Onits owning it! Or at least has an agreement in principle for a mortgage on it ;-)

[onitlikeacarbonnet]

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/relationships/2787862-Onits-still-on-it-Thread-3

This is thread 4

Almost exactly a year since my opening post on thread 1.

Things are very different for me now.
Mostly better.
My mental health is suffering now and I'm off work while I try new antidepressants which are fucking with my already fucked up sleep.
I think a year of chronic sleep deprivation has ruined my ability to function normally.

LCB is an annoyance at best and a bullying, arrogant arse most of the rest of the time.

I am a very different woman to the one who posted at 2am a year and a few days ago.

My dc are doing ok. This isn't the life I wanted for them. I didn't want to be a single parent. On benefits. In a shitty ex council house.
But, they seem happy.
Dd's birthday today. We had a party at homes and it was enjoyed by everyone, I think.
I remember last year being fucking devastated and, having started rereading my original thread, completely brain dead, because I don't remember much.
Tomorrow is Father's Day and the anniversary of telling the dc their dad was leaving.
It's so difficult looking back on it all but it also helps me see how far I've come.

But more importantly, my dc seem largely unaffected. I know it's early days and I'm under no illusions it won't bite me in the ass someday but...

I have a boyfriend (if a man over 50 can be described that way).
It's not perfect. I'm not sure how I feel about him. I like him a lot. The sex is amazing. We're compatible in lots of ways but I find I'm holding back. He doesn't know the Hal for of what LCB has put me through. And I know his ex broke his heart.
We have issues with distance and incompatible schedules not to mention that he's a rebound guy.

Ah! fuck it! I'm happy! Content even. But I still scare myself thinking about what I had in my house and bed.

Take it a day at a time, a week or month at a time. It's lovely that you've fallen for a decent man. Trust yourself. But just because you love each other, doesn't mean anything has to change just now. Carry on as you have been. Enjoy it and try not to worry about it.

I'm literally quaking at the thought of starting that conversation. Actually, starting any deep and meaningful.

Thanks agatha. I need to bear this in mind.
You're right, nothing has to change just yet. I'll see how things go over the next few weeks of holidays. I'll try to ask a few scary (for me) questions. Assess his reaction. If he seems guarded, I suppose I need to probe a bit more.
And I also need to open up. If I tell him I've got these feelings, what's the worst that could happen? He doesn't.

This is where I'm so immature. I was with LCB for 20 years. This is my next longest relationship. I don't know how to do it. I didn't do it when I was a teenager. I've never done this at all. I fell in love with LCB when I laid eyes on him and he held all the cards.
I've never had a normal relationship with a man. I feel so inexperienced. This was supposed to be a learning process for me. I wasn't supposed to get involved.

I really feel you need to be yourself, I do,'t know how to explain myself properly...... I guess I mean, be as you would be with US, open, honest, listen & apraise... You can say just that
^"I was with LCB for 20 years. This is my next longest relationship. I don't know how to do it. I didn't do it when I was a teenager. I've never done this at all. I fell in love with LCB when I laid eyes on him and he held all the cards.
I've never had a normal relationship with a man. I feel so inexperienced. This was supposed to be a learning process for me. I wasn't supposed to get involved."^

I get what you mean mix
It's not that I'm being false, I don't know how to describe it either. I'm me with him but I'm making assumptions that the more probing questions I might want answers to, might be uncomfortable for him so I don't ask.
I hadn't realised that I've done this for years. With LCB because he would shut me down, and with friends, because I was worried they'd not like me.

But why can't I say what I've said here. That's the truth. And if it's going to be a problem then it's best to get it over with.
If he told me he was scared of getting hurt, I'd not run away. Why am I assuming he will.

I'm worried about asking a question that I don't already know the answer to.
He asked me if I love him. That's a pretty big fucking question. And I just stayed silent.
If I'd asked him and he did that, even if I wasn't there yet, I'd be upset by that response. No response.

There's not much I can do now. I'm on holiday. I won't see him for at least a week, possibly a couple of weeks. I'm not doing anything by text or on the phone.

