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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Anyone up? DH is leaving me follow up thread. Onit's on it!!

980 replies

onitlikeacarbonnet · 20/07/2016 22:26

Link to my last thread.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/relationships/2658829-Anyone-up-DH-is-leaving-me?msgid=62446916

OP posts:
onitlikeacarbonnet · 08/11/2016 21:22

Ds's room finished today. I have very sore hands from the god awful 3 hours of Allen key screwing to get his bed built.
But he loves it!
I have my pil coming to see DC and they're staying for tea tomorrow. Not that I can fit us all round the table. I haven't even got enough chairs Blush
I've learned that mil at least needs to be kept at arms length. LCB has her keeping things from me if not lying for him. As is the way of a narcissist. Fil I haven't seen since about a month after it all happened so I've no idea where I stand there now but I'll try not to let my paranoia get in the way. When I last saw him he said some nice things but, as I haven't seen or spoken to him since, it's hard to feel confident that he's still keen to remain impartial. Obviously they've both seen their son a lot more in the last few months than they've seen me. And I've no idea how I'm being portrayed by him to his friends and family.

Once they've gone I need to pack up my kitchen (again!) for the work starting on Saturday (hopefully finished on Sunday)

I need to get in contact with my lawyer after the reply to his letter. But it can wait till next week.
My counsellor is trying to get me to disengage as much as possible but, and at the same time, keep the lines of communication open. I haven't found that fine line yet. I'm squarely in the disengaged camp. I need to find my inner adult apparently Grin

My to do list is ridiculous again but I'm happier with plenty to do. And the house is becoming ours.

OP posts:
onitlikeacarbonnet · 08/11/2016 21:24

Also I've replied to your pm nigel

OP posts:
Mix56 · 09/11/2016 11:04

onit. I can understand the PiL dilemma. The only thing you can do I think is observe ! Also, you could try & lead them to a place where they don't feel responsible for either of you. Could you say, " it must be impossible murky waters for you, I realise you can only stay neutral to me. but just try & be fair."

Also try & imagine if later in your life, Your Son & DIL separate, for whatever reasons, It would be hard to side exclusively with DiL particularly with a LCB who is lying

TheMshipIsBack · 09/11/2016 13:10

onit - de-lurking to say: if more allen key work is in your future, buy a basic electric drill with a set of allen key bits. It's a bloody lifesaver!

onitlikeacarbonnet · 09/11/2016 23:01

Well it was ok. I'm so confused. My fil was very apologetic about not seeing me earlier. They came about an hour before tea and spent most of that time with the DC (mil and I spent some time discussing what DC want for Xmas).
We all had tea and they stayed another hour or so after I got DC to bed.
I didn't offer much info on what's happening but answered direct questions about the work done and still to be done on the house.
I've no idea if LCB is telling them anything. They are seeing LCB and the DC on Sunday. Mil volunteered this info. I got the feeling it was to prove she's not hiding anything.
LCB phoned to speak to the DC while they were here and, when ds said he was playing with grandad, LCB seemed very taken aback. Mil said she'd not mentioned they were coming to see us.
What motive lies behind all this I'm not sure but I felt like they genuinely wanted to be here. Not just to see the DC.
I told them they were welcome any Wednesday and mil said she normally plays golf but fil interrupted her to say that she'd normally finish early enough that they could still make tea here.
I've left it as a standing invite. We'll see how that pans out.

OP posts:
onitlikeacarbonnet · 09/11/2016 23:04

I have a borrowed drill TheM but I had no idea you could get Allen key bits. Wish I'd known that before yesterday Sad

OP posts:
myfriendnigel · 10/11/2016 06:33

Well that all sounds pretty positive onit...I'm really hopefully you will be able to have a good Ongoing relationship with them-it might be a bit different but they sound like good people and as such will value you as much as you value them.

