Think DD has just destroyed relationship with DH her dad. Final straw.

[Facefacts]

After a long rocky period with DD 17, I thought things were getting better. Again, tonight, DD determined to get her own way. Wanted boyfriend to come over we said no as I had to be away all day and overnight, husband had to leave later as working away. So after I left mid afternoon she has massive argument with poor DH who is already having counselling (partly from previous rocky period as well as other things). She is so unsympathetic and uncaring and verbally very attacking. DH in pieces, DD just continued attack. And flounced off to boyfriends saying would be back for 11. Just arriving back now. Refused lift back and DH couldn't face scene if just went to fetch her. He now has two hour drive and has to be up early. He's broken and I'm fuming with her. She has a brilliant social life. Saw boyfriend 2 or 3 times in week. Nightclub Friday and friend stayed over Saturday. Don't know how this is going to go but we have been on edge of throwing her out before for stunts like this. Is this what we have to do to save DH from total breakdown. When she decides she is doing something there is no compromise, no care of the impact on others. It seems the more understanding and caring we are the more she takes. Someone please give me a plan to change this before she throws away a lovely home and family.

Sorry Facefacts, crossposted. I wish you can resolve this situation pretty soon, whichever way you think is the right way.

And all that for what? Because after clubbing on Friday night and having a friend stay over Saturday night leaving only Sunday afternoon, she couldn't then have a brand new boyfriend her parents don't even know sleep over in the house with her.

No cote, not just because of that - this is where previous posts are relevant.

The OP posted about an almost identical situation a year ago. Her DD was asked stay home on one particular evening in order to prevent disturbing her father before he left for a work trip.
So she arranged to stay out of the home overnight in order to avoid disturbing her parents, which was their stated request.

But, that wasn't good enough for the OP or her DH. Once the DD had found a way to meet her parents stated needs, those needs changed.

And I defy anyone - least of all a teenage girl - to calmly and meekly accept that no matter how hard they try to please their parents, they will never be good enough. Have you read the Stately Homes thread? Full of people like the OP's DD, who have never felt that they are good enough for their parents, and who feel guilty and responsible for the things their parents attribute to their poor behaviour.

You are missing out the bit where she was also told to stay home alone, to make her father feel better even though brother parent was there.
It's fucking weird and stinks of just trying to exert control because they can.
I bet the dd has clocked on to how dysfunctional her family are.

"Once the DD had found a way to meet her parents stated needs, those needs changed. "

I haven't read that other thread so don't know about that incident. I'm going by what I see on this thread.

I bet the dd has clocked on to how dysfunctional her family are.

I hope so Oswin - because the OP definitely still has her head buried in the sand.

The only person who would recognise the OP from this thread is the OPs DH - and as she has been unwaveringly supportive of him, I fail to see why that would concern her.

I think the OP wants it deleted because she has been challenged and some of the comments are a bit too close to the truth for her liking.

"she was also told to stay home alone, to make her father feel better even though brother parent was there."

Again, she wasn't told to stay home to make her father feel better the way I read the thread.

She was told to come home earlier than she did (past midnight) before her father leaves for a two-hour drive, presumably because it was expected (as is normal) for her to have a quite night home before school on Monday, especially in view of the active social life she has had all weekend.

You know, parents need to have some control in the households, children are not flatmates, they are people the parents are responsible for, not babies that should be attended to every time they cry. If the parents ask their kid to do something in consideration towards the need of the family is not the end of the world.

Personally, I wouldn't want DS staying somewhere else or bringing strangers to the house if I am away. My friend's son was left on his own, and what started as a pizza night ended up with 100s of teenagers trashing the house when someone advertised it as a party in Facebook. So I don't think asking DD to stay in is necessarily about control, it may be just about ensuring she is safe while they are not around to help.

I haven't read that other thread so don't know about that incident. I'm going by what I see on this thread

Cote - so your advice is ill informed then? You are not even giving advice based on the full story as the OP has told it?

Ill informed advice can be misguided, or even dangerous, can't it?

