Having doubts about my relationship - can you help talk me through it?

[ChooChooLaverne]

I just need to put my thoughts down as my head is in a spin and I'm not sure if it's me or DP. I'm sorry but it's quite long.

I met DP 5 years ago and we're meant to be getting married in the summer. He's not speaking to me today. Again. I have told him that I don't like it when he sulks, I hate going to sleep on an argument and like to try and talk to resolve any problems - even if we can't agree - I don't see why we can't be kind to each other.

This time he's sulking because he asked me if I knew how to use the heater last night when I was about to start cooking and I said 'I know' but he didn't listen and carried on telling me how it worked (it's my heater by the way). Now admittedly I don't understand the inner workings of the heater (and nor do I care) but I do know that it has a dial to turn the temperature up and down which is why I again said 'I know'. He got angry with me as he didn't think I was listening to his explanation and he didn't like me saying 'I know' more than once when I obviously didn't know. (Sorry, I do know how tedious this is)

I tried to get him to lighten up and gave him a hug and apologised for interrupting him but I said I didn't think it was important enough to have an argument over and could we just make up and move on. He said it was important to him and went off and lay on our bed. I was trying to make dinner at this point and was about to go and say goodnight to my DS so I left him to it and hoped he'd calm down and we could carry on with our evening.

I tried chatting normally when we had dinner but he wouldn't look at me and gave me monosyllabic responses when I said anything so we spent the rest of the meal like a pair of Carmelite nuns. He went to bed early and when I went to bed later he didn't speak to me, kiss me goodnight or put his arm round me - like he does every night. He got up early for work this morning, didn't kiss me when he got up - like he does every morning - and came and said goodbye in a half-hearted voice before he left.

I haven't heard from him today and I normally get a couple of texts from his throughout the day.

I am normally the one to apologise and cajole/talk to him until he comes out of a sulk but I don't have the oomph to bother today and I haven't sent him a message either.

I feel like I seem to upset him without meaning to and I seem to find myself apologising a lot. I get the impression he sees himself as a victim but I really don't believe I'm to blame for everything. He can take offence over the slightest thing but can sometimes talk to me in a fairly aggressive tone of voice and doesn't seem to understand why I would find that upsetting.

However, most of the time he is absolutely lovely to me and very thoughtful. He has been very patient in developing a relationship with my DS who was very jealous of our relationship in the early days. But he does also seem to take offence at my DS's behaviour sometimes as though if he doesn't behave impeccably it's a personal slight to him.

When things are good between us I feel like we have a great relationship but today it's like all I can remember are the times that he's not spoken to me or has spoken to me in an unpleasant way and I'm not sure what to do. Ironically, there are a couple of wedding related things that I'm meant to be sorting out today but at the moment the thought of spending the rest of my life being given the cold shoulder from time to time by my husband fills me with dread.

Thank you if you've read this far. Is there anything I can do to resolve things? I'd appreciate any thoughts.

Offred is 100% right.Change is incredibly difficult for him as his brain is wired to hyper sensitivity so to him it feels rational.His feelings are facts.DBT is seen as helpful however he has to accept the need for change and work incredibly hard.

Each time he does this he breaks the emotional connection between you two and its signals the beginning of the end.
Perhaps if you give an ultimatum he might be motivated enough but be aware change is very difficult as its probadly on an unconscious level for him and core to his way of functioning.

Does he ever say ‘sorry, I was completely out of order’?

Are you allowed to be upset or unreasonable?

When you say he takes your feelings into account does he sometimes defer to your feelings? Does he accept that you are able to have different feelings to him or does he only take into account your feelings when they are the same/similar to his or when it is about something that is not important to him?

Dixie thank you for a different perspective. I have tried telling him how I feel about his sulking before though and that I believed we should resolve things and not go to bed on an argument. He didn't really give me any feedback about what I was saying or truly engage in the conversation. So it's like I never said it.

I would be more than happy to go to marriage preparation if I believed it would help. But I'm not sure he really cares about my feelings otherwise he wouldn't be sulking with me again.

I've realised over the last few years that I can have an instinct to sulk and react too over the top to stupid things. It took a lot for me to realise that's what I was doing and while I still do it occasionally (usually when I'm hormonal or caught off guard with something) I'm much much better now.
I think if you are 'wired' that way or that's the kind of reaction you saw from your own parents growing up that it's easy to think it's normal and it's also really really REALLY hard to snap out of it once you've started sulking. Which sounds ridiculous but it's true.
What helped me was finally admitting I do that and trying to catch myself early in the 'disagreement' and making a conscious decision in that moment to talk it through and not flounce off (even though that's my gut instinct 😳)

God I sound awful! I just can see how he's probably got to this point and wanted to give you a perspective from maybe his side?

I do wonder whether me always needing to make everything ok is my issue.

Re that I suspect it’s not so much always needing to make everything ok that is so much the issue but that maybe the fact you have been placating him and trying to smooth things over when he has these irrational and childish sulks has inadvertently been reinforcing for him that this is the way to deal with things.

Offred He does sometimes say sorry. Not about the sulking though. But I don't think he's ever said he was completely out of order. I don't think he thinks he is.

If I bring up something that I'm unhappy about he can take my feelings into account. I am allowed to be upset and unreasonable. And he has sometimes made changes about things that I've raised (I don't do it very often) so he is able to listen to me and change how he behaves. In some things.

Hermione The statement his feelings are facts makes a lot of sense to me.

I mean he clearly wants you to make it ok. What needs to happen is you resolving conflicts as adults who are equal partners (what you seem to want), he doesn’t seem to want that, he seems to want to sulk and have you make it ok for him.

