I'm turning into one of THOSE posters...

[0verNow]

...with multiple threads asking for advice about the same situation.

I'm trying to decide whether to end my marriage. I'm not looking for different advice from previous threads, but two of my other threads had to be deleted because DH found them, and the other is now quite long and things have moved on a bit - so I thought it might be better to start a new thread.

In summary, DH and I have been together for 10 years, married for 4 years and have 3 DCs.

There have been three issues in our marriage.

1. Right from the early days of our relationship, DH has been low-level EA. The kind of 'death by a thousand cuts' EA that sounds petty on paper but grinds your love to dust. This is the issue that brought us to counselling in the first place. DH is adamant that he wasn't deliberately abusive, just thoughtless and entitled and self-centred.

Since we started counselling, two more issues have emerged, each much more damaging (in my opinion) than the first.

2. Financial abuse. (I'm the poster whose DH spent £16k on counselling and lied to me about it.) I just didn't see it - in fact, DH had me convinced that I was crap with money. I'm still kicking myself that I was so blind.

3. DH's lies. He has lied about small things, and (at least) two enormous things (that I know of). I think lying is his default setting whenever it's more convenient than telling the truth.

Of these, 2 is largely resolved going forward. I have separated my finances from his, and although I still don't have access to our historic savings DH has offered to add me to all of his accounts.

1 is tricky. DH has been treating me well for 3 months now. I'd be interested to hear whether people think this is a new, improved DH - or just the old one on best behaviour, in which case he's likely to revert to type when he starts to relax.

But 3 is the big one for me. I don't know that I can get passed it.

There is one event which I'm particularly struggling with. It happened in 2007, and DH has lied and lied and lied to me about it. He was even still lying about it after counselling started. He has now given me 4 different versions of what happened, each one painting him in steadily worse light. The last version, which only came out last week because our counsellor forced the position, involved him covering up behaviour at work which was gross misconduct at best, and possibly criminal.

DH says that it all happened more than 8 years ago, and that living through the consequences of his 2007 behaviour has fundamentally changed him as a person.

But from my perspective, it's not 8 years old, it's all new to me. And it's not just the event from 8 years ago, it's the lies he's been telling me ever since. And I'm not at all convinced that he has changed as a person - given the ongoing lies, big and small.

I don't trust him. I still don't know if I've got to the truth about what happened in 2007. I don't know if there are other things still to discover.

If I'd known the truth 8 years ago, I would have left him. I'm very clear about that. But we didn't have DCs 8 years ago, and now we do (DC1 was conceived in the immediate aftermath).

I'm also very clear that I would not be with him now were it not for the DCs.

Am I being unreasonable to end my marriage over something that happened 8 years ago? Will my DCs hate me for splitting up their home?

I just want to do what's for the best, primarily for the DCs but also for myself.

Yes. I think he's actually a little unhinged at the moment.

That is truly creepy. A pair of your knickers? Yeucchh!

I agree with not allowing him to come. Say "Oh no, this is special 'Mummy and us' time. You can have 'Daddy and us' time later. Or make it sound as if it's a place he wouldn't want to go, like your parents. Then do whatever you planned to do.

I don't remember (and am too lazy to re-read), have you told the DC yet? Because you should and this 'I'll join you' is a good reason why.

No, we still haven't told the children. I'm scared of poking the wasps' nest.

I think you need to tell them even if he isn't part of that conversation because he refuses to.

You have separate room FGS they know something isn't right! How old are they?

You really should tell them. They know things are not right, you'd be amazed how children pick up on emotions and atmosphere, they're sponges. Just tell them yourself. He'll sabotage it if you include him. You need to be honest with your children yourself.

I agree with Random. You really do need to tell them. It's one of the reasons stbx has been able to hang on for so long.

I can see why you haven't yet - it's that last big step isn't it, and once it's done it's really done - you must be so nervous about it, and that's not even thinking about his potential weird sabotaging attempts of anything you say.

But I'll bet anything they've known something's been wrong, and that they've got at least some friends with separated parents. It'll help school to support them too if they need it.

Perhaps a discussion with their school first? Maybe letting them know that you're having 'difficulties' with Stbx 'undermining' the idea that you are 'mentally' separated and will be 'physically' separating at some point in the (hopefully) near future?

Then perhaps a discussion with your SHL about what (if any) steps you can take to force him out based on this recent behaviour (considering there's no actual proof of him nicking your stuff) and/or if he does kick off or steps you can take to protect your interest in the home if you leave with the children?

