Financial control - Part 2

[AngryMo]

Just starting new thread. Hopefully can kickstart it with details of my CAB meeting.

I just did the quiz too...... seriously bad.
Mo, just remember that you must keep a paper trail of what you say & his replies. So if the ultimatum conversation happens, maybe it should be on Skype, (you can record Skype) Because he will tell you he will take the children from you, you are nuts, you aren't normal, you must have been taking drink/drugs.

he WILL fight for the children, if only because he as to win, & knows that it will hurt you. He will pay for a nanny, or get his Mother to keep them. he will not just walk away & get a new gf.
So any "aggressive" threats he makes, Make sure you can prove he is a bully. You are a step ahead of him.

And why not go through the CSA?

He's surely going to be the type to deduct £40 as he had to buy new shoes or £Xx because of another spurious reason.

If you think he'll hide income that's another issue entirely.

I would go through the CSA or whatever it is called now.

If he is giving such crap amounts now what's stopping him later....?

At least if you do down the CSA route he can argue with them with little effect.

I would also suggest using email so you have proof of what has been said rather than a telephone call.

Totally relate with PP saying their mad behaviour becomes our normal and when you are out of it you look at it with fresh eyes and can't believe what you put up with and accepted.

I thought you might like to take a look at this
www.gov.uk/legal-aid/domestic-abuse-or-violence

I don't see a problem with the OP's approach to the CSA. That way she can offer her P a choice and he can choose from among:
refusing altogether and the OP can then go straight to the CSA knowing absolutely what a foul piece of work he is;
making a clear statement that he will begrudgingly only pay the absolute minimum to support his children; or
finally doing a decent thing and paying a larger amount than the minimum (flying pigs scenario).

So long as the OP makes a clear offer and doesn't let her P mess her about this looks reasonable enough. She can always default to the CSA as soon as there's the slightest hint of shittiness.

He is extremely financially abusive. He should not be given the chance to 'play fair'. He will lie about or take steps to reduce his income. He will dick about with payments. There is absolutely no reason to trust him. For £20 CMS will check his income with HMRC, tell him how much to pay, make sure he pays it and review annually. If he pays up the legal minimum there will be no further charges. It's the ideal way to deal with such a pathetic wankstain with the added bonus of not having to communicate with him at all. IMO.

Ditto kitty🤑🤑
He will try every trick in the book!! Do not give him the chance.
With HMRC there's no hiding what he earns.

Well worth £20 IMO

Hmm will have to think about to CSA or not to CSA. My rationale behind not using them is to show I am not being unreasonable in any form. But good points...his salary could shoot up and we wouldn't know a thing about it. Better to receive the minimum but know it is accurate and will be reviewed annually. It's just the whole Jeremy Kyleness of it all I wanted to get away from, finger pointing and screaming domestics.
This cannot not be unpleasant, much as I am trying to lessen the unpleasantness of it all.

Perhaps then it would be best to go to the CMS then, he only pays what the law says he has to pay - it's not you nagging or anything?

Exactly. Using the CMS makes it impersonal. It also makes it certain, so you know exactly how much money you will have every month and can therefore budget properly. If you do it by yourself, then you'll never know how much he'll give you or whether he'll give you anything. There are so many abusive men out there who use the cm as a means of punishing their exs, by withholding it or paying late or paying less. You don't want to be in that position.

There I go giving him the benefit of the doubt again. It's so hard to think someone wouldn't want to pay a fair amount for their own children but obviously it happens.

He doesn't pay a fair amount for his children now. I don't see why he'd step up once you're separated.

Sorka, Jesus yes that's true. I am still trapped in my conditioned thinking. I don't even know I'm doing it. I keep thinking he's a good bloke who loves his kids and wants the best for his family. Reality checks still needed - frequently. The fact he's not here sometimes makes me retreat into a bubble and I forget how nasty he really is.

Love how you pulled yourself up there Mo. It takes a long time to learn that there are some people to whom there is no point giving the benefit of the doubt.

Did the Skype happen today?

No. He's not mentioned it for this weekend. Anyhow we are busy so I shan't be reminding him.

