Husband has ended it.

[itsovernow1]

Hi
New user looking for advice.

Short story - We have been married 20 yrs, 2 kids 16 and 19. 16 yr old is at college and 19 yr old is away at Uni (1st yr). We have a 4 yr old dog.

Never been the best marriage, but I thought we were ticking away. Wrong! OH has apparently been thinking for some time he wants out and has made that decision. Btw it's probably a 50/50 'blame' for this. I'm not the easiest person to live with, as I have just been disagnosied with depression probably going back to PND with DS.

He emailed me (we do things that way, not healthy, I know) 4 weeks ago saying he wants out. I rang him to talk and he basically said he's had enough, he's detached and would rather live on his own. I said I think we can work through things and can talk it out. He said we need to talk and that was that. He picked our son up from the station on his way home as son was coming home for the weekend and nothing else was said. Even when we took the dog for a walk the next morning.

Then 2 weeks ago I received another email from OH saying the same as the first, wondering why I’d been acting normally (I thought he’d been thinking about things as I had mentioned on the phone but apparently not) but telling me he's been looking for places to stay near his work which is 45 miles away. It's just about doable re: money wise, as he spends a lot on petrol.

We have a mortgage of 82K (11 yrs to run), joint debts of 42k (credit cards only). The house is worth about 280,000 I think so plenty of equity there. But obviously taking into account the mortgage and debts that equity is cut in half.

The problem I foresee is my situation. I have had no job for pretty much all of our marriage. I worked until we had our first 19 yrs ago but it wasn't financially viable to carry on so I stopped. I had a 1 yr admin contract about 10 yrs ago at a kids nursery (it was closing down so lady who worked there wanted out for another job). But that's it. I don't have any career qualifications unfortunately.

I do want to work and know I have to but my confidence level is pretty much 0. I don't have any real skills to speak of and am terrified right now! Yes it's my fault I am in this situation but I am 'sh*ting' myself right now.

After 1 week of doing nothing but job searching I do have a part time (16 hrs) job starting on Tues in the evenings at local diy store. I could have done another (carers) job I had been offered but right now I don’t feel I could commit to something that needs so much emotional involvement and more hours for not much more money.

We made the work decision for myself together and OH hasn't pushed it (we both don't like confrontation). It worked for us. And as he left early and came back late workdays it meant I looked after everything here at home.

We have a dog which means working full time is out at the moment as we don't really have family close by or friends to let him out during the day. If I can move into a full time job with good wages I can obviously pay a dog walker (or come home to let him out)

OH says he wants to talk so we can make this transition as smooth as possible. So do I. I am not after fleecing him. I just want a roof over our heads and money to pay the bills. I know in time the house will have to be sold but right now it's worrying. I don't really want to end up renting. And even flats around our way are quite expensive.

OH has said that bringing things up about the separation is ‘tough’ as I’m not particularly receptive. Well go figure! I will talk about it but obviously I am angry/emotional whereas he’s way past that point.

What would people advise as the next steps to take? I don't even know where to start as my head is spinning. Right now I am concerned about my daughter (mainly, as son is the independent one) and the money. The kids are OK with it and they aren’t surprised! Strange response but makes me feel slightly better they’re handling it well.

At the moment things are amicable but OH wants to rent a room in a house (private) which is further away from work than first hoped and is more money. Once we know my wages we can obviously nail the finances but right now I’m still worried.
I’d love to keep the house and the mortgage payments are very reasonable as the rate is so low but I would never be able to get a mortgage to cover what we owe as my (soon to be wages) are so low plus the debts are taken into account. OH is on about 4 times my soon to be wage.

Thank you.

He doesn't get to dismiss you though op. His opinions and needs are not worth more than yours.

kittybiscuits - I just can't believe he thinks it's long enough to sort everything out. Finances from 20 yrs don't just get sorted in 4 weeks! He is being very selfish and I am pssed but can't change his mind as he says we can barely live together now. (I think that's an exaggeration actually but there you go!, he means he* can't live here longer....) Well, who caused that then?!?! Am I supposed to just be all happy about it?!