TheTiger: "Children are not flatmates, they are people the parents are responsible for."

This is kind of what most of us have been driving at for over 300 posts...

I don't think anyone here has "the full story" as you put it. Do you know what the PTSD is about and how OP's DD is involved?

Yes Sheba and now you need to read the rest of Tiger's post.

And if you're wondering how a 17 year old gets into a night club, there is quite a trade in borrowed ids that goes on as they all know 18 or 19 year olds who loan them out. Unfortunately if you live in an area where their friends do it from the age of about 15 then you are pressured into allowing it "just this once it is xxx birthday I'm the only one of my friends not going" then to I'm going and you can't stop me. I've thrown away a couple of ids I've found. But they keep turning up again or they meet friends to give them out in town. I've managed to delay her going as long as i could but literally almost all of the young people round here do it. If the clubs relied on the business of those 18+ they would close down. It is not ideal and quite honestly I wish I hadn't gone down that route but so determined is my DD to do what she wants at times she would just go. Quite happy to be criticised for it. I'm not happy about it either. Unfortunately the group of friends they are with determines a lot of this. I wish it wasn't so but it is, we don't parent in isolation.

Nobody wonders how 17 year olds get into nightclubs.

I haven't read that other thread so don't know about that incident. I'm going by what I see on this thread

A deliberate misquote, cote - I said "the full story as the OP has told it".

I agree with you, I don't think anyone knows the full story, so any advice is ill informed. However, on internet forums, it is convention to accept the OP at face value and give advice based on their posts.

The fact that you admit you are wilfully ignoring other posts made by the OP, which place what she has said on this thread in context, suggests that you are less interested in genuinely helping the OP, and more interested in contradicting other posters.

We were both away for the night 100 or so miles away unfortunately so she was home alone. Which is why we wanted to know she was safe at home. Only the second or third time left alone. Why do people keep making stuff up? How is this controlling?

Op,in a previous thread you stated you wished your dc would put dh first.
Can you not see what is wrong with that.
That is the thread where he threatened to leave you because of the dc and the fact you aren't organised enough.
You say dd doesn't know she's partly to blame yet in October he was telling you ,while refusing to see a dr, that if he had to seek help for his mental health he would never forgive you or the dc.

Op she didn't want to be home alone though and there is nothing wrong with that!

It is not ideal and quite honestly I wish I hadn't gone down that route but so determined is my DD to do what she wants at times she would just go.

Well of course she would OP, but you don't have to faciliate it! Doing things behind your parents back, hoping you don't get caught, and suffering the consequences if you do, is part of growing up.

In your effort to maintain the stability of your homelife and your DH's mental health, you have robbed your DD of this learning experience.

Most, if not all parents know that their DC's are probably sneaking into clubs under age. They are prepared to pick up the peices if things go wrong, and are willing to enforce consequences if the DC's get too "cocky" and flout the rules openly.

Your job as a parent is not to avoid conflict with your DC's as they are growing up. Your job is to teach them the skills to manage it. By avoiding the situations that your DH struggles with, your DD has not learnt how to accept the consequences of getting caught.

Sheba. A couple of people did ask. It might not be the case in other areas. I think some clubs look more closely at ids than others. If they look too closely they make less money.

The husband really doesn't sound as fragile and delicate as OP claims he is.

So what, you knew your DD was going to clubs when she was 15? I'm sorry OP but no, I can't sympathise with any of that.

And there are some on this thread who say you are controlling and that you don't let your DD live her life. MN can be weird sometimes.

Yes cote you can go to some club nights at 17 here. You can also go into a bar.

And yes lots of people have that sort of busy social life. I know it seems a shock to you but they do. It not wrong, and several ones I know all went on to top Universities. They are just living differently to you. Some others have more " worthy" social lives. A social whirl of training for a sport, up early etc. If she had been training instead of doing a social life would your thoughts be the same?

In which case you are more judgemental re the type if social life not that fact she wanted one.

It would be quite legal cote