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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

this hit home - bloke's blog

241 replies

stealtheatingtunnocks · 26/01/2016 11:03

This is exactly what is wrong in my marriage.

Hadn't realised there was a nail, let alone that it needed hitting on it's head.

I am going to try to articulate to my husband why I need him to stack the glass in the dishwasher. Again. Sigh.

mustbethistalltoride.com/2016/01/14/she-divorced-me-because-i-left-dishes-by-the-sink/

OP posts:
suzannecaravaggio · 28/01/2016 11:28

IMO the problem is intractable
I life alone and can't imagine wanting to ever share my living space again

IrianofWay · 28/01/2016 12:05

I just can't seem to make DH CARE about the things I care about. I used to imagine leaving him at home with all three kids for a week just so he could see how many fucking miracles I acheived on a daily basis (because reasoned discussion, shouting, writing lists and sobbing all failed).

One day I did just that - well only a few days as it happened. What was the result? Everyone had clothes to wear, got fed, dishes were washed as needed and the children were washed and brushed. BUT.... the house looked like a bomb had hit it, the fridge was almost empty because when he went shopping he only bought what was needed for that day, and there was a mountain of washing.

It wasn't that he couldn't see the mess and the lack of order...he just didn't care. I am the only one who does care about it in a house of 5, all but one of whom are more or less adults now. So who is wrong? I have learned to use tunnel vision - I just see the bits of the house that are reasonable tidy and ignore the areas of chaos - it's just easier that way. When I am an ancient widow I WILL live in a tidy house with wooden floors and wipe clean blinds and no clutter and I will be at peace.....

TempusEedjit · 28/01/2016 12:09

Who eventually tackled the mountain of washing and restored order Irian?

suzannecaravaggio · 28/01/2016 12:24

The person who suffers most ( as a result of the chaos and untidiness) has the least power

In this equation any suffering counts, guilt anger, wasted time, mental effort required to develop a strategy to cope

IfNotNowThenWhenever · 28/01/2016 12:26

I am the sole adult in my house, and I like the fact that I can let the dishes pile up if I feel like it, but I could never, ever settle for a man who needed telling to do basic household tasks, or how to do them.
This thread is making me miss my ex boyfriend, who, while being emotionally stunted, was actually a proper man when it came to everyday life. He would ring me up and say " can I cook you dinner tonight?", turn up with all the ingredients and make me something delicious. And he would wash up after.
Definitely sexy. And rich incidentally .
If I could find that in a man who wasn't hopelessly damaged I would be laughing.

suzannecaravaggio · 28/01/2016 12:28

I am the only one who does care about it in a house of 5

And that is what renders you powerless

IrianofWay · 28/01/2016 12:29

Both of us - but mostly me.

suzannecaravaggio · 28/01/2016 12:30

. He would ring me up and say " can I cook you dinner tonight?", turn up with all the ingredients and make me something delicious. And he would wash up after

May have just been a strategy to get his feet under the table
Bait and switch
Once he's in suddenly you're his bitch

IrianofWay · 28/01/2016 12:31

I know suzanne hence my strategy of largely letting it go.

No-one would starve without me, no-one would go naked, laundry and washing up would be done as it was needed but the house would be a mess but if I am the only one who care who's to say i am in the right?

suzannecaravaggio · 28/01/2016 12:38

I'm not sure what you mean by 'right' Iran?

IfNotNowThenWhenever · 28/01/2016 12:43

May have just been a strategy to get his feet under the table.Bait and switch. Once he's in suddenly you're his bitch

Ooh, you cynic! Nah, honestly, he was just a competent grown up (wrt to practicalities ), with a tendency to care take ( he would do stuff for others, get a bit put upon, that sort of thing, so not just me)
Lolling at the thought of me being anybodies Bitch Grin

suzannecaravaggio · 28/01/2016 12:46

I am a cynic and no mistake!
It is a common strategy, albeit not part of a strategy in your case If notWink

KitKats28 · 28/01/2016 12:50

I don't think you can ever have it all ways though. Why does the way one person wants things done trump the way the other person does it.

People are saying that their husband (or wife) doesn't do X or Y or Z but then when they do it it's wrong anyway so what's the point in doing something if you are only going to get moaned at.

Example: my husband always rearranged the dishwasher as I didn't stack it how he wants it. I on the other hand couldn't care less how it is stacked. So I don't bother. I leave the things on the side and he can arrange it to his specifications. However, I don't do this as a "fuck you" or with any animosity. I simply said to him "if it's important to you, you do it".

If I want something done, I do it. If he wants something done, he does it. I pointed out to him a long time ago that he is not "helping me" if he does something in the house. He is simply doing something in the house. That we all live in. I do say thank you if he does something, but then equally he says thank you to me too.

I think that a lot of people are infantilising their partners simply because they don't do things their way. Why is your way of doing things so much better and more important than your partner's?

TempusEedjit · 28/01/2016 12:58

MH issues aside I would say there's a difference between someone who genuinely doesn't care, and someone who doesn't care not because theyre not fussed either way but because they're either too lazy or they know that somebody else will eventually pick up after them.

Say we could wave a magic wand and choose to live in a tidy environment or in a mess regardless of any effort on our part - I think the majority of people would prefer to live in the tidy environment. I can't for example imagine many people being happy to turn up to a hotel room that was immaculately clean but with an unmade bed, clean towels crumpled up, the coffee making facilities strewn about the place etc. Therefore expecting the default standard to be reasonably tidy rather than bomb site is not unreasonable and it is not wrong of you to have that expectation especially as he knows you care about it which is the point of the blog post I think.

