Seriously thinking about NC with DH's side of the family

[Gobbolinothewitchscat]

This is going to be long but think I need to post the background

I've posted previously about SIL's wedding. I have 3 DCs - age 3, 2 and 13 weeks. The oldest have just turned 3 and 2 respectively so still small.

SIL is getting married about 150 miles away on a week day. We have been told no DCs at the wedding. Mil has a difficult family background and her half-brothers children will be going however - albeit they are older than ours. I susir t ultimately that SIL will also permit her friends to bring small babies. I understand that it is SIL's wedding but I find it pretty hurtful that our children (who are actually her closest relatives) are to be excluded.

My parents are extremely supportive of us and will normally drop anything to help us out. Mil has form for being very difficult and has been very unhelpful at difficult times - eg looked after putt DS on the day of my grandmother's funeral (250 miles away) but refused to rearrange plans so I had to get out cleaner to come and look after DS (then 1 year old) as she had to leave at 5pm. The whole thing was horribly stressful and I still find it very upsetting to think about.

My parents normally drop everything to help us but normally go on holiday with friends around the date of SIL's wedding. They therefore told me immediately that they may be able to look after our DCs but that - in this instance - they actually won't cancel their holiday if the group of friends can only manage that date (they are all retired so tend to go quite last minute to get the best deal) and we should therefore get a plan B. I immediately highlighted this to DH and his response was - (massively fucking entitled) oh it's my sister's wedding. Surely they won't go away. I said they very well could and he should highlight this to his family now as we may not have any childcare and ultimately I wouldn't be able to go. Plus, I could very well still be feeding youngest DC. Really the only option would be to take someone to look after the DCs on site and I didn't even know if that would be feasible. But I was highlighting it now so that there were no amateur dramatics near the wedding if I couldn't go

Communication within DH's family is pretty piss poor so nothing was done.

At the weekend, SIL, MIL and FIL came ti visit and stay the night. SIL said something in passing about my parents looking after the DC and I said that actually they maybe away and there wasn't really a plan B. I said that I could perhaps ask my DS's key worker from nursery to travel to the wedding and look after the DCs but we would need to get him accommodation. And, in any event, I was uncomfortable about being away from my youngest DC even if I could get someone look after all DC at our house.

SIL told me that there were no rooms left at the hotel but if I got the key worker, he could perhaps stay at a local B&B. That she was having to lay £150 a head per guest and she wanted me to be able to relax and enjoy myself and also keep costs down - hence why our DCs weren't invited. I said that the best solution maybe to ask the key worker. And, if I did, would SIL like the DCs to be brought to the church (waiting outside during the ceremony) for a few photos as they would be in the area. Totally up to her obviously but thought she might like it. She said yes, but she was banning children from the church. I said I quite understood as FIL's brother's children had made a terrible racket during ours in the church (MIL insisted they were invited) and you could even hear the noise on the wedding video. MIL said she couldn't remember that but I said (nicely) that it was on the video. I also said that if my parents were looking after the DCs, they had also offered to bring them to the church (to wait outside) and take them home (a big thing as a huge drive) after if she wanted photos.

So - it was all perfectly pleasant and I thought the childcare issue was clear. More importantly, there was actually communication like normal people. DH then went to work in the morning and the DCs and I went out with SIL and the PILs for brunch - all perfectly pleasant. Nothing else said. I was slightly nervous about going out as the PILs had been invited to visit DC3 a few days after she was born and had been very late (with no communication). I was upstairs feeding the baby and DH had said something to MIL about it. She had started shouting and bawling at DH saying it was my fault and I was manipulating them and being very rude about me. I decided the best thing to do was pretend I hadn't heard and gloss over things. But, again, everything perfectly pleasant at brunch

DH then arrives home and asks me what I had been saying to his sister? I explained the position about childcare and said that I had highlighted this to him already but his approach seemed to have been that my parents would have to just cancel their holiday. That wasn't very constructive so I had highlighted things to SIL so she could make ab informed choice about allowing the DCs to attend in the vicinity and be looked after off site (pretty pissing annoying that DH could have mentioned it earlier so we could have got a room for them and carers at the hotel but now we couldn't) as ultimately if we couldn't get appropriate childcare, I wouldn't be able to go and with a wedding of 60 people, that would be noticeable.

