"leagues" of attractiveness - who's out of your league?!

[DraenorQueen]

So, I'm fat. Size 22, 5 foot 7. Huge boobs but undeniably fat. I'm sociable though... genuine, intelligent (i like to think!!) and have an acceptably pleasant face. I've slept with many men, some of whom were EXTREMELY good looking, and when I think back to these I always think "god, they were out of my league." And that got me thinking. Does anyone else have these "leagues?" Do you put yourself into a league and do you do it with others?

I'm stewing it over tonight as I REALLY fancy a (single) bloke from work, and we flirt and get on a treat. But because I'm fat and he's incredibly fit and attractive, I automatically write off the possibility of anything because he's "out of my league."

I hate that I do myself down and apparently don't regard myself as a "catch." But... I can't help feeling this "leagues" thing is real. Would welcome any thoughts.

It's not us posters who think that, it's based on how we see men behaving.

Exactly that.

I honestly believe from my experience with men that if I took 1000 of them at least 900 would not think in a million years of dating a woman, no matter how lovely, clever, warm, funny she was if she was not in the range of what his friends and family would percieve his "league".

That's an awful thing to say, but is my own experience of men. they look at us and say whether they would or wouldn't. They glance at us across a room and decide they like us or don't before we even speak.

I know a lot of them will also put up with a woman being stroppy, needy, bitchy and not that clever if she is was incredibly beautiful. Maybe not marry her and have happily ever after, but definitely feel she was a status symbol for him - like an object or a posession - flash car or nice watch.

I'm not saying all men or women are that shallow but a lot are!!!! I'd even ay they are more worried about what their mates think than what they think themselves.

I am sure there are nice guys that don't have a physical type and are completely open to dating women no matter what she looks like but I promise you, almost every single one has a guideline set of physical expectations.

One of my most dear and darling male friends who is the most wonderful men I have ever met, ALWAYS goes for women who are quietly spoken, intelligent, blonde and very petite. He could meet the most amazing woman in the world and if she was overweight he would not find her attractive.

Another one of my dear male friends loves huge boobs. He had a date with a flat chested blonde a while ago and he told me he'd be willing to comromise on the boobs because she likes a lot of the same things he likes doing.

They think a lot more than we do about physical attributes and I think women look more at whether they would make a good father / family man so we consider things like financial stability, temperament etc.

Everyone is out of my league.

everyone

He could meet the most attractive woman in the world and if she were overweight he wouldn't find her attractive

Well, why should he? What does this prove? I don't have a type particularly but I'm not massively attracted to fat men. So?

I look around and among my friends, neighbours and community, I see most middle aged men with middle aged women. Some are v slightly more attractive than others. I don't see many middle aged men paired up with size 8, 20 yr olds. A few might but hey- it's funny that you would build a whole ranking system based on the opinions of a few twats.

Helmet-If they are aimilar, they are obviously all the same league then ;)

And I think it is rather more than the opinion of a few..

It's the opinion of a few screwed up posters who are a bit depressing. (I don't include Guna in that - she's cool).

The only thing one can really infer from Donatella's post is that she knows some really shit men.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matching_hypothesis

he matching hypothesis (also known as the matching phenomenon) is derived from the discipline of social psychology and was first proposed by Elaine Hatfield and her colleagues in 1966,[1] which suggests why people become attracted to their partner. It claims that people are more likely to form and succeed in a committed relationship with someone who is equally socially desirable. This is often researched in the form of physical attraction.[2]

Successful couples of differing physical attractiveness may be together due to other matching variables that compensate for the difference in attractiveness.[3] For instance, some men with wealth and status desire younger, more attractive women. Some women are more likely to overlook physical attractiveness for men who possess wealth and status

"the matching phenomenon [of physical attractiveness between marriage partners] is stable within and across generations"

It's a thing. Not be being shallow. It's a thing.

You saying I am shallow for pointing this out is a little bit like telling me I am a racist because I tell you more black people are in prison in the US than white people. I am not making it happen. Just pointing out the glaringly obvious fact that it does.

If I went into a bar tonight and asked every man in it to have sex with me, I would have a better chance of a "yes" from the uglier ones. they have less options, they are seen as less desirable and they can afford to be less picky. The super handsome ones will have girls fawning over them. Maybe people are looking for the best they can get looks-wise as a biological predisposition to have genetically perfect children. It must be chemically inbuilt. I am not sure what causes sexual attraction but of course looks are a part of it.