Mix56 · 10/11/2016 08:34

I agree with nigel. It sounds like FiL is interested in your offer. All positive.

myfriendnigel · 12/11/2016 08:32

Hope all well onit...
Bloody cold up north Grin

onitlikeacarbonnet · 12/11/2016 15:59

It's bloody freezing!
I hope you've got your thermals nigel

Not much to catch up on really but I received the email reply to my decision about Christmas.
Apparently he has been avoiding thinking about it because of the "rollercoaster of emotions" Hmm Who knew he had any? He must've grown some since June when he first brought Christmas up in an email of demands. His memory is very short.
He "accepts" I don't want him anywhere near my house but doesn't accept that the DC not seeing him is in their interests. I actually agree they should see their dad on Xmas day but I'm not sure how to work it without it causing me more grief than I'm prepared to suffer.
As it is he wants to take them Christmas night so he can do a second Christmas on Boxing Day when they wake up in his house.
For my part, I don't want our day to be cut short or be all about leading up to going to dads house. But I'm not sure if this is just me being selfish and trying to punish him. He will, after all, be spending the day with his family (and ow?) so it's only me who'll be left alone if the kids go to him at nighttime.
I'm happy to offer a Skype call in the morning after presents and before bedtime. And he can collect them at 8am, or as early as he likes, on Boxing Day.
I'm open to criticism over this though, if you all think I'm being cruel to my DC. My thought is that, generally, they don't notice him "missing" from day to day life. They rarely mention him, especially when distracted as they will be on Christmas Day, and I see no reason to reward the LCB with a compromise. If I put myself first in this matter it will be the first time. And I'm through with being complicit in my own punishment for his gain. But hit me (gently) with your opinions please Smile

I need to make an appointment with my lawyer at some point as his lawyers letter will need to be replied too but he can wait a bit longer for that. Tomorrow I might post my responses to his demands to get a little input.

It's ds's birthday this week. I have lots to organise for that and for his party next weekend. Haven't even started party bags or wrapping presents Blush
And I need to get back in touch with my boss as she's never come back to me with anything about what I might be looking at contract wise when I return in the new year.

I'm currently hiding (and freezing) in my bedroom while my new kitchen is going in. My old one, ripped out this morning, is strewn all over my front garden.

Guess I'll be having takeaway for tea tonight!

OP posts:
annielouise · 12/11/2016 19:56

Could you ask your DC? Just say you're at home for Christmas with mummy but daddy wants to see you too. Do you think you would like to go there the evening of Christmas Day and wake up at daddy's when he'll be having another Christmas for you or will you be too tired and like to sleep at home so you can play with your presents up until bedtime and then have a new day at daddy's the next day? It is suggestive as I think they'll say stay at home and go to daddy's the next day then you can tell him that. I think them going there Christmas Day night is more in his interests than theirs.

You don't hang around with the kitchen. I've been in my 'new' home 2 years and not put one in yet. Do you mind me asking what you've gone for? I was thinking of putting in an Ikea kitchen next spring but not sure if they're any good. I'm far more indecisive than you obviously.

Dowser · 12/11/2016 21:39

Fil sounds nice...I'm a bit wary of mil

cockadoodledoooo · 12/11/2016 22:28

He has family and ow to keep him company, he knows you don't. Tell him he can shove his demands up his arse! He chose to break up the family, he needs to accept his lot.

What do your mutual friends have to say about him/ow and how are they treating you?

onitlikeacarbonnet · 12/11/2016 23:35

If my DC were older I would certainly ask what they'd like to do. As it is, I feel they're too young (and not in full possession of the facts) to understand the question or it's implications. Ds, who's the oldest, is a very kind, thoughtful child and has expressed his worry, more than once, that daddy is lonely. Obviously that is not true but ds would base his decision on this belief. I'm not prepared to put the pressure of this decision on their shoulders as the answer will hurt one or other of their parents. I believe it would be asking them to choose one parent over another. That's not in the interests of the DC. That's too much responsibility for a 5&6 year old to bear. It's my job to shoulder that burden.
And, if when I tell my DC what Christmas Day will be, I know they will be sad not to see daddy but I will make sure they know that daddy won't be alone.

