Unresolvable fall out with friend, but don't completely understand why.

[SpoonSpoonSpoon]

Would appreciate some views on this.

Have been friends with this person since I was ten. She was bridesmaid at my wedding, and godmother to my DC. Her dad offered to film my wedding this summer as a wedding present, we gratefully accepted, thanked him publicly at the wedding and privately. We didn't hear anything about the video for a while, which was not an issue, but relevant.

I miscarried a very much wanted baby two weeks after the wedding. We didn't know I was pregnant at the wedding, but this put a bitter edge to everything related to it. Friend knew this.

Then early November I miscarried again. It broke me. And physically had complications second time around.

Friend's dad messaged me whilst I was miscarrying with a link to YouTube with our wedding video. I wasn't in a place to view it, neither was DH, so I left it. A few hours after he sent the message, friend messages me asking why we hadn't looked at it yet. I explained what was going on, and said I hoped to look at it soon. She sent back what seemed to be an understanding text. At this point I say with high insight that I know I should have contacted him myself, but was in no place to speak to anyone really.

Two days later she uploaded it to Facebook, knowing we hadn't watched it, knowing why. I was getting messages from people about the video. DH and I were both upset, and I asked her to take it down, again explaining why. In response I got a nasty message saying I was being unappreciative and immature, that he hard worked really hard on it, and she was extremely disappointed in me. I didn't respond as was trying to look beyond one falling out, as well as still feeling like absolute crap.

A few days later she messaged pretty normally asking for ideas for DC Christmas. I was pretty much ignoring my phone at this point, so genuinely didn't see the message. So the next day I got a more impatient message. This time I did see it, and replied asking her to please leave me alone for now. To this she sent back a message about throwing away a friendship because I didn't know when to say thank you, and not to contact her again unless it was an apology.

The next day one of my other bridesmaids called me. Friend had contacted her saying she wanted ideas gir DC, but really it was just to bitch. She went as far as to ask whether she should set up a savings account for DC, as she thought I was being petty enough to throw away any gift she sent, and didn't know when she'd next be allowed to see DC. All of which seemed incredibly over the top.

Next morning I received a final message, which was so cruel and cutting I can't stand to look at it again to quote, then she deleted me, having made it very clear I wouldn't be hearing from her again.

I acknowledge - personally, to her, ands to her dad as well, in a message I sent him - that I should have told him personally I would view it when I could, but honestly I was a complete mess. I could just about pretend to function for DC, but the trauma on top of physical side of things... I wasn't thinking straight.

I'm very hurt by the way she has reacted, and it seems very over the top a reaction for me - when boiled down to it - not watching a video immediately.

Just wanted some opinions on things.

Thank you.

*who is not being deliberately nasty, that should have said.

Do people really think, when hearing of a friend's second miscarriage within 6 months, that because they'd be ok within 2 days and carry on as normal, that everyone else would do too? And then make absolutely zero allowances as a result? Some people might deal with a miscarriage by carrying on fairly quickly apparently as normal. That clearly isn't the only reaction that's possible or normal. I'm surprised how many people here seem to lack any real empathy for someone else who deals with things in a different way. (Neither reaction is right or wrong btw).

"it certainly makes her someone I'd not want to be friends with. "inconsiderate" "unthinking" "insensitive"

But OP has not told her friend she thinks she has behaved that way. The friend has no idea. Life is a learning process for many of us. Many of us think a different way about things when someone MAKES us see it differently by explaining their point of view. If after that the friend has not changed their position then that's the point youcan accuse them of being inconsiderate and unthinking etc, and moving on from the friendship. You can't have these deep discussions over text or FB, you just can't. people need to pick up the phone and TALK to sort their issues out.

Curly "The friend has no idea."

exactly! That's the problem. I wouldn't want to be friends with someone who needed an explanation of what she had done wrong in this situation.

Sometimes things do need to be talked through but sometimes you are just not on the same planet, much less wavelength and it sounds like one of those cases to me.

flogginmolly i found what you SAID rude. And insensitive.

"What I said was that I have had multiple miscarriages which devastated me; naturally, (I have also lost both parents within 6 weeks of each other) but I didn't have the luxury of being completely incapacitated with grief for very long, I had other children to be there for, for one thing."

Your subsequent post is worse.

1. Grief is not a competitive sport
2. You are not the gold standard for dealing with grief/MC and so how YOU dealt with things is not how everyone deals with it.
3. Saying things like "i didnt have the luxury" implies the OP was being weak/self indulgent - she wasnt. She was just not coping.

Second what Lorelei says, Spoons.

Curly as I understand it the OP explained why she was upset to friend (& enough) and neither, upon hearing it, seemed to think her feelings were justified. 'But I don't get it' is not a good reason to ride roughshod over someone's wishes for privacy when they've explained their reasons for needing it.

