allowed to stand at the bottom of the garden and howl and stay there until 9pm until she had to be dragged in?

  • she should have been allowed 10/15 minutes to calm down, then bought back inside and dealt with IMMEDIATELY.
  • How long was she down there? Why wasn't she bought in?

Clearly with the latest incident making her do research and confiscating her phone isn't enough.

She does need to go back to therapy, but I think you really need to address how much leeway she is being given when she misbehaves.

I've and autistic 11yo, he's violent, shouty and can be very cruel with his words as he has zero filter. He's not allowed to abuse his siblings or any adults without it being dealt with there and then with VERY clear cut consequences that are uniform and unshakable.

As for your DD punching her brother. Perhaps it might be worth phoning the police, a chat from one might be what she needs, along with the therapy. She is above the age of criminal responsibility, if that was anyone else she'd rightly be charged with assault.

Mimco · 22/04/2018 11:10

Thanks all. Ds is 7. He's ok, his whole cheek is purple and swollen though...

I think I might ring the police station and ask if I can take her in for a good talking to. DP says it could backfire but I really can't think what else to do. There aren't any other Pri leaves I can take away from her apart from her phone as she doesn't really go out with her friends (we live just outside the city where she's at school).

Smeddum · 22/04/2018 11:13

@Mimco glad he’s ok, sounds like the wee soul took quite a punch Sad

I agree about getting the police involved, if only to shock her into realising how serious it is. Sometimes hearing it from Mum and Dad doesn’t sink in, but a uniformed officer sternly saying how awful it is might help.

I know this might sound harsh, but is there something she enjoys doing in the house? Is stopping that an option? Like a favourite programme on tv or something?

Didiusfalco · 22/04/2018 11:16

@mimco. I’m so sorry to hear that about your ds. I would get her to the doctors too. She sounds really troubled.

MarvelleGazelle · 22/04/2018 11:23

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Awoof · 22/04/2018 11:47

I really disagree with getting the police involved. It is too much like passing the buck and they have much much more.pressing matters than telling off naughty kids.

I think it might be having a good look through her internet history etc. I wouldn't be surprised if she is getting a bit of inspiration from somewhere

cestlavielife · 22/04/2018 12:15

She and the whole family need help.
It was over the top reaction.
Tell school
tell gp .
Get camhs involved. It isn't normal behaviour. Sanctions yes but get to the root causes.

School may be best placed to get some immediate talking to (and listening) in place and refer to support . Is there a relative she can stay with?

colditz · 22/04/2018 12:29

Don't get the police involved unless you want her actually arrested, charged and to have a criminal record. there is no pulling back once they have decided to charge her with assault. It will not be up to you any more. It isn't the police's job to tell children off for their parents or to enforce boundaries that should already be enforced by parents. It's the police's job to arrest criminals. You know that saying, "when you have a hammer, everything looks like a nail"? The police have a hammer. Your 13 year old violent daughter will look like a nail.

I would, however, confine her to her room until you've got some support from CAAMHS and she has seen her doctor, because it's clear that everyone smaller than her is a target for her abuse. I would also not be sending her to school tomorrow, because I would be taking her to the doctor as an urgent mental health crisis.

sadie9 · 22/04/2018 12:34

Phoning the police on a 13yr old to 'teach' them a lesson is not the answer. There seems to be a lot of 'teaching of lessons' going on, but may not much direct communicating and sitting with her.
What could be happening is she is feeling out of control so these outbursts to gain control over those she can control (younger kids) and punish her brother is her anger directed at someone else that she can't express.
She is probably really really angry with you, but can't express it in case you leave as well like her Dad did. To her, you may also have appeared to 'abandon' her by finding a new partner so quickly, and she is excluded from that partnership as well.
I think you need to do the opposite of what you are doing. Instead of isolating her when she does bad things, you need to stay with her.
Do not physically isolate her like that. Rather than let her fester in her room take her for a drive with just you, or go for a walk and talk.
How much time do just you and her get to spend together?
Sending people to their room and demanding that they stay there is a form of abuse. If your partner asked you to go and stay in your bedroom until he told you to come out, how would you feel?
She should have a female therapist because it's the relationship with you that is most important to her, and she needs a female figure to work out how to repair the relationships.

Failingat40 · 22/04/2018 13:38

She's clearly over-loaded. Why did he throw the ball at her? You say a game but it must have hurt her too.

I think taking her to the Police station is a really horrible and damaging thing to do.

Can't you take her away for the weekend and spend some quality time with her?

Definitely arrange counselling for her, and make sure she has her own space in the chaotic house where she can relax and have some quiet time away from the younger children.