Support thread for those of us having to 'co-parent' with a narc or very difficult exh thread 3

[Lilacpink40]

Thred 3!

She'll believe what she's been told if she has feelings for him. I only know to doubt the things men say about ex GFs as I know it could be lies, as WN liar.

He may be nicer to her when she says bad things to you. All part of their game.

Thank you, for last night.

I still believe he's 'in there'.

He's damaged and traumatised and in denial but no-one can hide who they really are for over two years.

I really do feel that given time I can reach him. The better parts of him are so wonderful.

Morning Frog.

Do you have the energy to reach him? Do you think he wants you to ?

It sounds like a complicated situation. Did something happen to him to change him from the man you first met? Or do you mean he's damaged etc from the fall out of your split?

I know the person I first met still exists. But he co-exists with other aspects of his personality that I cannot accept. I'm afraid I'm too hard bitten and battle weary to attempt a rescue/salvage operation.

lilac I never asked mine for help either, if I could manage it, for the same reasons. Mine is also about to move in with the new one (remember just how new she is?!) and I wonder how he will treat her then.

frog when you say two years, is that how long you were together, or the period before the red flags started to show?

Everyone has some wonderful frog. Some peoples 'issues' outweigh the wonderful.

I spent years supporting my X emotionally (and financially actually) because I thought he just needed love and support to help him change (and he told me that). Actually I was enabling him to mask dealing with his 'issues' (I don't like that word but not sure how else to say it).

I love parts of him of course, we were married and had children, but there are some serious problems there that would not work in a relationship - particularly one that involved children.

My children actually saved me, I probably would have spent the rest of my life trying to help him be the person he told me he was underneath all the shit. I couldn't put them through it anymore - or be a good mother to them with his emotional pressures, and I realised he is the only person who can make the changes.

Do I have the energy?

Honestly I don't know but I've been over and over and over this for nearly a year and my gut just won't let it go

Green - we were together nearly 5vyears - 2 years is the point where the red flag lags really started to show though if I'm honest there was the occasional thing before that.

I don't know - I'm very conflicted apart from something that just will not let go.

He had a shit childhood and had stuff happen to him that only I know about that he now vehemently denies and in all honesty I think it's fear that's holding him back.

Frog - the 'stop walking on eggshells' book is useful insomuch it comes from the 'how to live with someone with a personality disorder'. It might be useful (if you haven't read it already).

Frog that bad childhood story is true of a lot of people. My WN and my DF could both tell you stories if you wanted to hear them.

I can tell you atories about mine, but it wouldn't excuse any of my behaviour as an adult. I had counselling after separation to not take issues on in the future because it was up to me to help me. You can't stop an alcoholic and you can't stop PD, the person needs to want to stop and activily do something.

frog I'm thinking back over my relationship with my WN and he hid his true nature for a long time too, although like you I can see red flags looking back. I just didn't know what they were really signifying. It got worse each time I fell pregnant, which I believe is typical. Also less clearly when we moved in together, which was another bind to him.

Anyway, my point is, I truly don't think mine is the person I loved. It was a facade and one I've now seen him use on others. Sure, the man I lived with had some good points, but even the nice things he did had an ulterior motive. The man I loved, he was a front made up of the good bits x a million. And he is that good an actor that he can keep it up for a long time. I've been involved with mine for a lot, lot longer, so I've had longer to come to terms with it. I'm lucky that I have no feelings left for him, although I do occasionally miss the man I thought he was. But, before, I had the same feelings as you and it was very difficult to leave while I still had them. Maybe you need more time?

Then again, I could be wrong as I would say all the same things about the behaviour of my new one being down to 'issues' and so on. I want to make it all better. I can't imagine him ever behaving like these WNs (but then did we ever with them?). So I may be falling into the same trap again, because I do still have feelings for this one. I think what I'm trying to say is when you care for someone, you can't just switch that off. It's hard to let go and it takes time, a lot of time. It's a grieving process, don't be hard on yourself for needing to get through it, going backwards sometimes and for not just breezily getting on.

purple my children actually saved me me too.

Green it's only really today I have realised that very very clearly. It was a wrestle with my emotions constantly in the middle of our shit relationship.

Our counsellor at one point said to me that XH was in a child role and I was mothering him. That became clear too. He acknowledge it with her then - but has of course denied all now.

That was the last kind of relationship I wanted !! But obviously by trying to be a supporting wife I did far too much. He told counsellors he was attracted to me because I was a 'do-er' which was the opposite of him. He saw in me something he desperately needed to support his issues.

He also told me lots about his damaging childhood and his parents awful dysfunctional behaviour. That is again completely denied - to the point that one issue he had with his mother which was mentioned in Court, he completely LIED about. In Court!!!

That also helped me realised that this twat's head is buried so firmly in the sand there is nothing anyone can do to help.

I just hope when his lies and huge emotional baggage and 'issues' all come crashing out (as I am sure they will) my DCs are no where near.

Same purple, same here with being a 'do-er' and parenting role.

I'm reading up about Child/Adult/Parent Egos. Think it's called TA Therapy. XH hasn't developed past his child ego. It's really interesting stuff.

Again, it goes back to accepting they are like that and all we can do is find a path to deal with it and look after ourselves. Because if we don't protect ourselves, we chose to enter into their game.

Can you tell I started counselling this week?

God purple I could have written much of that too. Awful childhood stories, then denial and lies. Odd relationship with his mother. More lies and denial. He lies so well and easily that I do not trust anything he says now.