There are plenty of people who can be lovely company when things are going well, but who - for whatever reason - are unable to show care when you're hurting, or are angry when your needs mean you cannot tend to theirs. It may not be their fault (it probably isn't - nobody asks to have narcissistic personality disorder, for example!). But it's certainly not your fault for protecting yourself from their demands when you are vulnerable.

Sometimes removing yourself from a painful stimulus (/relationship / thread) is the best way of looking after yourself at least in the immediate short term. And if other people want to judge you for it they can have at it on their own till the cows come home. On that note, I am removing myself from this. Goodnight and good luck!

It sounds like your friendship works as long as you are available for "friend" to lean on but don't expect for the same in return.

I'm so sorry for your miscarriages and a "friend" who is creating drama when you just want calm and space to heal.

Third what lorelei said.

The OP did explain what had happened - she makes that clear in the OP. Her friend then chose to go ahead and do something that she had no right to do - or certainly not without checking with the OP first, but anyone with an ounce of common sense would realise that it wasn't the time/place.

Yes, the OP can sit down and talk - but quite why she would want to waste her breath on someone who has no empathy, understanding, kindness or respect I can't imagine.

It was the Dad not the friend uploading the video. We don't know if there was prior agreement he would put it online when edited. We don't know if he knew op's situation.

The friend with mh issues, is guilty of hassling op a few days before Xmas about gifts ops child wants, to inform her of the video and going to another about the gifts and help understanding why she was told to go away by op. Not great behaviour, not quite the monster some are portraying her either.

We do seem to agree this friendship is finished.

Maybe friend would find talking and a happy video helpful when grieving, clearly not what something that suits op.

And you think her petty, self-absorbed histrionics might help the OP when grieving, too? Or is it just that she is a selfish thundercunt who appears to be enraged that the OP is now the one needing support and someone to lean on, instead?

But OP has not told her friend she thinks she has behaved that way. The friend has no idea.

"Friend" knows that OP had two miscarriages of longed-for babies. "Friend" sees fit to throw enraged tantrums and to send vile emails in the wake of this.

I am genuinely disturbed that so many apparently need a diagram on how affected people can be by grief, and how entitled to a bit of gentle handling at such a time.

Indeed. So-called friend was made aware. I think badgering someone dealing with grief is totally uncalled for.

The phrase "selfish thundercunt" has made me laugh - thank you.

Dad emailed me the video, friend uploaded, to clarify.

Molly - I am sorry for your losses. However it isn't fair to say that your timeline should equal mine.

Two miscarriages in five months, with a history of gyne issues, the possibility of damage to my reproductive system, combined with the knowledge of losses in my immediate family hanging above me. Yes I am traumatised. Yes I am falling apart. I am trying very hard to get back to normal, but I don't know what normal is any more. If miscarriage hasn't affected you in the same way, I am genuinely pleased for you. But as much as I wouldn't judge someone for being back to functioning the next day, please do not judge me for the way my body and brain are processing it.

I apologise, Spoon. I was out of order.

I'm horrified at some of the insensitive responses you have received Spoon. Anyone coming on to a thread pic like this and attempting to take the moral high ground with someone who has been bereaved...well frankly, they should have their fingers bound together with duct tape before they're allowed anywhere near a keyboard.

I think your ex-friend has behaved horribly and it's unsuprising you are hurt. Please be kind to yourself.

thread pic? I mean thread.

Who are the children she's buying gifts for?!

Has she behaved like this to you before?

Walter - the OP's children. Bit that you needed to ask that.

OP I'm so sorry for your losses. You have every right to take however long you need to grieve.

I think it's one of those friendship situations which can only be solved by a face to face conversation. Maybe you could suggest one.

The only justifiable reason for what she did was that her dad was on her case or that she was trying to get attention because she felt shut out. It sounds like it has been full of misunderstanding from the start and you both need to put your view across.

Then you can decide whether or not your friendship is salvageable.

I understand what it's like to be pretty much broken by a set of circumstances, and have other people know this but decide that you must carry on regardless.

OP

OP I am so sorry for your losses and I'm afraid at best your ex friend has behaved insensitively and ignorantly.

There are also a number of posts on here that are shockingly insensitive, thoughtless and ignorant. I'm particularly shocked at ones like this who've had mc themselves!

Everyone experiences bereavements of all kinds differently and copes differently. Even the same people cope differently at different times. My first mc I told almost nobody and just 'got on with things' -terrible idea. When I mc again years later it all came home to roost!

In addition to other bereavements there's the physical effects, blaming yourself (I did anyway and from various chat boards and friends I hear this is common with mc), fear of never being a mother, hormone fluctuations...

I strongly recommend the less understanding posters on this thread READ some of the threads on mc here and elsewhere and educate themselves. It's a very misunderstood and under discussed issue anyway.

op

Because I got confused, lorelei. Is that OK with you?

No, it's not fine, Walter.
now stand in the corner

Morning all
Just a reminder that Mumsnet's raison d'être is to make lives easier and that in the season of good will, we can all do with a bit of peace and love
Merry Christmas