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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

support thread for those of us having to 'co-parent' with a narc or very difficult exh

992 replies

besshope · 03/08/2016 07:58

Step this way...
May I start of with a great big ROAR of frustration at having spent many years having to co-parent with someone who (after he left me for OW) has gone out of his way to make my life as difficult as possible. I know there are many of us, so here's a space to share frustrations, tips and experiences.

OP posts:
nicenewdusters · 12/10/2016 16:31

Welcome Homely.

Anything particular today frog, or just same shit, different day? I assume you've not heard back about the change in contact arrangements.

Froginapan · 12/10/2016 17:35

Same shit, different day.

I spent most of last night coughing up a lung. My solicitor today still didn't have an answer for me. It's been promised to her tomorrow but it's tough - I bought the tickets.

Natsku · 12/10/2016 17:43

Urgh to the cough, hope you get better soon.

DD wanted to talk to dad so I tried calling - no answer. Funny how he can make countless calls to me at all times of the day but can't answer the phone himself.

nicenewdusters · 12/10/2016 17:55

Well no surprises for either of you there frog and natsku !

You'd never get odds at the bookies betting on any of these men would you. We always know the outcome, there's no variables!

GreebaHouse07 · 12/10/2016 18:28

Yes able to stay in home. Just starting the whole process a bit daunted about it all and having to stand up to him once he starts his manipulating but have to be strong for my girls.

nicenewdusters · 12/10/2016 18:37

Well that's a good start Greeba.

Presumably from what you said in your OP your dc are aware of the kind of man he is. Also that he has been unfaithful and now has the scripted ridiculously young girlfriend. Hopefully this will spare you some of the heartache of them thinking he's Mr Wonderful. As you say, daunting though. But standing up for your girls will give you strength.

Froginapan · 12/10/2016 20:37

I wouldn't bet on any of these men if it were a one man race!

nicenewdusters · 12/10/2016 21:12

Yes, in a one man race they'd gaslight the starter, try and rewrite the rules, and then call a stewards inquiry because everyone's out to get them Grin

Froginapan · 12/10/2016 21:43

Exactly that, Nice!!!

Lilacpink40 · 12/10/2016 23:36

Nice just to add in that ultimately it would be the wife's fault...because for narcs a doormat wife will always be at fault.

Lilacpink40 · 12/10/2016 23:39

My ex tried speaking with DCs tonight but they wanted a break. He calls every night to ask the same questions, e.g. "how was school?". Then doesn't listen so DCs are trying to explain, they get fed up and say "bye, I love you" as that's what they know he wants to hear.

Balanced12 · 13/10/2016 04:46

Hi , can I join?
Awful weekend, DD5 refused to go for her overnight she's done some adhoc and we agreed to once a month she didn't want to go and she was angry with it which was awful and so sad.
Spoke to ex (who was a serial cheat and ran up eye watering debts before leaving me with a 12 week old, but I didn't let him come back 9 months later so I must be punished, sat in mediation and said everything is because he hates me and doesn't even like our daughter. Court said she had to go eow with moves to overnights. He tells her your mum's a lier my dp isn't her real dad (she knows this calls him dad though her choice and he does the day to day dad-ing and financial supports her, her dad pays a few quid to csa every 6 weeks and he's self employed/ full of shit to stop it going to court). He also told her her sibling new baby isnt really a sibling, she spent an afternoon sobbing because why cant she have the same blood as the baby. Sorry for the serious deviation.

Found out what they would be doing all very exciting always is (yes bitter, does lots of days out but earns less than £100 pw Hmm ) told her still no, more tears. We had agreed if she doesn't want to stay she doesn't have too. Said ill drop collect the sat and take her early Sunday, he said no I'm still going for the night/day away and I'm not coming back for her, it's 45 min away - I'm so upset for DD and don't know what to do now.