Yet, I'm still having a twinge of 'what we could have had if only he wasn't a twat'. But it's only because he's getting to get everything he wants with someone else integrated into my space (thanks to whoever it was who came up with that on the last thread!) while I struggle working different jobs and not a lot to show for it. And reassuringly, the overriding feeling was relief it's not me. Because underneath it all, he might have all the material possessions he wants but he's still a controlling aggressive liar who bullies those he should protect. No amount of status symbols can compensate for having to live with that.

Evening all!

Been a peaceful weekend here. WN hasn't been in touch which is nice.

I'm still struggling a bit but I think I'm coming to terms with it a little. Had a good talk with DP about it, and he hit the nail on the head. I feel as though I can't function without my DS with me, and maybe that is making the prospect of him having a relationship with his dad harder. I need to realise that him and I are separate, and even though we may not be psychically together for X amount of time per week, that doesn't mean that we won't keep our amazing bond. I think I also carry a lot of resentment. I feel as though why should he get to crop up now DS is almost 3 and the toddler stage is out of the way and I've done all the hard work.

It's helping to think that even if he does forge some kind of relationship with DS, it's always me that's been there and he will remember that.

I tried to talk to DS about his dad earlier, the best I can considering his age. I asked him how he felt and he said sad, and that he didn't want a daddy, he just wanted a . I asked him why, and that it's a happy thing, and that DP wasn't going anywhere and he never has to choose, and said 'I'm not talking to you', my heart is breaking for him. I honestly don't know how to help him.

I can still remember my X lying flat out on the kitchen floor (like a 3 year old) crying uncontrollably (because more of his lies had been discovered) snot all over his face, begging and pleading with me 'not to break up the family'. This had probably happened 8 times to this extreme. I had grown so tired of it and so cold to all of his tantrums and unfulfilled promises, I remember really clearly thinking 'the problem with liars is you just can't trust them'. My new motto. People like that don't change. It is who they are.

oh glad you had a no contact weekend. I recognise the feeling you describe, needing your DS with you. I was very much like that too and have had to learn to let go a bit. It's been hard and at times I've felt very sad, but as time has passed I've seen that the bond is still there, I'm definitely the primary parent. That bond between you and your DS, it'd take a whole lot more than a bit of contact with his useless father to break that.

purple wow literally an overgrown toddler. Mine got aggressive rather than tantrumming, but used the exact same line about breaking up the family. And accused me of being cold. I was by then too. You are so right, they will never change. I feel quite alone at the moment but I'm holding onto the thought that being alone and not dealing with that is the better option.

Oh things will get easier. Your bond will never be broken - in some ways it will get stronger as WN behaves true to form and your DS has his faith in you reinforced further. You need to have some faith in your bond.

Green mine was very passive aggressive and just awful to be around - a really horrible black cloud that just hung over the room he was in.

He was sly though. Very sly. He just played the victim everywhere he went - I thought his mother was an awful manipulative two-faced bully from what he told me, his boss vile and abusing, his sister a weirdo etc. Of course he was telling them the same about me. Always the innocent party. And oh so quick at turning on the victim tears if things weren't going his way.

I wonder if he will ever grow up? Probably not as Mummy is still wiping his arse and providing him with everything even now.

Good one with the counselling fox. It can only help some way through this mental minefield.

Chrystal thinking of you tomorrow. Deep breath, stand tall if slightly round

Let us know how it goes.

You're all right I know, and I know it'll get easier in time. But the road to easy ain't easy.

Best of luck tomorrow Chrystal were all rooting for you.

I just find it hard without my DS here. I get incredibly anxious, especially so when he used to stay overnight with his dad. All I ever wanted was just a quick text at bedtime letting me know he settled ok, was that too much to ask? Could anyone 'make' him do that?

What pattern of contact would a court likely grant (if this went to court of corse, something I'm not sure whether I need to avoid or not)? He works all week and lives too far away to have DS overnight in the week, contact used to be Friday 6pm-sat 6pm (9/10 he used to call and have me pick DS up early). I would be comfortable (not comfortable but you know what I mean) with that, but he works alternate Saturdays so what would likely happen? I think eow full weekends is too spaced out for DS really, and I've had that discussion with him before when he did have contact. Also not wue how DS an I would cope with a full weekend apart

Ohb What about eow Fri night and Sat in day? Would it help to have an idea in mind that could work, to stick to in court?

At the moment I feel like bawling. Date 3 started well and ended badly. I've managed to find someone highly insecure and I'd hsve to reassure him all the time (possible man-child) so I've ended it. Gutted as Ive been feeling lonely for months, get to hear DCs mention WN & GF all the time, and he seemed so good through initial txts.

Glad it appears that everyone has had a relatively peaceful weekend. Sorry for all the sadness and soul searching though .

Good luck tomorrow Chrystal, hope it's the result you and your ds want and deserve.

Come on Lilac
Jut your chin back up. Well done for a quick realisation he was no good.

Snuggle the children. It'll be ok and better in the morning

Hi, can I ask, what are your experiences of court ordered contact where there's has been dv (narcissistic Pd imo)

Sorry Lilac that was a badly timed x post.

Gutted for you, it sounded so promising. But on the plus side, your twat-dar is clearly tuned to the highest setting and you got out straight away.

You mention feeling lonely. I've had one of my curious feeling nothing days. It could be the fallout from my friend's situation. Relationships look so unattractive to me just now. I rarely feel lonely, which I find a bit worrying. Still excited about possibly hearing from/seeing Mr HJM tomorrow, but I think I'm subconsciously insulating myself. I've become very emotionally self-sufficient, which is maybe a good thing, but also maybe just running away ? I don't know.