I think I would adopt a catchphrase to use every time he tells you what he has decided. 'That's an interesting idea. I'll give it some thought and let you know what I decide'.

I like kitty's phrase - particularly for pissing him off!

The more I hear the more I think ow, he's FAR to eager to escape!

And you're right op NO WAY will this all be sorted in 4 weeks. Have you asked him for a GOOD reason why he's so determined it MUST happen in 4 weeks? I'm guessing ow has given him a deadline!

Naicehamshop - I told him today that I need to be involved with decisions re: finances. He keeps using the word 'I' when talking about things and when I challenged him he just said it was nothing and just the way he worded it. He does mean 'we'. I think he got the message as I was very short with him!
I felt slightly better after making my point re: the CC 0% payment earlier. He swore we'd talked and made the adjustment - together - yet when he checked he was completely wrong! The payment we're making monthly is way short.... so I made the point of saying we need to keep a check on it and up it regularly!
When he showed me the room place on google earlier I saw it wasn't far from the person he's car sharing with (the lesbian, nothing going on there), I did say to him that it was a coincidence it was so close to her, he took offence to that. I was also going to say that he can't expect me not to be suspicious of everything given the decision he's made so abruptly, but DD came down so I let it go. He also pointed out that a few other work colleagues commute from there as it's cheaper than the work area.

My sister has a theory, that he's struggling with himself. His mum when younger asked him if he was gay, school 'bullies' thought he was gay....Our son came out a few yrs ago... she thinks that could have triggered something.... I have no clue. I have said no to that, but really no clue.

kittybiscuits - Haha! Could do!

Graphista - he just says he wants out. Can't live together any more. Detached. No other real reason. He has been thinking about this way longer than he's told me remember. Just wish he'd had a plan in his head further than just moving out. Remember I didn't even have a job at that point to earn extra/my own money.
He thinks we can sort out the basics and do it as and when needed I think.

He's going to leave in 4 weeks whether I am angry/p*ssed off/curt/defensive/you name it or not. That's the problem. He wanted to leave the last weekend in Jan paying 3 extra days rent, but then I said why not just take the day off and move in on the 1st?! He hadn't thought of that.... he's like that. Doesn't always think of the obvious.

So...possibility of an other man then? Makes sense to a point as men (yes sweeping generalisation but there's a reason for cliches/stereotypes) tend to be more confident in issuing ultimatums, in asking for their needs to be met.

Well done for gradually becoming more assertive with him and pointing out his mistakes and that he's already internalised the split - suggests he's been thinking about it for a while.

I think tax credits are based on last year's earnings. If you didn't have an income last year it is assumed you claimed JSA so no tax credits are available.

I think you'd need to speak to them on Tuesday.

Also, once he leaves you can get child benefit for the 16yo if she's still in education. And get the 25% council tax discount as single adult (FT students don't count).

My sister's husband walked out earlier this year, there was not only a OW, but he admitted he'd been having affairs for 10 years, they were together 30 and have two [grown up now] children. She is disabled and can't work [also never has so no skills], they have two dogs so that makes things hard, no house so no equity to split, no assets at all even the car is leased, no savings, he even spent her recent small inheritance on his own tax bill. Currently he is paying her rent but I doubt he will for much longer and then lord knows what will happen to her. It really sucks.

I wonder if the lesbian connection is not that she's the OW, but a gateway to the homosexual community? By moving away, and closer to her, H thinks he can start over. If he really has been living in the closet this whole time, it might explain his eagerness to move out. If he's been living a lie, and sees the end of it, he's desperate to cross that finish line.

Just a theory.

OP, since you say that you have communicated best over email in the past, perhaps writing an dispassionate email setting forth all your current financial concerns would be helpful. If nothing else, it could be useful in court if you get to that point.

Graphista - well who knows at this point! What's he's thinking is a mystery to me apparently!

Oh he told me he'd been thinking about it a while yes.