Speaking to him the second time, she had told me last time (first of the agreed new monthly routine) he doesn't put her in bed, just all stop and put in a dark room with door shut no light which scared her and he didn't get up the next day and she had one baby book. Told him it might help to have some light and a story to ease her into sleeping he screamed down the phone that she doesn't settle as I don't send her with enough stuff - arg! He hasn't a clue how to parent and I'm sick of giving him the answers all the time, we went round in circles, he shouted you will drop her off with her stuff I refused saying I wasn't going against her wishes she was in a state I would drop off and collect at his house to which he said he wasn't going to come back/be there for her after another circle I just hung up.

I know I'm suppose to make her go but the court order does say overnights to be discussed, do I just take a gamble tell him to take me back to court? He can explain to them why he tells her thinks to upset her and not feel a part of any family and doesn't pay maintainable including lying about how many children he maintains so he could pay less, but I know maintainace is nothing to do with contact.

I'm so worried about DD and what this is doing to her why can't he stop being a dick and do what is best for DD.

Thank you if you survived the rant and made sense of it, I've not slept in a long time

Any advice would be appreciated.

Natsku · 13/10/2016 06:30

If the court order just says overnights to be discussed rather than setting them in stone then I'd go with your DD's wishes for now and not make her stay overnight. Poor girl, must be so upsetting just getting shut in a dark room at bedtime with no story or cuddle or tucking in.

Balanced12 · 13/10/2016 09:14

Thank you natsku, she was/is upset about it but he won't be helped/told. Do I message him and tell him or I leave it till he asks/the next one is set? Potentially he will sulk for a few weeks/months before demanding to have her again.

Sorry I panic about getting the doormat and being unreasonable balance wrong, I worry that we will go back to court and I will have to make her available 50% of the time even though he doesn't show now, it's hard to evidence.

greencarbluecar · 13/10/2016 17:06

I'm back...thank you all Flowers and welcome everyone new, sorry you have to be here but glad you've found us. Still having a shit week but resigned to it at the moment. New relationship has pretty much died, after all, how can you have a relationship when you never know when you're going to be free?

nice you are a wise woman. I took control by leaving and he hated that, and we've been paying for it ever since. What balanced said, I panic about getting the doormat and being unreasonable balance wrong pretty much describes my life, and I do put up with things that I wouldn't in other areas of my life. Like homely I worry that he'll try and take DC, just to get at me, but I'm hoping that like lilac says, he won't want the responsibility of that in reality.

Frog so sorry to hear you're going through such shit times. That feeling of reading the lies and being terrified they'll be believed, it's so awful and I wish I could take it away for you. I honestly don't know how they live with themselves. Stay strong, you know that you are not the problem here.

I couldn't see the song links before, just been back and had a look...what is it with the Queen songs?! Me too! Another one bites the dust was on repeat in my car after I left, there are bits of it I shouted out imagining myself throwing the words from my mouth at ex. I've never told anyone that .

donners312 · 13/10/2016 17:37

I am guilty of al these thoughts too - will he take the children from me etc.

But the reality is these men don't give a toss about anyone including their children!

Therefore if they are not yanking our chains what sort of fight are they really going to put up to get their children or if they did are they really going to follow through and do that - look after their children even 50% of the time?

No!!!!!!

So just be unreasonable who cares what they think they think we are unreasonable anyway and do the grey rock thing - be boring and ignore them???

Simonneilsbeard · 13/10/2016 17:43

Hi! New here and just noticed this thread it must be fate!
Iv been apart from my EA exp for the past 5 years, we have 3 children together and in those 5 years he's tried a million ways to
Make my life a total misery..too much to write in one go before I have actually read the full thread. Just joining to also offer my support Smile

Balanced12 · 13/10/2016 19:46

Hi SimonNeilsbeard, I'm new to. Not got through the thread yet but it's scary/sad yet comforting (totally the wrong word) to realise so many are in the same boat.

Greencarbluecar sorry to read your latest post Flowers

**the reality is these men don't give a toss about anyone including their children. This is the bit I can't seem to deal with how do you shield them from this?

From now on I am the grey rock Wink

donners312 · 13/10/2016 20:15

I know it is horrible to watch innocent children being open and wanting relationships with men who couldn't care less.

