My close male friends wife accused us of wanting to be together

[nancyfromthefarm]

I am absolutely reeling tonight having not long got back from dinner with a couple my husband and I are friends with. It is actually me who is close friends with the husband of the other couple although I always normally get on well with his wife. We met in our early 20's (we are all late 30's now) and quickly became very close. When we met we were both with our current partners the people we would go on to marry so were never single in all the time we knew each other. Once or twice while very drunk we talked about it, not getting together but that we probably would have if we had both been single when we met. We also laughed and said it was a good thing we weren't single as we would make a terrible couple and at least this way we would always stay friends and we just agreed not to go there. We could have got together if we really wanted to neither of us was even engaged at that time but we both loved our partners and felt we would be better as friends. I has been a fantastic and treasured friendship, we have a lot in common intellectually more than anything else that we are unable to share with our spouses and it is lovely to have an outlet for those things.

For the most part both our partners have accepted our friendship without issue and we all hang out together on occasion like tonight. My friends wife had her 1st baby in February and this was the 1st time we have all got together like this since the birth.

The Baby was with a relative overnight and so my friends wife let her hair down with a few drinks. Towards the end of the evening she was very drunk and agitated. My friend and I are both very interested in politics and so had been discussing the new labour leader as well as other things when she started in on us. She was speaking to my husband saying that they should just leave and let us get on with it, that she didn't want to be a gooseberry. She then said that the only reason my friend and I married who we did was because we hadn't met each other first and that we should just put everyone out of their misery by getting together.

I tried to reassure her and so did he but she was very worked up at this point. My husband said that we should just leave, my friend agreed and we did. My husband was a bit quiet on the way home, not angry but he has gone to bed. I have texted my friend and his wife is apparently sleeping now. I don't know what to think, it may be that she is just stressed with the baby but I am scared for what this could mean. I want to say to her that that isn't how we feel about each other, if we had wanted to go down that road we could have years ago and we didn't because we loved our respective partners.

I just need some advice or reassurance about this, will she be ok, is it likely to blow over?

You think you're closer to him than she is - that you know him better than she does. She senses this.

That's what I'm getting from your posts.

Greenwoodtree, it isn't a will they won't they, we didn't and that is it. Sure maybe it does piss her off and yes I can totally appreciate her position as a new mum but in the long term I would be very upset to have to lose a friendship just because she didn't like it for spurious, imagined reasons.

I don't think I know him better but I know him differently to her and I know things she doesn't I don't know him better than her.

I'm not sure it is imagined - I think you may be in denial. He was with her before he met you - you both stayed with your respective partners despite there being a bit of spark between you - you admit you've discussed it.

Now - your spouses are like extras in the 'you and your friend' saga. You just can't see it.

nancy but that's the point, he shouldn't be telling you problems about his marriage.

I had an old friend who I've known since I was a child. A man older than me, who always held a candle for me even though I had never been interested in him.

He was always telling me, and my husband 'no one knows Sunshine like I do'.

But you know something, it wasn't true. The person who knows me best in the world is my husband, the person who lives with me and speaks to me every day, who knows my heart and shares my bed. The person who I chose to make children with.

He didn't share any of that with me. and was so unaware that he didn't even realise it.

A few years of extra shared history and some in jokes don't trump day to day marriage. You have no idea what he has and hasn't shared with his wife.

The old friend I mentioned? He was in no way any kind of threat to our relationship but we don't see him at all now.

One thought as she has just had a baby perhaps she feels frumpy, less sexy and perhaps she suddenly feels like you are the more attractive option? I used to have a good male friend and his wife didn't mind me at all until I dropped 4 stone, then suddenly I was treated like an interloper. It wasn't such a close friendship so I didn't get too down when he was no longer allowed to see me.

I have a few male friends (including an ex) and in particular I have one close male friend - he is older than me, I used to work with him and I really treasure his friendship as he is a truly intelligent, creative, interesting man. Over the years I have also become friendly with his wife who is also lovely but my main friendship is with him - I meet him more often, email/text him more and our chat is generally more interesting but I like her too. My dh and I are also friendly with them as a couple and often have dinner together. No one is bothered by it. So I do believe people can be friends with the opposite sex. Neither he nor I never for one moment discuss any sexual or romantic feelings. We are friends

So in your case here is the bit that would bother me.

Once or twice while very drunk we talked about it, not getting together but that we probably would have if we had both been single when we met. We also laughed and said it was a good thing we weren't single as we would make a terrible couple and at least this way we would always stay friends and we just agreed not to go there. We could have got together if we really wanted to neither of us was even engaged at that time but we both loved our partners and felt we would be better as friends.