OutToGetYou - the form is very confusing! It does ask if you've claimed other things. I will need to speak to them on the phone for sure.
Child benefit I already get, but I could get child tax credits according to the online form, but again I'll need to check that with them. I need to speak to the council as well yes. Once OH has signed his agreement with a definite date I can inform people for sure.
So many things (all?!) have to be done over the phone, meaning long waits and a large phone bill!

That's so sad for your sister. I'm sorry. Makes my situation seem golden. Hope she can get all the help she needs.

HanShootsFirst - that's a good theory. She seems to be the closest one to him at work. Or the one he mentions the most anyway, she seems to be the one he talks to (and she him). At this point I don't know.

We're going to go over the financial stuff, getting paperwork out etc.. (which I will ask to copy, just so we both have copies if I get asked for his stuff wink wink) and will try to calmly talk to him then about my concerns. Although I have mentioned some of them and he dismissed them as nothing is going to change, he just won't be living here. I don't hold out any hope, but he will probably reassure me he'll keep paying the bills.

I've rented rooms in houses before and rented my room out and I've never had a rental agreement so don't be surprised if he doesn't get one.

I didn't think you'd get child ben as he is a higher rate tax payer but maybe he is paying it back through his code, in which case he will take home more once he's left because he can stop declaring it.

My sister's situation is bad but I think any relationship split is horrible, you're doing really well!

(bil also thought 'noting would change' just him not living there [and shagging someone else] but gradually he has eroded the promises he made at the start)

I'm hoping that once he's left and can 'be himself' (he said he can't do that around me, whatever that means) he's happier.

It is likely to be out of sight, out of mind unfortunately. Once he has moved away and has his new life to be himself, whatever form that takes, he will be less and less inclined to voluntarily send money back to support his old ball and chain.

While things are still amicable between you, send some emails confirming his willingness to support you, pay bills, pay mortgage, etc. Once he moves out and forgets those emails will come in handy for your HSL. Not to fleece him, but to get you what you deserve for your marital contributions while you rebuild your life.

to Mrskeats - as the sister of this lady I would very much like to tell you to shut up - you know nothing and your tone seems rather nasty. To everyone else - thank you for your messages of support.

Claire ????

OutToGetYou - Yes he has to pay a certain amount of child benefit back.

I've spoken to him this morning about why he's moving so quick and he just said he can't think here. He's going crazy. He needs space. He will be able to think more clearly once gone. I did say he's just moving from one room to another but it's being here that's the issue.
I have tried to explain my thoughts but because he doesn't have the same ones he is having trouble. But then again I'm having trouble with his thoughts so....

I have shown him the online mortgage calculator for extending the life of the mortgage and he thinks it's a good idea but he keeps coming back to the debts. I know they're there but to me the priority is the house. I know the debts have to be paid and if we could get a smaller monthly mortgage payment we could throw more at the debts. Once I am working and have an actual wage coming in, plus any benefits I can get, then we can work out more. Once I have a full time job in the future we can then work it out again. If I can afford the mortgage payments on my own then that would be excellent.
I am trying to get him to keep an open mind with the house, it's proving difficult.

I did say we can talk to people about the debts but he's sceptical about that sort of thing.

I have asked him to write things down, what he is going to do. He's going to do that. I have said I don't trust him, he has to see it from my point of view and that 4/6 weeks isn't enough time to work through 20 yrs of crap. He understands that but can't live here. He's crowded. He's been 'going' through this for longer than has told me and needs to get out.

We have talked about the accounts. He will transfer a set amount to the joint one each month to cover bills/debts and pay from there. We will set the account up as duel signatures so it can't be closed without the other persons say so and ask the bank what else we can do. My wages paid into my account will cover food/petrol at first, then once I have a regular wage/benefits we can work out what's what.
I want this all in writing.

Ladies lets not fight. Everyone has their opinion and on forums you can't get the whole picture.

Here's to a happy new year, whatever that brings.

OH seems to think that selling the house, clearing the mortgage and debts is the easiest option. He's not actually thinking in monetary terms. Or about DD. He says he knows we can't sell before she's 18 but after that... who knows!

