Will he ever propose?

[coffeelover1]

I have been with my DP for 6 years now and we have been living together for the last 5 years. He is 28 and I am 26. We have no children and I am happy. Everything was going well until DP asked if I wanted to have children last year. I told him that I did but not until I was married. Very quickly after establishing this, DP started insisting that we look at rings together and I went along with this. It has been about a year since he wanted me to look at rings together and we have been looking at rings for the last few months. I am getting a bit fed up of looking at rings now (by the way, every time we do look at rings I always find rings that I like and they are not massively expensive). I am now wondering if he intends to propose or if I am being strung along (this has been going on for just over a year). I never intended to get married and he is the one who has put all this in my head, yet doesn’t appear to be acting.

If anyone has any advice I would welcome it.

coffee your last post reminds me of a friend of mine - she wanted things checked off and marriage was on her list, as well as babies just before 30 after getting to x point in her career.

Are you really sure he's the one for you? I did get married young, but not because i wanted to get on with anything, but because i knew my DH was the person i wanted forever. In fact it was a surprise we got married in our 20s, nothing I set out to do, it made sense at the time.

Just a caution as very plan focused people can sometimes lose sight of the fundamentals.

FWIW - his behaviour sounds controlling rather than romantic to me, but then I'm an old cynic :)

So he earns twice as much as you, but pays the same into joint expenses? Leaving him with considerably more spending money. How would he see his money if you were on mat leave? Would he pay for everything, including towards a pension for you? Would he pay twice as much of the cost of childcare, the mortgage etc, so that you have better equality in your spending? Would he view all money as joint money, with each of you taking what you need for expenses?

Sorry, but even if it's subconscious, I think that he's worrying about maybe having to split money evenly with you if you get married, whereas right now you're paying disproportionately more towards living together.

Is it engagement rings or wedding rings you've been looking at?

Because, as long as you like the engagement ring surely that's a all you need.

The wedding rings come later and it's just a gold or silver band or silver.

Anyway, stick to your guns. No house purchase or children without marriage.

Things have gone downhill since I last posted

We had a talk last night about everything and he has confessed that he does not believe in marriage and hoped that the gesture of taking me ring shopping and eventually buying me one would suffice

He is happy to buy me a ring but does not want to formally marry me and really wants us to buy a house together and have children. I am so angry right now and feel like I have been taken for a complete fool. Who does that? Why waste so much time. At least I know now so I do not have to waste more time. I thought I would be upset but I am just so angry right now about everything. I am sure sadness will come later.

I have told him that I am going to start looking for a place to rent and don't want to continue this relationship. He told me that I was emotionally blackmailing him into marriage which is not fair.

Today I have been bombarded my phone calls (I have not answered them as I am at work) and text messages saying how sorry he is and how he wants to go back to "the way things were". I cannot see any point past this and he cannot take back what he said. Why do this to someone you supposedly love. Tonight is going to be horrible but I am going to pack some things and stay at my mum's this weekend to get away from him for a bit and clear my head.

Thanks for your support everyone. I cannot believe this is real!

Sorry to read this OP but at least you now know where you stand. You're not blackmailing him at all!

If a man wants to marry you, he will ask you. Its that simple!

Ask yourself if you were doing the asking, would you go shopping 25 times??

Oh dear. Sorry he turned into a frog for you.

Thank you. I did begin to wonder if I am emotionally blackmailing him but then remind myself that I have been honest with him by saying that I don't want to commit to jointly buying a house and having children without being married.

You have been his "she will do for now" woman sadly.

Ignore his phone calls.

I would go to your mother's now and stay gone from his life. This relationship is well and truly over because it cannot go back to how it was. He also seems controlling over his money and regards that as his solely. I also think the power and control imbalance in this relationship would have become even more pronounced if you had become pregnant by him and went on maternity leave.

It sounds like you've made up your mind, but if you want to try and find a middle path, try asking him how he expects things to work if you do buy a house & have kids. Will he give up work to raise the kids, with the house in your name only? I bet not, but that he would be happy to have it the other way around.

I'm sorry, this must be so painful for you. There are far too many men who 'don't believe' in marriage, but happily buy a house & have children which leaves the woman incredibly vulnerable. If he loves you, but just doesn't want marriage, he could look into ways to financially protect you & support you no matter what. But I have a horrible feeling that he won't want to commit to that. He wants the nice bits without offering the commitment and support that having children should really include.

I'm sorry this happened to your. My partner told me early on he does not believe in marriage so I always knew where I stood. We are in our 40s though and neither of us want children. Maybe that is why I am not overly bothered.

What he did was cowardly and selfish. You never know, faced with the reality of losing you, he may rethink his values and what he wants.

I hope you will be ok tonight. X

I am sorry OP but it's definitely for the best. You deserve far better than that lying spineless little twat. Fancy stringing you along for so long! What an absolute insult. Onwards and upwards. You'll be able to find a good man without a bad one in the way.