I think you crossed the line when the two of you started chatting cosily about what would it have been like if you were ever single and had given it a go. Even saying that it was just as well you didn't. Once you start talking about what would a sexual relationship be like, even if you don't do anything about it it is still hovering in the air around the two of you. The wife has probably picked up on this for years, never felt she could quite say anything about it because of course the two of you had decided together you (as in twosome you) would be better as friends etc. She got drunk and finally let rip what she really thinks,

The fact that you also texted him when you left would also bother me - your concern should have been with your own husband, not him.

honestly, I think your friendship is going to be changed by this. And I also think you have been skating along in la la land oblivious to the feelings of his wife and your husband and possibly even to your own feelings. In addition you have no clue what vibe your friend has been giving to his wife about you -how he talks about you when you aren't around.

I am all for friendships and they can be with man woman or the undecided but I would not be happy if my husband had any conversation with any woman about how he might have had a wonderful sexual/romantic relationship with her but better be friends and sure his wife is great anyway. I expect my husband to think I am the best thing ever, the one he really wanted and got. Same for me with him.

The wife's reasons aren't spurious it imagined and everyone replying to this thread appears to agree, so do belittle her or minimise her feelings.

It comes down to this Nancy:

Do you love this man (as a friend) and truly, honestly want the best for him?

Yes?

Step a long, long, long way back.

No texting, no individual meetings, no bitching about his poor wife.

Sunshine, I never said I knew him better than his wife, I would never expect to but I do know him well. I never said he was closer to me than his wife I'm not and I wouldn't expect to me but it also means that I get part of him and his life thoughts that might not go down so well with his wife. Perhaps that is wrong, I have to say I don't believe I keep anything from my Husband but that is really their business and not mine, all I can do try to be a good friend.

Again houseoftea I don't think what you are saying applies here at all.

Canyouforgiveher, that conversation took place a long, long time ago when we where both little more than kids and had no idea how our lives were going to pan out, I guess we felt we were being mature or something getting it out in the open so it wouldn't fester.

I just feel like there would be no issue with our friendship or closeness if we where same sex.

I totally understand you OP & doubt there's anything other than friendship here, but then both DH & I have always had opposite sex friends, no big deal, to us friends are friends - I wouldn't worry about him sharing certain interests, that don't particularly float my boat with a male friend, so why would I worry if the friend were female - I trust DH,

Sound to me, as has already pointed out above, your friends wife is feeling very vulnerable, plus hormones agogo on top of more drink that she can handle right now - a bit of a recipe for disaster, more so if your male friend is being a bit of an arse too - you've never been in a relationship with him, or had a baby with him, so that is a side of him you can only guess at - but not actually know - been there, done that & my old male friend actually was being an arse!

If you want to save the relationship with your friend, realise more so than ever right now, that like you & your own DH, they come as a family & it sounds like she is struggling. Your friend may well be struggling too - they are going through a huge life change, lack of sleep & more, all leading to a difficult time in their relationship as a couple.

Why not prove to her that you are no threat, whilst at the same time helping her husband too - Speak to her, tell her you are sorry if you upset her in anyway, she will realised its her,, tiredness, hormones & more that's causing her to feel vulnerable, not you, but approaching in that way, saves her the embarrassment she will no doubt feel. Offer to baby sit, let them have time together as a couple to reconnect, this will help her feel far less vulnerable & realise you are her friend too. It doesn't have to mean the end if your friendship, but I do think you need to cut her some slack & accept that things have changed.

I am not bitching about his wife, I am sympathetic but she is just plain wrong.

Even if I did just stop seeing him, texting him I don't think he would stop.

There you go then - to her, you are a threat to her marriage.

Think about your own marriage - because I really doubt your husband is as OK as you think.

Thank you RockinHippy, that is actually really good advice and helpful. I am getting tired and a bit defensive really so perhaps I just need to go to sleep but I really do think your advice is very helpful.

I just feel like there would be no issue with our friendship or closeness if we where same sex.

But you are not the same sex. You acknowledged it yourself when you decided to get it out in the open about your possible attraction to each other - no matter how long ago that was, it is part of your friendship that you acknowledged a possible sexual attraction. I happen to believe most people would not be friends with someone whom they would not find sexually attractive on some small level but once you say it out loud, it colours everything.