I'm trying to look at all angles but he's just concerned about clearing the debts, quite rightly, but there are other options. I'm not going to just dump the debts on him. I will pay my half we just need to work through it sensibly.

Sounds like you are making a lot of emotional and practical progress.

Don't ask him for copies of finance stuff though, just tell him you are doing this. If you don't have a scanner then take photos on your phone.

The advice to confirm everything by email is excellent.

You are dealing with this so well - kudos to you.

I do think you need to find a bit of anger here, though. He feels crowded?? Time to say - in a calm way - that you don't give the tiniest of shits. He has created this situation and totally pulled the rug out from under your feet, leaving you in a very difficult place financially. Now he needs to prioritise the needs of his family - He does NOT come first in everything.

I know what you mean about keeping things pleasant and being reasonable, but he really doesn't seem to be able to see things from anyone else's point of view but his own... ?

Can you get some advice re selling the house and paying off the debts? Are you sure it's not such a bad idea? I am thinking how much easier it would be to separate and move on if you can pay the debts.

Btw I wanted to stay in the family home when I divorced but the court ruled the house had to be sold and I had two young dc at home. I hope you can sort things amicably but be prepared for all eventualities if not.

Don't forget he's probably got substantial pension savings which are part of the marital pot of money and should be taken into consideration when you do the division of assets.

MsJuniper - I'm trying to make progress, trouble is we're 2 ends of the spectrum. I like immediate action if we decide on something (which at NY isn't possible!) and he likes to take his time (always) plus he can't think straight right now or of more than one thing at a time.

We're going through the bills/household box when he's back after walking the dog to find all the relevant papers. I will scan them then. He can have a copy and so can I.
When I said I didn't trust him as I don't know what he's doing he said he could say the same about me. Which is true I guess. I did keep trying to say I just want what's best for DD and DS. He does too but hasn't thought through anything.

Naicehamshop - Oh I was angry this morning, I asked DD to go upstairs so OH and I could talk. He still didn't get my point, he got frustrated as he just needs 'space'. He can't think straight here. He's crowded.
I told him that his decision to try to sort things out in 4 weeks was stupid and if he waited, DS would be back at uni in a week and he'd have the room to himself. But no, he won't wait and will move to another room somewhere else.

I told him that we needed time to look at all options, like extending the mortgage etc.. while he's still here, so we can talk to each other. His answer was he can't think here. Blah blah blah.

Hellofromtheotherside16 - I will need advice re: selling the house. At the moment if we can keep it and try to pay off as much mortgage/debt as possible without any hasty decisions when DD is 18 that would benefit both of us. He keeps saying he doesn't want equity, which is fine and very generous, BUT if he waited and we both worked, kept things going down we could both walk away with equity.

He has mentioned pensions. Neither of us having been paying into one for some time. Token £1 payments each month (he says he thinks we need to do that to keep them open?). He has £45k in ones from yrs ago and I have about £9k from previous work ones (contracted in & out). *we've never moved the pensions so maybe need to look into that?

I did say that once I have a wage we can work through things and sort out him paying into his work one, he dismissed that idea. I just don't want to rush anything without looking at all options. If we can reduce the mortgage payment by half (by extending term) then we will have more money to throw at debts. Once I have full time work in the future things will obviously change again. His idea is just to sell at (dd's) 18 then start again. I said that's fine for him but there are 2 other people (3 if you include me) to think about.

*extending the mortgage might have been easier had he stayed here but there you go! They need 3 months wage slips so if we do it this month I can't take my wages into account... could make it more tricky. Although at present we're paying the mortgage without fail and paying debts, not sure if the bank will take that into account or do it 'by the book'. ??

I just want to explore options as each stage goes past. He is open to that but keeps coming back to the same thing. If a court says we need to sell then OK, I'll accept that but I don't want to just go with what he wants and not check every detail.

He's out with dog now. He wanted to walk into town earlier to pick something up but DD wanted to go to so he drove. I told him we have a dog he could walk..... so he's doing that now. I'll take the dog out later for another one. Benefits both us and the dog this way!