There are 2 essential problems, one is that you have been groomed "to please" so daring to ask personal questions is hard for you.
& second is that you don't want to open up incase you get hurt more/again
but if You "opening up" scares him, or he sees you as dithering, or not knowing exactly how you feel puts him off, it's not going to work long haul anyway, so best he run now.
If you have learned anything from your experience with LCB, it is that you absolutely must not crush your thoughts & feelings for anyone.
this does not mean you have to be like a bull in a china shop, other people's feelings must be considered, you are still a "carer", but in the end you have to put yourself first.

What mix said...
Try not to sweat it onit-he knows you have been badly hurt before-and he seems from what you've said, to be empathetic to that and Intelligent enough to work out why you might be reticent.

nigel and mix say it so well. It is easy to tell you to just go with the flow and not overthink it, but that is not who you are. But it comes across to me that who you are (on here) is an honest, open, brace and deeply caring person. Tell him your thoughts, share your story, ask him the questions and see where that takes you...

*brave!!!

Do you know if he is looking for more than he gets right now? a friend, a confidant, some fun & a shag ?
He is divorced I believe, does he have any DC ? if not, did he ever want any? Can ask about his aspirations without necessarily it being about you.
^"How did you imagine your life as an adult?, How do you feel about your children/ did you want any/are you still hurting post separation ?
You can say for you, it all started out as a bit of fun, & you never ever imagined that you would hook up, that anyone would even want you, that you 2 have actually seemed to hit it off. It's a massive surprise & you don't know how to react. It seems so lovely, too good to be true."^

I'm on my way home from our holiday. Had a lovely week away from real life.
Dc have had a wonderful time and I've enjoyed having some space to think.

To answer questions, he has 1 grown up dd and 2 teenage dc who he sees at least eow.

I'm seeing him tomorrow. My dc are going to LCBs and he's had his dc all week and they go home to their mum.
I'm going to attempt to have a more serious conversation. If hes only looking for what we have now, I'm not sure I should keep seeing him. I think I'll just become more attached and always want more.

It's now 8pm and in other news, dc asked to see daddy today instead of waiting till tomorrow. I said we'd call and they could ask.
He says great. He'll pick them up when we get home.
He takes them about 15 minutes after we get home. As I'm unpacking food and snacks, I find 2 cakes the dc had picked yesterday that we were supposed to eat today. They won't keep so I text LCB to ask if the dc want them I'll drop them round.
He replied that he'll pick them up in 5 minutes as they're going to his mums.
45 minutes away. In the direction we've just came from. In fact, we drove past within 2 minutes of her house.
I couldn't help myself and texted back to say i could've dropped them off. And I get a reply saying he only arranged it this afternoon and we'd have been past before he knew.

No explanation as to why he said he'd take the dc tonight when he obviously had plans.
I mean am I being unreasonable? I can't begin to imagine how my ds is feeling.
He was crying this morning about missing his daddy and wanting to see him.
I'm furious and gutted that LCB thinks this is ok whilst arguing that he wants more time.
I understand he had can have plans on a night he wasn't supposed to have them but why not just say that to them?

Because he is a selfish prick. Because he thinks that this will prove some sort of point to you. Because he thinks that this is a sign of you pandering to him. Because he knew you would find out, and it will wind you up, and so he's in your head again.

From now on I wouldn't change arrangements barring an emergency. Flexibility can work where there is mutual respect, and a genuine desire to put DC first. That isn't the case with him. Possibly things will change for the better, but that's some way off.

You probably felt relaxed after holiday, more generous than usual to him, wanted to please the DC. Not to mention some time to yourself. All reasonable. But he is not unfortunately. Much better for DC, and you to stick to agreements at moment.

I only suggested it because ds was teary about missing daddy this morning.

Yet another lesson learned I guess.

And yes I was obviously off guard because I even spoke to the asshat when he came to pick them up. Just to hand over some medicine for ds but still. I'm just gutted for ds. Dd came in for the cakes and seemed ok but I'm betting that ds wasn't happy.