You have enough on your plate. Hope you sleep well

Where you trying to get your self sorted between a low figure he gives you know and a higher CM %. Just because you said you didn't want him to think you being grabby so must be less than CMS.

Just think even if you stay on income support you will be spending more than 20% of your income on the kids and more if you do go back to work. So surely on a higher wage he can afford at least that.

In fact I would try and settle it in my own mind by saying the CMS is bear minimum. I think you can say you don't want be grabby or asking for more - so let's go for the basic amount set.

Anyway hope you are fast asleep by now!

Mo you must take cms.
He's older right? He may only be working at that level of income for five years.

So you need the high level now, if only to save lots of it.

The non married bit lessens the protection to the children in terms of assets. Divorcing is always about protecting the needs of the children. Well you're at great risk there because no claim on pension, no claim beyond 50% of house.

If he is an evil bastard then he'll simply retire! Mind you, I expect cms do take pension as his income but the percentage would greatly reduce.

Get as much money that is rightly due to the children for as long as you can.

Also in order to get your own mortgage you need proof of income of maintenance. I've just been through this.

Most the lenders scoff at any income from the Govnment. So no tax credits, no child benefit.
My tax credits pay my entire childcare bill so it's zero'd out. But the two go completely against each other.
Child care you say? Asks Mr Mortgage? Sorry. No. Your outgoings are too high.

Maintenance ? Yes. But only if court ordered or CMS. Two years proof of maintenance was required. I had to give two years of bank statements.

Jumped through bloody hoops. And they made me feel like shit..... We're not sure if the underwriters will be willing to lend to you..... Says snooty boots doing the application.

Please. It's not about trusting him. It's about proper documentation for future stuff and protecting the children.

He doesn't pay a fair amount for his children now. I don't see why he'd step up once you're separated

Well said

TBH I'd resign yourself to selling up the house and accommodating you and the DC with as small as mortgage as possible otherwise you will be in a similar situation - struggling on a tiny budget and not being able to enjoy life.

Presumably he hasn't bothered to arrange to Skype because he doesn't have any guests this weekend to show off in front of... Or perhaps those emails have actually rattled him?

I am waiting for his next visit, I envisage him, being charming, bringing presents, doing the whole number. Telling you he has been under so much pressure, he will adjust the allowance, & generally become remorseful, attentive & promise holiday, & back off re the job etc.....
You must know this may be coming, & see it for what it is.

and WRT to working and getting your ducks in a row I will just quickly tell you my story.

9 years ago I realized I would have to do the same and sort me and the children out covertly keep things ticking over and earn some money for an escape plan.

I started a business and it was pretty successful I was earning q a lot of money - do i have a penny of it? Nope!!!

Your dp will find a way to extract every penny or you'll use it to look after you and the children whilst still putting up with his crap.

Honestly if you feel there is no where for this to go just get out now deal with the crap and work towards making your life better, even though short term it might be hard. otherwise you are just wasting your time.

They don't look after you when you are together and it's sad to say they won't look after you when you separate and possibly no care even for the children - but do you want to waste even more of your life with that sort of person?

Random, sadly my emails don't appear to have rattled him. He posted something really really crass and immature about partying this weekend on fb after ignoring all but one of my points by email (obviously meant for me to see as he never posts status updates).

I hope his 'friends' are questioning why put something like that out there - his partner and kids don't even get a mention, it must seem a bit odd and immature to normal folk, a man of his age away from his family going on about partying like a teenager?

Anyhow since that update he hasn't been brazen enough to post photos or any other info there. However he doesn't realise he's left himself logged on on a different site (that I don't use) which I can access here and know exactly what he's up to - away this weekend with a friend mostly drinking beer by the looks of things. His friend must think it's odd he has had no contact at all with us or failed to get in touch.

I noticed he was showing online in Skype this morning so just dropped him a message to say his behaviour is truly despicable. I can't believe I have to bother myself with this sort of bullshit and you're right Donners, total waste of my time and energy thinking about it, getting worked up and even sending that message.