Mutual friends have mostly taken one side or the other. Those on my side are disgusted with his behaviour. Not least because of his behaviour since we separated.
I'm obviously unaware of the opinions of the ones who've taken his side. I'm presuming they are not in full possession of the facts either as I'd find it difficult to comprehend anyone knowing what he's doing, and not condemning him.
I'm fairly certain his parents aren't privy to all that he's inflicted though I can't say if he's been more open about what I've said/done to him.
In isolation, I'd guess that some of those things sound pretty awful if not seen as retaliatory to provocation. For eg I've withheld his "share" of the profit from the trade in of my car. But this was after his repeated threats of withdrawing hundreds of pounds of monthly maintenance.
I'm guessing he's pretty convincing in making me out to be the bad guy since he obviously believes that to be true. The friends who are on his side are all originally his friends. From school in most cases. And not people who we've generally had in our close circle for many years.
I'm including mil and fil in this group as I have not discussed anything with them about their sons behaviour before, during or after the split. I made clear to them from the outset that I didn't want to put them in the middle mainly because they'd eventually forgive him and I needed to maintain a relationship with them for my DC; and wanted to, for me.
It's so difficult. I want all his allies to know what he's doing and what he's done. I want people to see and understand I'm not the villain here but I won't publicly share his vile behaviour because one day our DC will be privy to it and I don't want them to find stuff out by looking back old Facebook posts and reading the messages their dad and his mistress were sharing the night my ds was poorly in hospital.
Lcb and his nastiness will be found out eventually, but it won't be me who exposes him. I very much hope ow sees him for what he is very soon and she does it for me. Though, from what I can gather, narcissists like LCB, get away with it more often than not because their victims are ashamed. I'm not ashamed but until they're old enough to cope with the fallout, I need to protect my DC from the hurt of finding out what their dad is and what he's done to us all with his selfishness. And, if that means I look like the bad guy to his enablers, I'm ok with that. My reputation is not my concern here.

On the kitchen front, I'm not hanging about as I'm replacing a 30 year old kitchen which, due to leaks ignored by previous tenant/landlord, has been slowly rotting away for god knows how long.
I didn't go with Ikea in the end as, although I think their mid-high end are great quality, the low end are much flimsier. I got a better quality kitchen from howdens for a similar price. Also it's costing a lot less to have it fitted than the Ikea one would've.

OP posts:
Clutterbugsmum · 13/11/2016 08:13

I agree with you, have Christmas day with your DC and he can pick them up Boxing day morning.

This is a consequence of his actions. He no longer gets to play happy families in your house. Skype if you must but I still feel that is an intrusion on your time/day.

Hope your kitchen is going well.

AgathaF · 13/11/2016 09:02

I agree with your Xmas proposal too. Having him pick them up on Xmas day, however late that might be, would hang over you all day. I think him picking them up reasonable early on boxing day is good enough.

Be firm over this one.

Mix56 · 13/11/2016 09:04

Onit, this phrase of yours causing me more grief than I'm prepared to suffer is spectacular. I love it, & with your permission will use it often !
I just wondered if LCB has told this parents about the drunken harlot ? or has is he intending to keep his shiny image intact until they have got used to the divorce. I am supposing the latter, he will want to keep his parents sweet.
You are so generalous & fair, I have to bow down to your inner goodness & resolution re your love & demotion to your children.
But so not give LCB the kids on Christmas day, he has taken everything he can, he will not take the this thing that is left.
I am not a fine a person as you. I would have mentioned to DC, that daddy has a new friend, for 2 reasons.
They need to know, for example when your DS imagines "Daddy is lonely." Daddy is not lonely, He is absolutely fine. DS does NOT need to worry. LCB can & IS use this "poor Daddy" fictitious persona.
& secondly I would not want him to be able to manipulate his parents maintaining his shiny image by omitting to tell his parents, the order in which your separation happened. If the DC know, they might "out" him to GP ! :o)

Mix56 · 13/11/2016 09:05

Devotion ! dammit

myfriendnigel · 13/11/2016 09:06

It's the first Christmas.he can pick up then up early Boxing Day. For future ones you might realistically need to be more flexible.but not this one.not after what he has out you through this year.