One part of that study says that apparently looks become less important if you have a long level of aquantance with someone...perhaps beause after a while you can begin to find someone attractive based on deeper qualities.

And please don't call my good friends shit men.

All entitled to opinions but no need to badmouth.

I and my friends must be very shallow. I look around and think we all physically match our partners. There are small compromises in weight and wealth but I can utterly understand the matching link above.

Socially desriable (or physically)

Everyone must be out of my league because I'm not even remotely desirable

'And please don't call my good friends shit men'

Okay, then. I am not attracted to fat men 20-years-older than I am. I work really hard to keep fit and keep the weight off in my mid-40s are being pregnant and giving birth 3 times. I do this because I enjoy being fit and also I have Type 2 diabetes.

They may be lovely people, pot-bellied men hitting on women 20 years younger, but I would not want to shag them. Ever. I wouldn't want to get to know them romantically.

Of course someone will come out with, 'What if you spouse got fat.' That's a different story (and not likely) also, he will always be younger than I am.

No, I was chating with Twinklestein. I said:

One of my most dear and darling male friends who is the most wonderful men I have ever met, ALWAYS goes for women who are quietly spoken, intelligent, blonde and very petite. He could meet the most amazing woman in the world and if she was overweight he would not find her attractive.

And she said

The only thing one can really infer from Donatella's post is that she knows some really shit men.

Which was a bit out of order to say the least. Because someone fancies slimmer women does not make them a shit person.

I suppose age is a great leveller. Among my acquaintances, us people in their 40s, you don't get the uglier ones, you don't get the super handsome ones, you just get a mass of quite nice middle aged people, nothing more, nothing less. Maybe these massive gulfs in attractiveness are more apparent in people in their twenties.

I agree. I fancied slimmer men. I just do. Guess I'm shit and shallow. Oh, well.

But fancying slimmer people is certainly not evidence that there are leagues and that slimmer people are in a 'higher' league than others.

It just means you fancy slim people.

No but it's evidence that we are not intellectually in control of who we do or do not fancy.

I am not making it happen. Just pointing out the glaringly obvious fact that it does.

Exactly donattella.

Sometimes people post things that make me wonder if they are very unobservant, or if their real lives just happen in a little bubble. Or perhaps they think that one observation that "breaks the rule" means that the norm does not exist.

I think people are to some extent in control of who they do and don't fancy.

No, we're not in control of who we fancy.

We're in control of whether we act on it, or not. And we can be influenced eg by outside influences such as societal norms.

And our tastes change. Mine certainly have. What I find physically attractive at 40 is not what I found physically attractive at 20!

After I'd separated from my husband, several people had told me he was "punching above his weight" with me. We were similarly matched in terms if education and he earned more than me. They were referring to looks.

A different groupd of people referred to another friend "punching above his weight" when he married his wife. They did the same job and had similar educational/class/backgrounds and similar incomes. They meant that she was better looking and younger than him.

Other people might not have experienced it, but plenty of people have.

Oh I know people say it- it's just a bit of a twatty thing to say.

Are we all locked into rows and columns in spreadsheets of attractiveness?

Nope.

What a great thread...:)

If we could control who we fancied life would be a lot easier. Sometimes I really wished I didn't fancy people and sometimes I wish I did. Something emotional / chemical happens beyond my control when I like someone romatically and I think it is because my subconcious mind decides they are an ideal partner for me / the person who will make me happy.

Some of the posts are so incredibly depressing, Donnattella at 16:51 being one of them ... The underlying equation that some posters make between physical attractiveness and the ability to catch a good man or have a happy life is all very and . Complete confusion between 'league' and attraction/compatibility from some IMO.

Attraction has nothing to do with 'leagues'. I couldn't be attracted to someone I can't have decent intelligent conversations with. End of. It's not about giving them a mark out of 10, or putting them in a league.

Donnattella's mate saying he would still go out with a woman despite her flat boobs. Pretty crass but he's entitled to think that, again nothing to do with league. I have a friend who will only go out with a man who is taller than her. It's taste, compatibility, but not league. I'm divorced with young DCs. Some men wouldn't be interested because of that. It doesn't mean I'm 'out of their league'. It just means they don't want that. Fine. Nothing to do with me being lesser or greater than them.

To go back to the OP's question, the fact you work together might be more of an issue than your size. You say you're fat and he's fit. Opposites attract too, you know.

Helmetbymidnight

"So gwen, you think a woman's worth is only in her beauty?"

No, I never said that's what I think. Read my comments. I was talking about how men think.