Who gets the snip?

[feministwithtitsin]

Hi ladies (and gents)

Me and my DH have just had our 2 DC. We are both still relatively young (I am 30, DH is 29). We have both decided that 2 children is enough for us, our family is complete. I want to retrain and focus on my career in a year or so, and, although my DH probably would like more children, we have decided that 2 is enough as we would be better financially, and I would keep my sanity!

I have had 2 caesareans, the first was a nightmare as I had an infection and the recovery time was a nightmare (5 days in hospital, alot of pain etc) the second was textbook.

As we are both young, neither of us would be looking to get the snip for at least another 5 years, just to be 100% sure, as by that time out fertility would have dropped and I think it would be too disruptive to my career, and life in general, to be having a newborn after that.

So for the next 5 years, I will be on some kind of hormone contraceptive, as condoms are too much of a pain.

The question is who should get the snip? I think my DH should as I have had 2 caseareans already and the op itself is easier, he thinks I should because the risks of vascetomies scare him (long term ball pain etc)

So, mumsnet jury! What is your verdict

skater- but the inherent risks of the contraceptive methods itself is being discussed, not the risks of a pregnancy.
It was being argued that hormonal methods can have undesirable effects on a woman's body.. My argument is that these other methods don't.

Lets not forget that sterilisation is not 100% effective.
According to the NHS female sterilisation is 99.5% effective, meaning that one woman in 200 will become pregnant after the procedure.
That seems a high risk to me.

"skater- but the inherent risks of the contraceptive methods itself is being discussed, not the risks of a pregnancy."

Eh?? The only point of a contraceptive method is to prevent pregnancy. If you are disingenuously ignoring the pregnancy risk then I'm beginning to think you are here with some other agenda, TBH.

99.5% effective, if that is the right number, is better than caps, diaphragms or NFP and condoms. I will grant you it's not as good as no PIV, which I assume is what you mean by modifying sexual behaviour.

I will grant you it's not as good as no PIV, which I assume is what you mean by modifying sexual behaviour.

No.

But you don't get my point.

My friend became pregnant after tubal ligation. The doctor at fisrt suggester her symptoms were due to menopause, then her swelling due to fluid retention.
The baby was still born at 6 months, the mother and baby had received no ante natal care.
Are we so smug about sterlisation that we can allow this to be acceptable?

Pregnancy is rhe biggest risk of all.here. Not only the physical risks, but also the fact that an unwanted pregnancy would be emotionally distressing.

Not acknowledging the risks of a pregnancy, when discussing contraception is like not addressing the risks of smoking when talking about the risk of aides to help people quit smoking, to put it anaolgically.

four thats a horrific story. I dont think anyone is being smug however, just sharing experience and opinons, as i asked them to do in my OP.

Ok, my experience is having 30 years of being sexually active using non hormonal contraception or IUDs without an unwanted pregnancy.

Haven't RTWT but it took my DH five years to get round to having a vasectomy OP so your thinking is good!!

We are much older than you, didn't get married until mid/late thirties. Would have loved more than one DC but even though I get pregnant very easily I miscarry, cause not discovered until almost double figures after which I had had enough.

My pregnancies affected my health massively (spent 3 months in hospital with DD) and I felt that I had been through enough physically tbh.

I am a live for today sort generally and can't factor in what if DH runs off with someone 20 years younger than me and wants to start again.

Fact is that he is married to me, we are very happy and having tried the forms of hormonal contraception available to me (have familial risks so not all suitable), I can't have a coil as I have a large fibroid, I asked him to have a vasectomy.

He knew it was right for us but was slightly reluctant to go through the physical procedure - not anything else, just the physical bit.

Five years on he did it! Absolutely fine, no horror story here, no pain, loss of feeling, etc., etc..

As for risks, doesn't a vasectomy carry a much lesser risk than female sterilisation? I presume that a general anaesthetic is required for sterilisation?

Age wise my father had one in his mid thirties when my parents decided that three children was enough.

Sounds like a reasonable plan to me.

Thats lucky for you. I dont think it would be the case for me! Me and DH have has unprotected sex 3 times in 6 years, resulting in 2 (not planned but definately not unwanted!) pregnancies! We appear to be a very fertile combination!

Other occassions of condom failure, I have used morning after pill, which is a pain.

Same here feminist - I am not sure I actually have to be in the same room tbh, passing on the stairs is probably enough.

lavender i agree. We cant make decisions in our marriage based upon it ending. We have to do whats best for us as a family.

feminist- we seem a fertile couple too. First pregnancy took 6 weeks to conceive, the second took two sex sessions.

four thats pretty good going.

For me personally, i would want the most effective form of contraception available!

feministwithtitsin- for me I would want to consider other things too.

If not getting pregnant was the top priority then we wouldn't be having any sex surely?

I talked with dp about trying for a baby Dec 1st. Positive test Jan 6th with twins. Talked again end of Jan, pregnant before march came.

3 c sections and 4 dc's.

I would not have been impressed if he would have prefered me being sterilised after going through all that.

I'm lucky in that he thought it would be well out of order, and he organised it himself without me having to say anything. having 3 under 15 months scared the bejaysus out of him

It was textbook. No side effects no complications. I literally dropped him off, drove around the corner to do some shopping and he phoned me to come and get him before I even got out the car!

Walked like John Wayne mind for a couple of days.

Men get pressured into it. Simple. You get the fertility argument, the I've had the kids etc etc.

Great if the snip is problem free but mine wasn't. 3 years of excruciating pain. Too many men are pushed into it without knowing the risks.

I now have to take medication. I could chose not to, so I'd be impotent, suffer exhaustion, be in severe pain and fall into a depression.

It's ruined my life.

A man having the snip before the age of 40 is like a woman having children without marriage.
The relationship might work out but god forbid if something happens then he has left himself in a vulnerable position.
If he doesn't want to then he shouldn't be forced or pressured into it.

THere are brilliant ways for women to take control of their fertility.

It can allow us to decide whether to conceive or not. I had brilliant coaching from a NFP counsellor who works for the Catholic church.
This in part has allowed OH and I to take our fertility into our own hands without the need for intrusive or radical options.

Are you asserting that on a population level NFP is more than 99.5% effective?

Oh arsenal, same old same old, eh?

Read the OP, or my helpful reproduction of it - she and her DH are using the exact same language about each other. He is not being pressured. And no one is taking a permanent step for five years - again, the opposite of pressure.

I am asserting nothing. However NFP used correctly is very effective- when used with other methods even more so.
I'm just suggesting that it allows us a way to take our fertility into our own hands without intrusive or radical options.

"natural family planning methods can be up to 99% effective," - NHS website.
I suspect that used with other methods it is likely to be even more effective, Many people who use NFP don't use other methods- many for religious reasons.

You said that sterilisation at 99.5% effective was not enough for you!

I would also assume that sterilisation is mostly binary (unless something comes loose over time) - on 1 in 200 people the procedure is ineffective but on the rest there is no ongoing requirement to remember contraception making it 100% effective permanently in those cases.

And "up to" 99% means with lperfect use and almost certainly includes using condoms on fertile days.

Fuzz - if this situation would cause you to feel pressured to the extent that you'd book a vasectomy you didn't want then I think you, like my ex h, actually just need to grow up and take some responsibility for yourself. It is not ok to be so fragile, to not take responsibility for your own decisions and to co-opt everything to your wife.

Of course it is possible you really were pressured and that is really not ok, in this situation being described though it is not ok to just call talking about it pressure.