You can't sort it out, OP, because you're not the one doing it. He's learned from his mother's knee that this is the way to deal with problems. It's also the way to behave when you feel a bit fed up and want to make the other person feel even worse, even though they haven't done anything.

If you intend to stay with him, perhaps say, "Don't you feel a bit pathetic lying on the bed sighing like that? You always say your mum is really irritating when she does it and now you're doing it."

Personally I wouldn't stay with someone who made me feel so uncomfortable in my own home.

PS he is probadly drawn to you because you are capable of empathy. However it will have a high emotional and physical cost to you (as I am finding out).

Are his apologies genuine (e.g. ‘I was wrong sorry’) or backhanded (e.g. ‘sorry but I was/but you did’)?

I would love to be able to resolve conflicts as adults. And to laugh together about how ridiculous any kind of flouncing over a bloody heater is. But when he's like this he's so aggrieved that he completely loses his sense of humour. I don't see why I should too.

And I don't want to feel uncomfortable - or much more importantly for DS - to feel uncomfortable in our own home.

I don't know whether issuing an ultimatum is worthwhile or whether this might just be the last straw for me.

IMO ultimatums are pointless. Sometimes people will agree to do the thing demanded on pain of punishment but actually there’s not much chance of it working out well, especially if it involves changing long standing behavioural issues/MH issues, because they aren’t doing it for themselves but for you.

If you don't want this to be your life then you shouldn't marry him

Offred his apologies are sometimes of the Blue Peter variety with no actual responsibility for his behaviour (I'm sorry that you were sad) and sometimes of the 'but you did' variety. Sometimes though he can genuinely apologise but never about any incident that has resulted in a sulk or about a sulk as far as I can remember.

I don't want this to be my life.

There's your answer then unfortunately

I don't think he's going to change this behaviour when he's been doing it for 5 years with you and probably his whole life.

I don’t think he will change it if he doesn’t see any problem with it.

If you ave a history of other abusive relationships and thought this one was a winner, then the likelihood is that he is a more diluted version of your previous partners. It is abuse, it's just mild but who cares? You and your DS still deserve better. I absolutely would not marry this man. He won't change, he won't suddenly 'understand', it will just be more of this. Honestly OP, there are so many red flags in your posts. The one about taking it as a persona affront when your DS isn't well behaved is vying for first place along with talking aggressively to you. Come on love, you know deep down this is not right.

I got to a point with h where I just felt if me being seriously miserable wasn’t enough for him to make a small change or work with me to make things better then I didn’t want him. Telling him ‘stop this or I will leave’ and him actually doing it would have made me feel worse because it would just be him selfishly not wanting me to leave him.

ChooChoo

If you have never enrolled on the Freedom Programme run by Womens Aid then I suggest you contact them and do this in person asap. If you've had previous abusive relationships then your boundaries anyway have been messed with. These same boundaries need reworking. What you are in now is really a continuation of those previous abusive relationships; the type of abuse may be different but the end result is the same.

The only acceptable level of abuse in a relationship is NONE.

If you are steadfast in your conviction that you do not want this to be your life then make it so. Such men like you describe as well never apologise nor accept any responsibility for their actions.

If you don't want this life then you need to tackle it together or separate!
It's that simple.

My ExH (not an Ex for stonewalling) when we first got together did this once.
He ignored me. No reasoning. No idea what I'd done.
When he was at work, I moved all my stuff out and went back to my mum and dad.
He came round and was utterly shocked at what I'd done and couldn't understand it at all.
I told him there was no way on this earth that I was going to be ignored.
His behaviour was like a toddler and we are grown ups.
We talked and found that he'd learnt it from his mother.
So we had a chat. I made it clear if it happened again that I would be gone for good. That was his one and only chance.
That we were grown ups and we could discuss things.
We then compromise or agree to disagree.
It actually never happened again and I spent 15 years with him.
So people can change.

Would he agree to couples counselling?
Although technically, what he is doing is abuse and you should never have counselling with an abuser, this seems like something you could talk through with an outsider to get resolved??
Maybe??? Clutching at straws!!????

Yes, I get what you mean re the ultimatum. I might try one last ditch attempt to talk to him and explain how his behaviour makes me feel to see if there is any flicker of this being anything along the lines of what Dixey said or if he can admit to being sorry for sulking and really wanting to change without me telling him to. But I'm not sure there's much point.

Rhubarb thank you - I feel like I've managed to rationally shut down my inner voice which is definitely louder today.

Atilla I did the Freedom Programme online several years ago and did find it helpful. I feel like actually seeing a counsellor who understands abuse might be more helpful now.

hellsbells he probably would agree to couples counselling. He has had counselling on his own before I met him. You're right though, if it is abuse it wouldn't be a good idea.

Lordy, he sounds like my ex who was a massive flouncer and sulker. It gets very draining living with a man baby.

If the relationship is like this now, then think hard what it will be like down the line. It's best to get out of things now before you are married and you then have the added hassle of divorce etc.

If you are not 100% this is the end of the line, then maybe have a break and time apart. If he has his own house then he can toddle off back there out of the way. Give yourself some space to gather your thoughts.

Do not talk to him choochoo about the effects his behaviours have on you, it will be a waste of time and effort. This man is really a carbon copy of his mother. You probably did similar before with an ex and he did not listen then either. These people have no empathy with others at all.

No to joint counselling either, no decent counsellor worth their salt would ever see the two of you in the same room because of his emotional abuse. This sulking behaviour of his has been learnt from his mother, she has not changed an iota in the intervening years and nor has this individual.

He has not listened to you before now so what is different this time around?. Nothing.