I wonder what was going to happen with his plans when he was originally collecting them first thing tomorrow.
Knobend

It is shit . He is a shit. You on the other hand, are an amazing woman, and a wonderful parent. It's normal to assume the best, and want that for your DC. Not to mention years of control/abuse by him. As you say, another harsh lesson learned. But you'll be there for your DC (sadly a lesson for them too).

Whatever the outcome of your conversation tomorrow, do make sure you have a really good time!

I did it. He asked me again if I loved him and I said yes. He asked me to say it so I did.
I cried (again). Not sobbing but proper tears and snot
He said he understands that I'm scared, the distance, the kids, our jobs.
That he hopes it works out. He doesn't want to hurt me. He wants to take care of me.
Then he said how special I am to him and that he was falling in love with me too.

A while later he said the words too.

If I trust my instincts, I'm sure it's true. There was a change in the way we were kissing; when we met, he looked at me with lust in his eyes. I have been looked at like that before.
How he looks at me now is not something I recognise. I guess that might be love.

I'm not sure what this means. I'm hoping things won't change too much. I'm not ready for more change.

YAY, you seem to both feel the same, theres no hurry, just enjoy it....

Aww- what a great update! Well done for being so brave. Try to enjoy!

Then he said how special I am to him and that he was falling in love with me too

A while later he said the words too

Onit, why did you have to say it first and why did he say that he was falling in love with you before saying he loved you a short while later?

Why did he only say it after you had?

Why should he have said it first? Somebody has too, and in fact asking someone to do so first can be a way of confirming that your own feelings are reciprocated.

Given what the relationship has been so far, I genuinely see no advantage to game playing for either of them. No guarantees of course, but why would he be playing her? What's in it for him?

Jolly good!
How was yer holiday?

What's in it for him?

Pressure was put on Onit to say what she felt about the bloke. It caused her distress and she posted about it here.

The kind thing for him to have done would have been to say I love you and then let Onit take it from there. Instead he put pressure on her to say how she felt and its only when she said she loved him that he said, I think Im falling in love with you before saying a while later that he loved her. He must have felt great to have Onit standing there crying whilst she said she loved him and all the while he just thought he was falling in love with her. Was it her tears that made him love her? Is that what he likes?

Onit spent many years being put under pressure by someone to comply, to be submissive, and there's an element of it with this bloke as well.

I understand what you mean rhubarb and your concern is appreciated but I think it's more like his insecurities rather than a need for me to comply. My counsellor floated the same concern. Obviously your thoughts have also crossed my mind but I have my gut to go by and, although it scares me, I have to trust it.
And my tears were distress but in a "this is a difficult situation to be falling in love in" much more than "I feel pressured to tell him when I'm not ready". He has asked before but hasn't pushed it when I've refused to answer. I agree with MrsPav that he was trying to reassure me that it was safe for me to admit it and he wasn't going to laugh or run away.
He certainly didn't give the impression he enjoyed my distress. He held me and comforted me and reassure me that I was safe.

Our holiday was fab! The kids had a ball and my friend and I had plenty of time to relax too.

In other news, I've decided to adopt a cat. A friend of my cousin needs to rehome her beautiful cat. Went to see her yesterday, told the dc last night and going to pick her up on Thursday. We're all very excited!

On it - you've been so brave. The words are out there, and you've shown your courage and honesty. It sounds like he understands where you are.
You have put your feelings on the line, no misunderstandings, no game playing. Now watch how he reciprocates. I hope it runs smoothly, but slowly for you, so you have time to adjust, and build trust.

Wonderful news about the cat, the DC will be overjoyed! Could you consider adding a kitten into the mix, so she has a companion? I also wonder if the DC will want to be around home more, with their new pet? Happy times ahead, bet your home is full of fun & laughter very soon!

Cat is deffo a good idea. We got our dog to cheer us up last year.Best thing we ever did.in fact we just got a second one to cheer us up some more!

Love your logic nigel
Here's my fur baby