Financial control - Part 2

[AngryMo]

Just starting new thread. Hopefully can kickstart it with details of my CAB meeting.

Hmm

Have you considered an option 4?

Don't tell him yet, move away into rented perhaps near your parents (you are entitled to housing benefit whilst the sale of the house goes through)? Yes not great for the children to have to move etc. but longer term it may be the best thing for them?

I really think you do need a fresh start where you are not reliant on anything from him etc. that is my gut feeling for you. If you stay you are being controlled by his refusal to support the dc in attending their current school etc. It is easier for you to start over whilst they are younger etc.

Those are 3 options, which may or may not entail the consequences you envisage. That's 3 options you could discuss with a sol (and I agree you need an experienced one - look on the Resolution site, it tells you when they qualified)

There may be more options available to you, that you haven't thought of or come across yet. Also, as a previous PP said, any eventual offer from him can help this process - agree to nothing though, and glean any info there is in the offer.

The consequences of each that you envisage may or may not come to pass.

Get clear what your preferred outcome would be in an ideal world. This helps you to keep focussed during negotiation, although it's unlikely you'll attain exactly what you want.

*oops editing fail

Option 4: I tell him it's over and I want to sell. He says no, I'm not selling my house don't be stupid. I stay in the house pretending I am unhappy about it so he thinks he has won but I have actually got exactly what I want.

Option 5: I tell him it's over and we need to come to an agreement about living arrangements because I think it's crucial the children stay where they are. He makes life difficult, then we sell the house with him paying all the costs and pushing it through because he thinks he is screwing me over, but actually I wanted to sell the house all along.

Option 6: as option 5 but with you getting way way more than 50% of the house on the agreement that he pays lower/no child maintenance monthly.

From your descriptions of him it sounds like he would do anything to make sure you lose, i.e. the opposite of whatever you request. He also probably has big fat savings stashed somewhere.

Sorry, not ignoring messages, just continuing to think aloud...
I'm just wondering if I can combine options in my message to him. I think the best place is for the children to stay where they are so we need to come to an amicable arrangement so they can stay in the house and I can continue to look after them so their daily lives are as unaffected as possible. We can sell once our youngest is in school full time and I'm able to work.
Hmmm yeah right, like Mr Caring and Considerate is going to give a shit. And no idea what sort of agreement that would be. Even if he continues to pay the mortgage I can't guarantee I'd be able to afford to run the house on my own whilst my earning capacity is limited.

Maybe I can let him come up with a suggestion what to do? Who knows, I might be surprised.

All my indecisiveness is probably because I've had too much time to think as well. If he were here, we'd have had an argument, I'd have said something and things would have just evolved as they are. In a way I feel like there are just too many options to consider. I'm probably making this way more complicated than it needs to be.

I think you need to split it into tell. First you need get the great big shit hurdle over of actually telling him, via email or whatever. Then you can work out details later. Realistically he's away he's not going to
Do anything for next few weeks months. He will need advice too so makes sense he keeps paying what's he's doing. Plus you can claim once it's offical.

Even if he did say he give you what you need there so many what ifs that could come up probable best not to get to far ahead of selves. If he didn't keep pYimg mortgage council tax then he's at risk of losing money and bad credit record which would presume mean more to
Him than you do? So least that side of it would be covered.

Feel free to keep shouting out, not that we are much help but!

Is there really not anything of yours or his you can sell that he not notice so least get yourself some legal advice. Can you apply for a credit card and put it on that? By the time your benefits kick in you should have enough to cover it.

It's perfectly valid to say "I want to end this relationship and we both need time to work out what comes next". I would certainly hesitate to get into a discussion about wanting the children to stay in their home because it shows him your hand. It shows him what you care about most, which means it will be the one thing he takes away from you - after dangling it in front of you for months, if only you will obey him. Plus, you will say 'this is best for the children' and what he will hear is 'this is how I get my hands on the house'.

I think you need to talk to a few more firms, your advice hasn't been helpful (although I think you need to be realistic that you may well find yourself unable to get more than a share equivalent to the financial contribution you've made to the house).

I agree with Random, though - I would cut your losses and go. I would think that the difference in the size of the settlement you would get if you fight this and what you can get through simple property law would almost certainly be swallowed up in the legal fees, not to mention being incredibly stressful and he would likely take it out on the children to get to you. I would hope any decent solicitor would be honest with you about this, i.e. we might get 30 grand more but the legal bills are likely to be 25 grand, do you want to proceed?

I think you can just say. Our relationship is over. I'm not prepared to live like this any more. When you had time to think about it let me know how you want to proceed.

Then you can keep going about informing yourself. See what his plans abc are. See if you can come up with a compromise that you can live with. I think you need to forget about what you are entitled to and work out what you need. Work out both and negotiate down from entitled to actual need. Hope that helps.

Such a shame about the crap solicitor. ime with my first free half hour we cracked through a huge amount in half an hour (more like 40 minutes) and I came out relieved, overjoyed and high. The relief was immense. And that's what you should have had, or something like it.

I get it you aren't married so it's not as straightforward as it was for me. But you shouldn't have come out more confused/powerless than ever. Do get on to Womens Aid for a list of sympathetic/knowledgeable/experienced solicitors - the difference with one who knows their stuff in situations like this is immense. Chalk and cheese.

Hopefully your next appt will be more illuminating and encouraging. ime with the RIGHT solicitor I just blubbed the whole way through, despite being prepared (or so I thought) to logically go through what I wanted to say/ask. It didn't work out like that but she picked up the pieces and made sense of them - largely because there is a uniformity about relationships where 'coercive control' is a feature which is easy to recognise.