Sorry to hear this - at least you know what is really going on, though

There's another thread running at the moment where the OP wants to be married, but her DP is refusing to consider it despite them having a house and baby together

Ah, I was going to post to say that he clearly thinks you being able to say to people that "We are looking at rings" is basically the same as "We're engaged" or "We're getting married" and would do as a nice placeholder until you "gave in". Sorry this turned out to be the case OP.

Read from the beginning; your update was no surprise at all.

The bullshitting aside, he's rather dismissive of you isn't he?! What are you, a toddler? He thought that buying you a ring and kind of pretending to be married would keep little woman happy?! Right-o.

Bottom line: he would like a wifey and creature comforts and children and all that jazz but he'd also like to make damn sure his assets stay his and that he has the option of upping and leaving any time he likes leaving you with the kids to feed and no way of claiming on his pension. That's basically what 'not believing in marriage' means - when you want to basically live your life as if you ARE married, but to duck out of the legal side.

He's a twat and you are well rid, sadly.

And no, being clear about what you want and sticking to it when someone tries to bully and harrass you into accepting what THEY want instead isn't 'blackmailing'.

Having children without marriage is a fool's game for a woman, sadly.

Stick to it - you're smart.

What a wanker. Lucky escape. Thankfully you're still very young, plenty of time to find a good man (there are a lot more around than MN might sometimes make you think otherwise).

Brave decision OP! stick to your guns. It was non-negotiable for me too. I cant believe he thought "pretending to look at rings" is anything but insulting. he has shown his true colours.

No, you're not emotionally blackmailing him, you are telling him what you are going to do and doing it. There's no 'threat' there. There's also no compromise - either you get married or you don't.
It would be one thing if he didn't want to have commitment via a house/children but he's not saying that either, so I can't really understand it other than he wants all of his money protected from you.

Well done on sticking to what you believe in, you will be saving years of heartache down the line

Love what kickass says about will he stay at home with the kids while you work and have the house in your name - EVERYONE SHOULD ASK THIS!!

What he has admitted to is quite cruel. Taking you shopping 25 times just to go along with the charade when he had no intention of buying a ring, thinking that would keep you happy. At least you have an explanation because it was very weird.

Wow the 25 times shopping is so Low. Men always want "to go back to normal" but they can't, the whole landscape has changed. I'm glad you are angry - that's good, as is going to your mum's. You have taken back control and shown great strength. It is sad and you will need to grieve - wishing you all the best.

I have just had another message saying that if I really loved him marriage would not matter and I would have his children and "build a life with him". I have not responded to any of them, should I just leave them? I am starting to feel guilty after reading that message but at the same time why should I have to put myself in a vulnerable situation especially after what my mum went through (which he knows about).

We get home at different times so I am hoping that I will be able to get a bag packed and leave before he gets home.

I just can't believe he is like this.

I'm sorry things have turned out this way, OP. Good for you for addressing it directly, though, I can only imagine how long this could have dragged on!

I don't think you should reply to those texts. At minimum because texting is not usually a productive way to have a serious conversation. His argument makes no sense, you could equally say that if he really loved you, he'd make the official legal commitment to you of marriage before having kids.

Who's emotionally blackmailing who now?! "If you loved me you would do xy and z" what an arse hole. And its having the desired effect because now youre feeling bad.
And where does that end? You could say the exact same thing to him! "If you loved me then you'd marry me" he's trying to emotionally manipulate you!

If I were you I'd stick to my guns. You were very open and honest about the marriage thing, he chose to string you along knowing he had absolutely no intention of that ever happening.

Well you could equally counter with if you really loved me that much you would marry me. Why is he so against marriage? Is it a money/asset control thing, hates state interference in his life, outmoded construct etc?

Already at present moneywise he is on the up - he earns more but you split the bills etc. A lot of couples do this in proportion to salary as they argue it is fairer or the better paid partner pays a greater bulk of holidays/outings etc. Is he generous? I've been with my DP for 30 years but if I had my time again I would insist on marriage when DC were coming into the equation.

He's using emotional blackmail. You are each completely entitled to want what you want in this matter. The fact that you're both so far apart on is means that it's a dealbreaker. If there were a middle ground (a financial agreement to protect each of you if you have kids etc) then you could possibly sit and discuss it, but it sounds like neither of you want that option.

What you're asking for is security and support, he's asking to make you vulnerable in order to provide the life he wants. Those are very different starting points. He's taking, you just want support.

Whether to try to talk to him, see if he'd agree to legal & financial plans, is up to you. But he hasn't exactly gone out of his way to reassure you.

I think some time alone to think things through, then see if he is willing to discuss compromise, is a good idea. If he keeps going though with the emotional blackmail & not leaving you alone, that really tells you all you need to know about how much respect he has for you.