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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Original poster

I am onit, hear me ROAR (occasionally)

988 replies

onitlikeacarbonnet · 02/04/2018 21:50

Thread no.5 Shock

Hope you all find me or I’ll just be talking to myself.

OP posts:
Original poster
onitlikeacarbonnet · 11/08/2018 10:15

That the sheriff has made him liable for the full cost of the report is unusual.
It’s too much to wish for him to award me costs for the whole court action, isn’t it.
It is in the defences but it never, ever happens.

OP posts:
Stormsurfer · 11/08/2018 10:34

Your DA sounds a delightful young man. No wonder you are so proud of him.

As for LCB and contact- can you just keep answering see court order?

Stormsurfer · 11/08/2018 10:34

Oops DS

MsPavlichenko · 11/08/2018 12:06

I know you don't want a precedent set but be careful here. He may well be drawing you into an unnecessary spat to prove you are unreasonable. I'd tend tô stand back, and run it by lawyers. Maybe even get him to clarify rather than you.

As I said the dynamic of control continues even after separation. He is furious and wanting to reassert. He is a practiced manipulator. Even though you are aware of that it doesn't mean he can't still do so . As I know myself. Again. Freedom Programme.

ASimpleLampoon · 11/08/2018 12:16

Onit, don't get drawn into an argument. keep communication to minimum.

Comply with the order to the letter.

Write a simple "I am complying with the order. If you are in any doubt about the contents, check with your solicitor.

Then step back and don't communicate.

I know it's hard...

Clutterbugsmum · 11/08/2018 13:42

Apparently I am wilfully misrepresenting the intent of the order by complying with it and not honouring the arrangements for the rest of the school holidays. I don't understand how can you be doing some thing wrong when you are following the court order.

Any way I agree with ASimpleLampoon tell him to contact his solicitor if he confused by the court order.

And remember you don't have to join every argument you are invited too, he can only have argument if you decide to answer back. Stick with contact your solicitor to explain court order if your are confused.

Clutterbugsmum · 11/08/2018 13:45

Sorry posted too soon,

Did you agree to any days other then what been put into the court Order.

I would just purely stick with the court order from now on as if you give him an inch he will take a mile, just 'prove' he the worlds greatest dad rather then being the parent he can be.

Mix56 · 11/08/2018 13:47

So, the idiot is now unhappy with his own court order.
That has made my day.
Your reply as PP above, "refer to your court order, ask for clarification with your legal advisor if you don't understand it.

Uncreative · 11/08/2018 14:07

*Apparently I am wilfully misrepresenting the intent of the order by complying with it and not honouring the arrangements for the rest of the school holidays.

I tend to think if the sheriff had issued an order with all the residential contact he asked for, he’d be expecting me to comply the second we got out of the court room.*

I think I am being a little bit dim here but what is the order? I thought the Sherriff had said they weren’t going to make any changes to the pre existing contact arrangements? What were the arrangements for the school holidays and how have they changed, if at all?

Completely agree with your comments about him expecting you to be following the order immediately if it increased his contact with the kids.

Keep referring him to a solicitor as previous posters have suggested.

It is a shame that this is being dragged out until November but I really can’t see anything changing. The Sheriff was clearly not convinced about his crocodile tears in court. They must have seen this a million times before and have the measure of men like him.

MapleLeafRag · 11/08/2018 14:27

That twat would find fault in every single thing that you do.

He’s having a little temper tantrum as it didn’t go his way.

Well diddums!

MapleLeafRag · 11/08/2018 14:32

“Please refer to court order and seek clarification from your solicitor if needed.”

Original poster
onitlikeacarbonnet · 11/08/2018 15:54

I’ve already sent him a highlighted screenshot of the order.
And basically repeatedly said that I am complying with it.

His accusation that I’ve dishonoured our agreement is about to be met with the reply, I have changed nothing. The court order has changed everything.

He needs to recognise at some point that HE DID THIS TO HIMSELF.
It’s just another example of his failure to see anything from anyone else’s perspective. He cannot see consequences because he doesn’t expect things to go any way other than what he predicts. And he certainly can’t understand why anyone (me) would disagree with him.
And if they (I) do, they are (I am) unreasonable or bitter or spiteful or combative or disrespectful or whatever accusation he hopes will provoke a reaction.

Well fuck him!
I will reply to his last diatribe with 3 lines and from then on out I will reply with the copy of the court order only.

OP posts:
Original poster
onitlikeacarbonnet · 11/08/2018 15:55

Sorry xposted.
Thought I’d posted earlier and missed a few Blush

OP posts:
ASimpleLampoon · 11/08/2018 16:24

If you've alread replied with the court order, no need to keep replying. He's had his answer and as long as you respond you are feeding him. He is provoking you into a response because that is the only control he has. Don't let him have it.