DH then says that obviously I had a chip on my shoulder about FIL's neice making a racket during our wedding and that my parents were manipulating things by refusing to cancel their holiday (the irony after my grandmother's funeral and various other times that they have dropped everything and driven 300 miles to help us out after the PILs have let us down!). I susir t he had spoken to MIL on the way home.

I am absolutely fed up with this. I am fed up of rather than everyone talking civilly about things (as I tried to do) and resolve problems in good time, MIL then approaches DH behind my back. If she or SIL had a problem, why not discuss it with me at the time or the next day? I am fed up (and I think this is the crux of it) if DH not simply explaining that all I am trying to do is sort out childcare for the DCs (as basically he seems to have opted out of it and my parents - his indentured servants obviously - are to drop everything AGAIN to help out). Why is DH not able to actually support me (his wife) and make it clear - politely - to his family that if you have your wedding hundreds of miles away and don't invite your very young nieces and nephews, then yes, childcare will be an issue and that is not bring "difficult". It's a matter of fact. And, actually, if your "keeping costs down" banning your brothers children whilst letting others attend is actually pretty fucking hurtful

I actually don't know what to do. I've said tinDH that I think that actually everyone should just be honest and communicate clearly with each other now. So if he thinks my patents are "selfish"
and "manipulative" (the breath taking cheek!) he should say to their faces. Further, I will contact SIL and MIL and ask them if they need me to clarify anything about what we discussed. Further, another option is for me to not attend and look after the DCs which I think maybe the best option all round

I'm actually so so sick of this. I don't want to see the PILs again and I don't particularly want to see SIL again.

Should I contact them? Should I just decline the wedding invitation? I want to make it clear why

I also need to sort out the DH issue too

And the other thing to do is to stop making it easier for your DH to take it out on you rather than his mum. You need to make it bloody difficult for him to give you a hard time - deflect it back, make his family his problem.

Op you need to take a massive step back. By trying to accommodate these entitled idiots (not so dear H included) you've made it more stressful for yourself. Right now you're buying into their weird family dynamic by these endless discussions and involving your parents.

You're H is the real problem here and he is trying to bully you into accepting their weird fucked up dynamic, screw that! If you don't make a stand now they will forever feel entitled to walk all over you. If placating entitled rude people isn't a relationship dynamic you want to model for your children, then don't!

Decline the invite and tell your parents to enjoy their holiday and if your H and his family have a problem, it's exactly that, their problem and not yours. These people are taking advantage of your kind nature and are being disrespectful.

You will get to the wedding to find a dozen other kids there, which will enrage you and yet again you will be accused of being the trouble maker.

Your parents should NOT cancel their holiday. Do not get someone to take them to the church for pictures. Stop facilitating this madness.

Stop communicating with them, leave your husband to sort these things out even if it includes you not attending the wedding.

I'd like to echo all those other posters who have said "You can't win".

Even if your parents cancel their holiday, or the keyworker travels all that way to stay in a B&B, and you arrive at the church childfree, they will still say nasty things about you."

They will not show even the tiniest hint of gratitude, and your dh will probably add a "There, that wasn't so difficult now, was it?" for good measure.

It's time to make a stand against your H and his self-centred family. Your parents will be going on holiday. Your H will be attending the wedding alone, and they can whine and whinge about it to their hearts content.

You will have time away from H. Your parents will have their holiday.

this is all really good advice.

I'm angry and hurt. I know I won't "win" but I'd rather get a chance to (politely but firmly) make my point. It will make me feel better. I'm tired of having to gloss over and ignore bad behaviour.

I agree re: the photos. I mentioned it to SIL on the basis that if the DC were in the locale, then they could come if she wanted some photos. But I won't be mentioning it again.

The wedding is in the middle of no where. All the rooms at the venue are now let out so it could be very difficult to find the key worker somewhere to stay.

Plus, by the time we have paid him and paid fur accommodation (20 miles away if possible), I think we would be looking at the best part of £500. After what has gone on, I'm not mk fed to pay that.