I did read one interesting thing once about how you shouldn't let your child feel like a victim by feeling sorry for them or trying to over compensate.

greencarbluecar · 13/10/2016 20:17

balanced I don't think you can shield them, not completely and not forever. It breaks my heart that I've provided my DC with such a selfish liar for a father, who's already let us down countless times and always will. I've cried over his behaviour, tried to hide it or skim over it but ultimately kids aren't stupid. These men and their behaviour are in their lives and I think that if we pretend it's all just fine we risk leaving DC confused, thinking this is an acceptable way to behave and maybe unable to talk about it. So I'm trying to be age appropriately honest, discussing the bare minimum but being clear that it is not DC fault.

I'll never understand how such people can treat their DC as commodities. Maybe it helps to make us better parents though, because we give all our own love and mitigate the behaviour of the other parent too, every day.

greencarbluecar · 13/10/2016 20:20

donners I heard that too, and it makes sense but then I wonder what do you say then? If you shrug it off as oh that's just how dad is, are you giving the message that they should put up with people treating them like shit because that's just "how they are"? Ex is very entitled so I worry about feeding into that.

It's such a minefield

Simonneilsbeard · 13/10/2016 20:22

Hi balanced It is a comfort to know that others were unfortunately in the same situation..reading through some posts on the thread that are actually shockingly similar to my own story I could have written some of them word for word! It's terrifying

Simonneilsbeard · 13/10/2016 20:26

Just to add to that Iv been completely unable to sheild my children from a lot of what happened because during contact drop off/pick ups were the times my ex chose to hurl his abuse at me.
He also made numerous false allegations to social services which meant home visits, children being questioned etc
we are still dealing with the aftermath

greencarbluecar · 13/10/2016 20:38

Simon that sounds terrible Flowers

I get a lot at pick ups/drop offs to and then you get DC asking about it...there's not much you can do if the other parent refuses to put DC first, they're going to see it and all we can do is support them through it.

Like you say terrifying how closely all our stories match up. I often wonder how they learn all these tactics.

nicenewdusters · 13/10/2016 22:34

Hello to all, old and new. Greencar - glad you're ok, so sorry to see things didn't work out with your dp. It seemed like you thought it would go that way.

I was going to comment upon various individual points/scenarios, such as my dc's phone calls from ex being almost word for word the same as yours Lilac.

However, have just had very difficult chat with dc where I basically let them know a few home truths about their dad !! They are old enough to have realised what he's like in some respects. I'm done trying to sugar coat the crap, try and build a better picture of their dad for them. That's his job, and he's failing, but d'you know what, tough luck on him.

I have a really busy day tomorrow, the whole day is shoe horned around timings for the dc's events/school etc. No problem for me, all planned and sorted. Asked dd to phone her dad to say x, y, z. But no, can't pick up one of the dc at the time requested, has to be 30 mins later. I know this is just him suiting himself.

I said fine, if I go and he's not here I'll take dc with me. Lots of upset about then dad will be angry with me (dd) ! Why can't you text him? You can't leave with ds! All about how it's going to make dad feel, then react to them. And this is the man who only a week ago drove off and left them on the doorstep outside my empty house.

I told them that he's a difficult man, he makes it that we can't communicate. I said he suits himself, only does what he wants, and that they aren't a present in a shop to be wrapped up for his arrival.

I too read the thing about not making them victims. Actually now I think that by pretending these men are ok is a real betrayal. What message does that send? No, no more. I'm not going to assassinate his character at every opportunity. But I am not going to be the enemy, or seem difficult, so that he can be Mr Good Guy.

Following all the crash business discussed earlier, I'm currently facing the prospect of him getting the money for the written off car. I know he won't give it to me. We don't have a court order, weren't married, and all dc contact is agreed just between us. If he takes the money I intend to threaten his sorry arse. He knows I can outsmart him, that's why he hates having to deal with stuff with me

I'm totally with donners on this one. As you say, they think we're unreasonable anyway so they might as well have it in spades. Not that I think I am being unreasonable!

My kids know what their dad is like. I try to be honest generally with them, so why would/should I lie about something as important as this.

Sorry for rant. Just really bloody angry tonight.