Mix56 · 13/11/2016 09:07

sorry, on phone in car (not driving !)

Splishing · 13/11/2016 09:22

Been a while since I've posted, but been lurking. You are a much better person then me onit. You have tried to be as fair as you can given the circumstances. It's also possible his friends are siding with him since it is likely he will have spun them a load of lies about your marriage. I'm sure my STBXH is painting me to be the horrible ex despite him finding OW. I used to confide in MIL but got fed up with 'there's no way my son would do that', 'he'll continue to look after you and DC'. It was all a bunch of crap. He is showing his true colours now - just a pity she won't or can't see it.

I too need to sort out our first Christmas post split. He is making outrageous demands about how much of Christmas he has them (basically all of it other than a couple of hours from them to open presents with me on the day!!). So some of the advice given here by you and PP is really useful for me to go back with saying how unreasonable that is.

Glad to hear you are getting a new kitchen and at a good price too. Enjoy once it's done!

onitlikeacarbonnet · 13/11/2016 09:37

He actually did tell his parents about ow from the outset.
im becoming more convinced I need to tell DC the truth about daddy having a friend but, to avoid the potential for LCB to introduce her at Christmas, I will wait till new year to explain. And I will not be sharing my plans to do so with him.
I'm still unsure if I should explain that daddy left mummy for this other woman or if it's enough to just reveal her now.
Part of that is I don't want them to know that I've lied to them. Though I have Sad. I actually regret not telling them when he left. He's had months of my DC feeling sorry for poor, lonely, sad daddy. And I'm sure all his tears have done nothing but solidify their pity for him.
I'm also sure they don't pity me. Not that I want them to. But it would be more fairly placed with me than with that asshat.

I'm so ashamed of him. Angry, murderously angry at times. And now I'm becoming more sure of what he is I'm scared for my DC and what he's capable of doing to their mental health and views of healthy relationships.
And I'm feeling actual concern for ow Confused and what she's got herself into. He's been grooming her for a while. At least a year I think. I believe my weight loss was the catalyst for him pushing for her but I'm certain he's had her waiting in the wings for a long time before he went for it at our weekend away. When I started to lose weight he realised he'd lost control of me. The weekend away was 2 months and nearly 3 stone into my healthier eating.
I actually hope she sees through him soon but he's so clever I don't think she will. I actually want to warn her but what would I say? It would probably have the opposite effect. I'm sure the first person she'd tell would be LCB who has an answer for everything. I'd just be bitter and spiteful and intimidating.

OP posts:
Splishing · 13/11/2016 09:52

Even if he has told people from outset I would still be wary as to how he has told them and what details he has chosen to share. It's possible he has truthful with his parents but not friends for fear of their disapproval. Obviously I don't know him or how he thinks but it wouldn't surprise me if he has described it all with his rose finite glasses on.

It is so difficult to know what the best to do about telling the DC. They are still young which is a big consideration. You mentioned you have started seeing a counsellor - maybe she could help you decide whether to tell them the truth and if so how best to go about it. Mine are similar in ages to yours and my counsellor advised telling mine for just now but my circumstances are slightly different so don't think that is general advice.

I think you are right - any contact with OW will not come across well for you. Know how tempting it is but I personally think you just have to leave them to it.

Splishing · 13/11/2016 09:52

*tinted not finite glasses!

Splishing · 13/11/2016 09:54

Also it should be my counsellor advised NOT telling DC just now!
Really should check before posting!!

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