Don't respond. There is nothing else to say.

MsPavlichenko · 11/08/2018 17:17

Yes. Don't keep responding. And do keep your lawyer in loop.

MsPavlichenko · 11/08/2018 17:23

You are being wound up by him. Even if only on here so try to detach. Do the DC know about changes, as in were they expecting to be with him and now wont? Because that is going to be problematic if he decides to make it an issue with them and/ or the court report.

You are better to play the long game. And everything you say about him is correct. And is edifying that the Sheriff agrees. But he will never see this. So is wasted time thinking about him.

Mix56 · 11/08/2018 21:28

if they (I) do, they are (I am) unreasonable or bitter or spiteful or combative or disrespectful or whatever accusation he hopes will provoke a reaction.

and so ?, who cares ?

ToadsforJustice · 11/08/2018 23:00

Have I got this right - the court order hasn't changed. He is accusing you of breaking the court order. You are adhering to the court order.

Is this a new form of weird gas-lighting? You know the order hasn't changed, he's saying it has and you are not complying. Does he think that if he keeps saying you have ignored the order that you will somehow give in and send the DC to him for contact on your contact days - therefore breaking the terms of the original order?

Original poster
onitlikeacarbonnet · 12/08/2018 01:23

Toads

The court order is new. Previously (for 2 years) we had an informal agreement. The court order has formalised that exact schedule.
Prior to the hearing on Monday, there was a summer holiday schedule with 2 weeks still to go, which we had negotiated, based around the existing schedule but with a couple of additional days and another non residential contact that he had said he would forego.

I have learned (am learning) that if I offer anything, it is met with demands for much more. I am pleased the sheriffs order agrees with me however, even if their dad had been awarded more, I would still comply because I don’t want to breach an order made in court by a sheriff who believes it was the best for my dc.

The court issued the order. It is pretty concise. It states when residential contact and non residential contact should take place. No mention of term time only or a start date.
By complying he will lose 2 additional days and pick up one normal non residential he had requested to drop.

Now, it may be pedantic of me but, nevertheless, I believe a court order supersedes any previously agreed informal arrangement. Otherwise what is the point of a court order?

I want to comply. Because if I don’t, he will use it as a reason to negotiate on every little thing for evermore.
He asked the court to make an order because he thought I wasn’t putting the dcs interests first. That it would be better for the order to be made than not. To have a formal agreement.
But, because it went against him (at least for now), he is saying I should honour what we informally agreed. That that was better for the dc and that the order doesn’t come into effect immediately but only when our informal summer schedule ends.
Well fucking tough shit!
The order was issued the day before his birthday. We had informally agreed to his having the dc overnight. I let this go ahead but sent an email after the dc had gone for that overnight, saying the order had been issued and I’d be complying as of the next day when the dc would come home.

And he’s spat his dummy out.
I am “disruptive”, “reneging” (which he sent a link to the definition of because I’m so thick I couldn’t possible know what the word meant), “misrepresenting”, “avoiding”, “dishonourable”, unreasonable”, “unjustifiable”. These are words from the 6 emails he has sent on this issue in 2 days.

I have not replied. I think I will forward them to my lawyer on Monday and ask him to deal with it. I’m nearly done with this arsehole.

OP posts:
MsPavlichenko · 12/08/2018 01:38

Yes. Don't reply. Send it to your lawyer. And don't let him back into your head.

Uncreative · 12/08/2018 02:11

He is an asshole.

Absolutely, a new court order trumps the old informal arrangement.

May I suggest you do not deviate a millimetre from the court order in future? Give him an inch, and he’ll take a mile.

Like Mrs P, I think you should get your lawyer to respond to his email to a) explain the court order will be followed and b) make a formal request for him to stop harassing you.

The many emails and language used do constitute harassment. Get that formally noted by your solicitors in a communication to him. Do it now as you may need evidence of the ongoing harassment at a later date. The only thing better than documenting this behaviour is to have a legal authority (police or lawyer) do the documenting for you.

Uncreative · 12/08/2018 02:13

Sorry, MsP, I made you a Mrs by accident instead.

Uncreative · 12/08/2018 02:19

Oh, and tell you solicitor how the emails make you feel (bullied, browbeaten, badgered). He may use those words or similar phrases either in the letter to LCB or subsequent court appearances.

Mix56 · 12/08/2018 08:34

I'm sure the sheriff would be interested to hear, that immediately after his court order, LCB is bombarding you with insults as he doesn't want to comply.
hahaha, this is great ! Have a good Sunday, hope he is frothing at the mouth .

mysurveysays · 12/08/2018 09:36

He pushed for this and now it hasn't gone his way he's resorting to an actual tantrum! What a surprise it must have been for him to learn that he isn't actually always right!
Absolutely stick to the court order, you've always known what's best for your kids and this just backs you up!