I don't think that my parents should cancel their holiday. This has been a standing arrangement for many years with very close friends - the PILs literally have no friends so it's not something they can understand

I am still leaning towards contacting MIL and SIL and my parents are furious. I cannot tell you the emotional and practical support they have given us. They want to speak to DH about this. Maybe DH will be humiliated. If so,maybe a dose of humility will do him good

It's awful. In other ways we get on very well and he is very supportive. However he's like fucking Pavlov's dog she it comes to his family. He's normally very logical and rational and he seems completely unable to think straight when it comes to them

You will get to the wedding to find a dozen other kids there, which will enrage you and yet again you will be accused of being the trouble maker

I think this is very likely. Why have ours been excluded? It's so horrible .

Honestly? You are still thinking of him and them having a magic button that you or your parents can press to make them have the same emotional reaction as you would.

His kind of humiliation isn't about to make him think differently. Quite the contrary. It is likely to make him think worse of you and more of his family. It would be a dose of humility, it will be an insult and a shaming that he and they will twist to show how evil and unhinged you and your family are. It is the kind of humiliation that will start to destroy the relationship he has with them and therefore you all have as a family.

It is hard to understand because it is completely counterintuitive to how you have been brought up and to how most people live and think! Believe me, it has taken me literally decades to get it so I am not expecting you to know what I mean.

All I am warning you against is more disappointment, heartache and pain for you.

Making your point won't make you feel better long term if that point is never acknowledged as being sane, relevant, important or even heard. It will make you feel worse and like you are going crazy.

Don't think avoiding this issue and going to the wedding is you backing down. That is playing in to their power trip. It is about you taking BACK control and then dealing with the far more difficult roots of this problem in your own time.

I am still leaning towards contacting MIL and SIL and my parents are furious.

The people to which your rage is extended, just won't get it. Honestly. They are poking you to see at what point you snap.

The worst thing you could do is rage at them. The best thing to do is as you said in your initial thread title. Go No Contact. Let him deal with them. No Rages. No comment. Just back off and let them get on with this bullshit. They will always be pleasant to your face and go to your husband behind your back - that's their MO. They will only use your rage against you in the future.

Rage here. But not there. They are utter wankers the lot of them.

This is a mind fuck.

What I am finding hard to get over is the fact that bad behaviour seems rewArded here. Plus, I feel if I never say anything then ultimately they feel they've "broken" me. That I'm too scared of them to stand up for myself and they can do whatever the fuck they want in future.

His kind of humiliation isn't about to make him think differently. Quite the contrary. It is likely to make him think worse of you and more of his family. It would be a dose of humility, it will be an insult and a shaming that he and they will twist to show how evil and unhinged you and your family are. It is the kind of humiliation that will start to destroy the relationship he has with them and therefore you all have as a family.

regular - this is scarily insightful.

FIL has 3 brothers and doesn't speak to 2 as MIL has fallen out with them. This is all totally alien to me

Maybe other people have gone NC with them.

I'd rather get a chance to (politely but firmly) make my point.

You call it that but in your DH's family this will forever (and I do mean forever) be known as The Time Gobbolino Ruined SIL's Wedding. Yes, of course that is utterly ridiculous but these are not people driven by reason or logic. A wedding is not the occasion for a showdown with your in-laws. However, nor is it a reason for you to bend over backwards to accommodate them. Your parents absolutely 100% should go on their holiday, you are unable to attend because of childcare. I'm guessing the comment about six weeks before is because the invitations haven't gone out yet so you can't actually RVSP in advance of the invitations. But I would let DH know you won't be attending and don't wish to discuss it any further.

It's entirely understandable that your parents are furious, I bloody would be in their shoes. However, if they tackle DH head on he is likely to deny most of what you have said to them, will make out his mother has been perfectly reasonable and he's no idea where you got this story from and you've manufactured the whole thing due to the noise caused at your own wedding. He will paint it as Bridezilla 1 vs Bridezilla 2. (You're 1, the SIL is 2).

I suspect he will also deny having called them selfish and manipulative, say that you made that up to try and turn them against him, because you know you're in the wrong and you want allies to back you up.