I agree with you kitkats that dictating how someone does something that needs doing, as long as the end result is similar, is not on. However expecting someone to pick up after themselves is not infantilising them.

suzannecaravaggio · 28/01/2016 13:08

Say we could wave a magic wand and choose to live in a tidy environment or in a mess regardless of any effort on our part - I think the majority of people would prefer to live in the tidy environment

And not just for aesthetic reasons
It is easier and more efficient to have a tidy and organized home
Mess compounds

wasabipeanut · 28/01/2016 13:10

This is indeed a very interesting discussion. I came home from a morning of flat out strand running, dog walking etc. at 12 having collected DS2 from nursery. DH was at home until around 11 when he left for a meeting. The dishwasher was 90% full and needing to be run. The cafetière and his cup & plate were in the sink.

I often get told how lucky I am to have him because he actually looks after his own children occasionally and isn't a total slob and man child.

Yet I'm always busy, always sorting shit out and often angry. I wonder why?

wasabipeanut · 28/01/2016 13:11

That was errand running btw. No idea what strand running is 😳

0verNow · 28/01/2016 13:34

This is exactly why marriage reached crisis point.

We both worked full time, had 2 children, but I did all of the wifework. And he wouldn't listen to me telling him, over and over and over again, that I was at breaking point.

He used to say that the things I cared about didn't matter; they mattered to me.

In the end he did do a little more - under instruction, still taking no responsibility for the thinking - but it was too late. I'd already detached.

(Once I'd started pulling that thread it also turned out that he was serially unfaithful and financially abusive - I can't wait to be rid of him.)

wasabipeanut · 28/01/2016 13:38

Hey Overnow I wish you a bright future and I hope it starts soon for you.

BreakingDad77 · 28/01/2016 14:29

StillDrSethHazlittMD - Weird. I'm a man. I have a dishwasher. I always put things away immediately. I vacuum, I dust, I put the bins out, I do the washing, I do the ironing, I do the cooking. I do all this without being asked

Agreed, though DW gets annoyed with me leaving odd cereal box out or flour from baking but I get annoyed with her every day putting bowls or glasses with yoghurt pots/fruit stalks/peel/uneaten food etc inside them in sink or next to it rather then the dishwasher! right next to sink and the lables/food/ in the bin which is a metre away. She also always burns the bottom of saucepan with her cheesy pasta stuff everytime but gets the hump if I come in kitchen and say to turn the heat down a bit/ try to stir it.

I give up now, it just goes around in circles.

ample · 28/01/2016 15:29

bertrandrussell yes I am, because my MIL is void of all common sense. She too is a lazy thinker and believes the same as her son (in that no one will care if said chores are not done). It's fine, it's fine with a few wafts of her hand is what I get from her regarding any requests she hears me make in front of her eldest 'boy'.
Again, it all comes down to different standards.
If only I knew back then what I know now. I would run for the hills for sure.

mix56 · 28/01/2016 16:03

but its not the cup ! its mutual respect.

When P is say, pouring a concrete floor, I don't walk over his wet concrete. when asked not to,
So why when I wash the floor, does he walk over it in builder's boots, when I ask him to take them off when he comes in ?
Is he mentally impaired, doesn't give a shit about clean or dirty floor, or is he just a selfish bastard?

BoffinMum · 28/01/2016 16:04

Well obviously it is not just about a glass. It's about being an adult, and doing things as a team.

There will have been countless versions of the glass incident where the bloke just thought 'I don't have to make an effort for my wife' and the glass will be the tip of the iceberg. There will have been shoes in front of doors, bread he couldn't be bothered to get out of the freezer, empty packets put back in the fridge, skid marks in the toilet, full hoover bags, empty petrol tanks in the car, run down batteries, procrastinated repairs, damaged domestic items, lost passports and forgotten errands or messages. In. Their. Hundreds.

Meanwhile the wife will have been circling around endlessly trying to smooth over various minor domestic hiccups and wrinkles practically on an hourly basis, probably while holding down a job and looking after kids, and one day she will have asked herself "Do I really need this man child in my life?' Meanwhile her husband was apparently oblivious to the fact she was taking so much responsibility for everything minor, trivial and everyday in his life. Because otherwise, frankly, either or both of them would go under.

Any one of the minor infractions sounds ridiculous on their own. A glass on the side (even I do that, frankly)? A messy toilet? Forgetting to defrost something? Never changing the hoover bag? Letting the petrol run down? Grounds for divorce??? Only for a mad person. But what this man has recognised in the blog post is that it is not about that. Before he saw the light, he expected his wife to be the grown up at all times and plug all the holes in their domestic life. Then the day came when he had effectively worn her out. By the time he recognised this, it was too late and she had moved on emotionally.

Moral of the story is if you want a relationship to work, don't treat the other person like a household appliance, your mother/father, or a member of your domestic staff.

AdriftOnMemoryBliss · 28/01/2016 16:57

Math... its the questions that go with it that annoy me.

Why is there a tablet on the arm of my sofa? (because thats where i put it)
Why is the drying up not done? (because i leave it to drain)
Why is there a pile of washing in the bay window? (because i left it there to take upstairs with me later)

Its this constant need for the house to be to his preferences when he's only in it for a few hours of an evening and there are 3 other people living here.

Just makes me want to tell him to fuck off!

suzannecaravaggio · 28/01/2016 16:59

"When P is say, pouring a concrete floor, I don't walk over his wet concrete. when asked not to,
So why when I wash the floor, does he walk over it in builder's boots, when I ask him to take them off when he comes in ?
Is he mentally impaired, doesn't give a shit about clean or dirty floor, or is he just a selfish bastard?"

concrete floor is an important mans thing, he has created it out of concrete his work has status and must be respected

cleaning the floor is just maintenance, menial work, barely gets acknowledged, invisible activity which happens in the background the people who do it are therefore seen to be menial and not deserving of respect