Maybe you have a genuine friendship that doesn't threaten his or your marriage. Maybe she will wake up tomorrow and say "jesus what rubbish did I say?"

Or maybe you should think about how you would feel sitting watching your husband chat animatedly to his close female friend who "gets part of him and his life" that you don't and whom he does find attractive. I wouldn't find it a great way to spend a rare evening without the baby myself.

Honestly, I think your friendship is going to change and I don't think it is purely because his wife isn't cool enough to accept him having a friend of the opposite sex.

Don't offer to babysit.

Do give her an apology.

Do step back for a while.

Honestly greenwood my husband is the least jealous or possesive person on the planet.

If she sees me as threat to her marriage then what can I do, why does she get to be the one who decides?

Because she's married to him.

canyouforgiveher, she doesn't know about that conversation all those years ago and I don't thing we do fancy each other now it was a fleeting thing. Yeah perhaps it does suck that he isn't as open with her about some of the suff he has discussed with me but that isn't up to me, I guess he doesn't tell her because he doesn't feel she would have much empathy. He has to be pretty strong for her and it is hard for him to show her his weaknesses.

I will apologise for sure and i need to think about the other stuff.

Sure she is married to him but she doesn't own him its the 21st century! I can't see how it can be appealing to want to have total control over a person of who the call a friend.

As far as I can see a relationship that had to be so jealously guarded is hardly worth having at all.

After your last post, I now agree with sunshine - you should back off completely.

I'm just tired, upset and defensive at the moment, I should just go to bed because nothing seems to be coming out as it should.

I hope you feel better in the morning, nancy. But you know, he is a married man with a baby. His wife is going to (should) come first.

Nancy, I suspect you've had a drink yourself & you are allowing yourself to be wound up. I suggest you calm down, go to bed, sleep no it & it won't look half as bad in the morning. You've no doubt felt under attack by the wife & now you are getting it in the neck on here too. Don't let it get to you.

For what it's worth I,agree with you, I personally feel for people in the sort of relationships where one is owned & not allowed to decide for themselves who to be friends with. It also amused me at time that there can be such double standards on here, if it were a man controlling a woman in that way, there would be hell to pay & rightly so. I personally see no difference either way, but sadly we have lost male fiends that way & that was without the exhaustion & baby hormones to stir up insecurities. That particular friends wife just didn't like her DH having friends she didn't choose - in her case ALL his old friends pre her, were gradually given the boot, but far more manipulatively than your friends wife is acting, so I think things will work out just fine - but do be a friend to them both.

I think if your friends wife was that way inclined normally, you would have seen that well before now, so I doubts she has been hiding anything, but is just feeling exhausted, hormonal, unattractive & baby brained, ALL adding up to making her feel very insecure

Hopefully things will calm down & you will feel better about it in the morning.

Good luck

I firmly believe men and women can be 'just friends'. My DH has several women friends. One he went travelling with. Another he had a brief fling with in the dim and distant (years before me), but is now just friends with.

I am friends with all of them. Have been on countless nights out without him, and even on girls' holidays with them. No-one is in the least bit threatened by any party, because everyone behaves like adults in nice, friendly, platonic relationships.

And I'm going to pick up on the same para as Canyouforgiveher:

Once or twice while very drunk we talked about it, not getting together but that we probably would have if we had both been single when we met. We also laughed and said it was a good thing we weren't single as we would make a terrible couple and at least this way we would always stay friends and we just agreed not to go there. We could have got together if we really wanted to neither of us was even engaged at that time but we both loved our partners and felt we would be better as friends.

I would not be happy if DH was having these sorts of (very) drunk cosy chats. And the crucial thing - he wouldn't anyway, because - well, why would he? What sort of purpose would it serve?

I seriously suspect that if your DH was having cosy, (very) drunken chats with a close female friend (that he shared things with that you don't share with him), and that you weren't in the least but privy to, you wouldn't exactly be over the moon.

Deny it all you want.

I don't think it's necessarily about the male/female thing, although that may also be an issue. Simply knowing that your spouse has a very strong connection with someone else, especially if it has a strong emotional element and you feel that they are sharing all their secrets with that person instead of you can be very threatening.

Try putting yourself in the position of the other woman. She has a seven month old baby, her and her husband are adjusting to parenthood, which may or may not be going well. She's likely hardly been out since the baby was born and what she thought was going to be a lovely social evening with her husband turned out to be a time when she felt marginalised and ignored. Perhaps she has felt that before when you all get together but it hasn't really mattered so much, but now when time is short and pressure is high it feels like a big rejection.