Let the heat die out of this situation by simply refusing to participate. Later, your parents should make very clear to your DH that they are hurt and angry at his lack of respect. (As, indeed, should you).

I literally cannot cope with years of this.

If I go NC then ultimately they see the DC without me there and I'm excluded from my family. Which I really do not want.

You call it that but in your DH's family this will forever (and I do mean forever) be known as The Time Gobbolino Ruined SIL's Wedding

Yup. That sounds about right.

I literally cannot cope with years of this.

But you cannot change the dynamic of his family. Look at everyone they've fallen out with. Virtually everyone they've ever met is NC with them.

The only thing you can choose is how much misery you allow them to inflict on you. Zero is not an option.

The only thing you can choose is how much misery you allow them to inflict on you. Zero is not an option

Jesus. This is seriously making me contemplate divorce.

I am honestly taking the advice here but I feel I'll always be the black sheep. Hence why a bit if me wants the supreme satisfaction of telling them to fuck off

What make people become like this?

Gobblin go low contact not no contact. Back away, leave your DH to it. That way you aren't excluded.
It's what I did, yes I still see them but a lot less. It's easier, there's no awkward questions. I just leave DH to organise it, he does presents, visits etc. I just get up and get dressed. That's it.
They don't even have my phone number anymore. There's no grief, no arguing, no discussions, no getting involved in the bull shit dramas.

Your Dh sounds like an entitled prick speaking about your parents like that.

Also your parents or anyone else ferrying the children miles around just for a photo outside the church for the show is utterly ridiculous.

I would stay home.

I don't think the op's DH is an entitled prick, yes he's behaving like one but I don't think he really is.
I think it's probably him caught in FOG, the parents are getting it as they are the ones not complying causing the grief for him from his parents.
He's been conditioned that way- doesn't make it acceptable though

But how on earth does going NC with his horrible family exclude you from yours?? I really don't see the logic of that. You want to see your family - go see them. Take your DC with you. Your H may decide, out of spite or childish tit-for-tat that he is now going to go NC with them, but that's his problem.

Your relationship with your family should not be affected by your relationship (or lack of) with your PILs. Or rather - it is entirely up to you whether it will be affected or not.

Not helpful but being divorced was wonderful. Don't be scared to think about it.

rather - I mean that if I absented myself from family ocassion a with MIL, she would be delighted. She'd love to see the DCs without me being there and essentially i would end up excluded. Further, in years to come, I don't expect her to be very nice about me to the DC. As her pattern is to do it behind my back, I don't want to give her further opportunity be letting her see the DC without me there

Frankly even if you divorced you'd still be linked to them through your kids. So you really do need to look at strategies to minimise the damage they can do.

You will always be the black sheep because you're not one of them and you're an insufficiently dutiful DIL in their opinion (I would be bloody worried if I were the groom of this upcoming wedding, but there will be fewer expectations on him because he's a guy).

Eventually I think if you want to tell to fuck off, do it - but not in the run-up to this wedding.

Really feel for you Gobbo. I was where you are a few years ago and it made me so depressed and I withdrew from DH. He always saw his parents for what they are but was completely incapable of dealing with them maturely or assertively and left it all to me. In the end we had a big argument that turned into a big discussion where I suggested we might need to consider separation if the situation didn't improve. It was the wake up call he needed. We went LC with his parents for quite some time but are now fairly amicable as the dysfunctional dynamic was somewhat reset and they realised they couldn't control us.

Do not let your parents cancel their holiday! If mil and sil kick off point out that mil wouldn't cancel her plans to accommodate your grandmothers funeral.
I would then state that you have tried to sort out childcare but been unable to. Your parents are unable to cancel their holiday as this is a long standing arrangement. As there is no additional accommodation at the wedding I cannot afford to pay for the key worker, it would cost in excess of £500 plus our own costs for attending. Therefore I will stay at home with the dc and 'd'h will be able to attend the wedding without having to worry about the dc.

You're best option (from what I've read on here) is to step back, you're DH should do everything as far as his family are concerned, you just float in the background as an observer but don't ever expect them to be bosom buddies.