Next! Keep going love

The one thing that you have as an advantage at the moment that you will never again is the ability to move away from the area you currently live in.

If you move away now whilst he is unaware then he would struggle to get the courts to make you move back because he hasn't been there and by the time he got his act together etc. the DC would have settled and you can show you have support.

Long term even if you work could you afford to buy a home in your current area? I get the impression that you live somewhere expensive that without his goodwill you cannot afford to remain in and once split he can force you stay local and trapped and him still in control.

I think staying in the house is going to be a nightmare. He will not want to pay for a mortgage on a house that he isn't living in & he can't rent... (.no financial advantage for him) even if you are technically allowed to stay, it just means he has unending ways to make your life miserable. Also as you say the bills will be huge.
Staying in an expensive area because the kids are at school there is not a good idea. But, he may decide he wants/demands for them to go to X school for snob/education value. In which case he has to allow you to have suitable accom in that area. so he will have to negotiate. However, do NOT accept he finds you a flat & buys/rents it for you. You do NOT want him as a landlord, or responsible for paying your rent. (for obvious reasons)
You need as little contact with him as possible, other than re DCs. By law however he could limit how far you move, if he chose to.
His parents apparently live near you? so he may want to group all of you together, for his own convenience. (child care)
The DCs are young & can be happy in any school in reality.
So I honestly believe that you should sell & get you half. You can still rent until the time comes for you to be sure what you want to do.

Severing financial ties (other than his obligatory payment re children, decided by a the relevant authority) with him seems like ultimate logic, a she has, is & will continue to dangle you like a puppet.

sorry x post with Random

in an email you could just say something on the lines of

Following the last months of silence & flagrant disinterest, I have sadly been obliged to make the decision to separate.
I think you will agree that our relationship is irredeemably damaged & in honesty probably be relieved it is over.
Now in the cold logic of any failed family situation, we need to decide what is best for the children primarily, & ourselves.
Will you please tell me in what order you would place these solutions:

1. sell the house to split accordingly
2. buy out my share
3. pay the mortgage to enable the children & I to stay put whilst they are young to enable them to stay in their present schools.

Please be assured that my legal advisers will be in contact.

Angry

although as stated above. if you move now, he wouldn't even know.

TBH I'm not sure I'd even put no 3 on the list, I could see him your life so difficult and continual miserable

Frankly, having been following this from day one, I wouldn't want to be in a position where he had any control over my living situation. I accept this may be easier said than done but he's already demonstrated that he is controlling and I wouldn't want to give him further opportunities to be so.

If it was me, I'd be pushing for a sale unless a buyout was an option (which as I've understood it isn't really the case?).

I'd also refrain from any accusatory emails at this stage, not matter how much he deserves it. It won't help and will only make you feel better in the short term. He appears to prefer dealing with facts and figures, so I'd keep it neutral, at least until you know how the land lies. But that's just my 2p.

Im at the other end of many years of post-divorce from a controlling man and I'd have to agree it is better to cut as many financial ties as possible - along the lines of a clean break if at all possible.

A pp suggested he may have a stash somewhere - I wouldn't be surprised, but getting to it is quite another thing. Is he self-employed?

I would give absolutely basic info in a dear john email. Re I want to separate, we will need to arrange the details, correspondence from my solicitor to follow to that effect. Basic, no frills.

NOTHING is worth staying within their power: not houses, not schools. Voice of experience here

Your kids aren't at mainstream school yet so you are much more flexible about where you live.

I know this is hard

Your PILs have such a dysfunctional relationship I would be keen for them to see a lot more of your parents if they would be demonstrating a healthy relationship to them. Also they could support you whilst you retrain etc?

Huge hugs and more

Wow wow wow. A lot of messages, a lot to take in. But overwhelmingly I definitely agree that: I need to separate myself financially as much as possible. I've already distanced myself emotionally from this house over the past few months (normally I'd be a DIY and garden freak and be sorting out anything that needed fixing and planning for the next season but no, not this time). I've stopped thinking of it as a home, and more as just a house. An asset. A house without love is just that. My kids will be happy anywhere I am to shower them with the love they deserve (doesn't help that DS said on the way home today 'we live in a small house, don't we?', only because he was comparing it to a friend who lives in a bloody mansion ).
But I don't think I see my future here any more and I'm not bothered about that. Yes I love that I have great neighbours and friends nearby but but but...I'll miss them terribly but I can't stick around just for them, as much as I will miss them.
I have to take the plunge, tell him we need to sell it. My gut keeps telling me that. Sell. Move on, make a new life for myself. However I do not want to move area. I don't want a drastic change. Just a small move, only a downsize, but be near everything and everyone that matters to us.
In vino veritas...I thought maybe wine would make me worse but ok I may be falsely chirpy, but I'm sure I'll feel the same in the morning.
I may sleep on it, I may not...I may send an email at 4am or I may not...I am going to see how I feel but I know that I'm not prepared to fight for some bricks and mortar and yet still be tied to him, ugh no way.

No, don't tell him the options, let the legals sort that out when the time comes. Tell him, when you're ready, you're leaving the relationship.

He's going to do that upper hand thing forever, it's a given. You can expect it. And? It doesn't stop you leaving him.

I do hope you get what you want - your friends and your community. You don't know what's ahead - but you do know the first step. A darn great step in my book. Bravo!

As Dory would say:

Don't give him options as that really is letting him stay in control.

Tell him it's over and that the house must be sold, then as others have said let the solicters deal with anything else.

For your own sanity just tell him that your relationship has broken down and that you want to split (avoid any he did this/that, cause as you say he isn't very nice when pushed into a corner).