I'm no child psychology expert, but I think it may soon get to the point where the 'status quo' will be more damaging to the DC than a proverbial 'knock down drag out fight'. DC are extremely sensitive little buggers and they're dealing with a 'death by a 1000 cuts' of Stbx's PA statements and martyry/victimish demeanor, iyswim. He's making you out the 'bad guy' already, just in a long drawn out way, if that makes sense. What's the big difference if you just stand up and tell him to GTFO as opposed to the current and ongoing 'Oh Children,Mummy doesn't love Daddy, but Daddy loves Mummy' bullshit. He is NEVER going to stop that shit. You're going to have to and the only way is to take responsibility for your feeling about him and your marriage in a mature, child-sensitive way. Because he IS going to turn them against you the way he's going. But if you stand up and deal with it in a 'Daddy hasn't been treating Mummy right so Daddy needs to live elsewhere' way, they'll understand that at some point, if not right now.

DC1 asked when we're next going on holiday and where it will be; I said that we - the three DCs and I - could decide when we've picked dates. DC1 said: and Daddy. I said Daddy wouldn't be coming on holiday with us anymore and it was a grown up thing. DC1 said he was very sad, but seemed OK. Small steps.

Good. It is a small step. Do you think DC1 'suspects' more than he's letting on? Does it seem as if he's asking 'leading' questions or trying to pry information out of you or stbx?

I'm mentioning it because you want to be sure he isn't imagining scenarios that aren't true. Children have a way of blaming themselves for parental troubles. Another reason to have a chat with them.

I'm going to talk to them tomorrow. Fuck STBXH - he's just wrong about this and it's eating away at them.

I think you need to accept he is not thinking about the DC needs at all it's about him, him again and only him.

Hugs &

Yes! Air punch for you.

I was just wondering how you were doing earlier this evening Over.

Your kids definitely deserve to know what's happening.

You are so doing the right thing!

he's just wrong about this So it sounds as if he's been 'influencing' your feelings re this. Not surprising, but his motivation has NOT been the children's 'feelings'. It's been the fact that them being told removes his last reason not to find another place to live.

Sounds to me he's always been unhinged.

Well done for making the decision to tell the kids.

(Seriously hope he's not one of the readers of this thread. If he found the other threads won't be have found this too?)

Well done. You don't want your children becoming uncertain and walking on eggshells, losing confidence etc just because things are happening which no one's told them of. You need to set their minds at rest; sure, they'll be sad but it won't be the end of the world and there'll be lots of children at school in the same boat.

Well, DC1 took matters into his own hands and asked me outright why STBXH and I aren't doing things together any more, and then explicitly whether we're splitting up. I took the decision not to lie, and confirmed that we were, that we both loved him very much, and that it wasn't his fault. He basically shrugged and then asked for a bouncy ball.

STBXH is predictably furious.

And now I'm intimidated. He's not being violent, but he is using his physical size to intimidate me - for example by not moving out of the way in the corridor when I walk passed. He's clearly beyond furious. I've locked myself in my room and don't dare come out.

It's stalemate. He won't leave and I can't force him to leave legally, I won't leave because I won't leave the boys.

Do realize that bowing up like that and blocking your movements are threatening you. You should call WA and also consider calling 111. Explain the situation and that he is using his size to intimidate and frighten you. Log every incident. And call your SHL! I don't know what's considered sufficient grounds for his removal from the home, but they will!

I know you're frightened. But also realize that you have removed his last excuse not to leave.

Do you feel that he might become violent? If not, then don't hide. You can deal with unpleasantness, even intimidation, as long as you are sure he won't put his hands on you. By letting him make you scuttle away and hide, he knows he's still got the upper hand. But if you fear that he may hurt you, obviously you don't want to antagonize him.

Just by the by, do you have any hope of help if you speak to his parents and ask them to help him see reason? That you'd like things to be amicable for the sake of the children but he's not 'doing his part'?

Hugs - you could leave and take the boys with you, although I know it's not ideal.

I can't remember, do you have a solicitor yet? If he continually intimidates you perhaps that is justification to apply for a prohibitive steps order which means he would have to leave the house.

Could you and the boys go to your parents to visit overnight/for the rest of the weekend or arrange to be invited over to friends for the day?

How are you doing over?

Not goodz

Or even good.

Are you safe over? That's the important thing right now. As across said, WA or even 101 might be able to help. Can your parents help too maybe?

Remember - this is the band aid bit: you've pulled it off and this is the sting. No more pretend happy families from him.

You've done NOTHING WRONG telling the kids. They knew! They knew something was wrong and even guessed what. You'd have been gaslighting them if you'd lied, giving him false hope, and making the atmosphere even worse.

Yes, I'm safe.

The younger two children still don't know. STBXH is still "considering what to do". My take is that now DS1 knows it's impossible to keep it from them.