Affair Part 5 - fab phee kicks arse wearing her skinny jeans

[OpheliaRose]

Many you will have read my threads 1 2 3 4

A month ago I discovered my Husband had been having an affair with a girl from his work. I thought it was one of the most painful moments of my life but the subsequent day where far more painful when the full extent of his betrayal was exposed to me and he has shown no remorse or sorrow over the loss of our marriage in fact he has left me for the OW

I have started divorce procedures on the grounds of adultery each day is proving a struggle but I am getting through it with the help of all of you.

All I want when this is over is for me and my Twins to be happy. We all deserve so much better than him

I honestly don't think keeping the harsh, ugly truth from him is being 'undignified' in the slightest...

He thinks it's all so reasonable?! Well it's bloody well not.

And, absolutely what the PPs said.

His answer: no.

That's all.

OP you're doing amazingly well and I know this is painfully tough but I'm going to be blunt and honest with you.

You need to get tough. Quick.

Stop allowing him to make the rules and decisions.

You allow him to dictate when he wants to see the twins.
You allow him to speak about WF around you and tell you all about her amazing ideas.

He isn't on your side and hasn't been for months now.
I worry that when you go to your meeting with him next week you'll just crumble and end up agreeing to things you don't want.
I worry that you'll end up giving in and letting the twins meet WF.

It just seems as if sometimes you accept things because of all the hurt you're feeling.
YOU tell him when he can see the twins and make sure it's a regular thing. Keep proof of this.
YOU tell him that you don't want to hear about the woman that's partly responsible for your marriage breakup. (Yes it's him that's actually responsible but you know what I mean).
YOU explain to him over email (where you'll have proof) why you don't want the twins meeting her.

If they're planning on going abroad, they can't take the twins without your permission. However the same applies for you, you wouldn't be able to take them abroad either. (My two sisters had to get their ex partners to legally agree to it).

But if you're not going to start and dictate the rules he's going to continue getting his own way. He's laughing at you right now, he's loving life. He gets to work a great job earning good money while his new relationship WF is all fresh and exciting. He gets to see his kids pretty much whenever he requests but still gets to do all this stress free. No wonder he's looking great when he comes to pick them up.

He is so smug and is being so unreasonable but that's because he knows he can. I want to give you the biggest hug but you do need to start and get tough. Start laying down the rules.

Say no. I have a 3 year old and I wouldn't allow anyone to take her away on holiday it's far too young to be away from their mum.

This is so hurtful for you. I can't actually believe OW would even suggest this. They really do deserve each other.

These children that he's so desperate to incorporate into his new life, these children who he wants to take on holiday, aren't they the same children he blamed for his infidelity? I'm confused.

Great post by Fearless

Hi,
i've been following your threads and when I read about the holiday I actually felt like retching so I can't imagine what you are feeling. I wouldn't want my dc going away on holiday with a stranger even without all the shite that he's put you through.
Of course it's entirely your decision but it's too much to ask you to make a decision 6 weeks after he's totally shattered your family life. He's such a dick.

Fearless well said. Phee get yourself into the driving seat now. They are your children and you make the decisions. If you run into any tricky situations trust your instincts. You are the person best placed to decide what happens with your children.

Make no mistake those two morons are taking the piss out of this situation. I am about 20 years older than you and have seen your situation a lot. Most of the women I know who came out of it best were the ones who looked people like those two idiots in the eye and said 'Go fuck yourself'.

I did what you are doing now when I left with my infant children almost 18 years ago. I spent years trying to please other people and look reasonable. A friend of mine took me aside and put me straight and I never looked back. I am so good at being assertive that I actually should be giving lessons in it. I get a kick out of saying no.

If you are ever stuck on a decision check in with us and we will help you. You may feel alone but you are not. We have been in your shoes and will support you.

That's right.

You are trying to be reasonable and please everyone one. He isn't because he is used to getting his own way. And he knows how to present a situation to ensure you comply.

Do not play his game. Think about what's best fir your children and for you.

And if you don't like what he is requesting - say no. You are in control.

What a fucking despicable pair - Phee, I just want to scream at them.

Where are the DT's birth Certs and passports, Phee?

Sending strength and steel to you in buckets. Start your lists Phee - please be prepared for this mediation meeting.

I honestly don't think keeping the harsh, ugly truth from him is being 'undignified' in the slightest…

The harsh ugly truth is this: 6 weeks ago he was caught out, he was not honest and did not voluntarily reveal the affair to you, he referred to her as "wank fodder" (in relation to an incident when he was supposed to be supervising the children) and confessed under pressure to having had sex in the office with this woman on more than one occasion. She was also talking about sleeping with other people whilst he continued to have sex with you and her. If you can bear it, this should be mentioned in front of the mediator because this is not a case where there has been a considered and planned separation and he has now met someone else who he wants to introduce into your children's lives… it has been impulsive, thoughtless and reckless (on all levels - emotionally, rationally, physically and professionally) and you are NOT going to allow your very young children to be caught up in this whirlwind until the dust has well and truly settled and it has been proved to be a sustainable, mature and enduring relationship.

The cynic in me thinks H is playing the long game in trying to establish familiarity as quickly as possible so that he can ask for 50:50 share of children. See dt are familiar and comfortable with OW, she looked after them when they were ill etc...

Please go for a residency order.

Also, yes, he can do whatever he wants during his contact time but you be extremely reasonable statin that, taking into consideration the dt's age, that it is in their best interest that they are not away from you for too long, considering the other huge upheaval in their lives.

Please keep any evidence of his disregarding expert advice, and your reasonableness through this difficult time especially wrt the dt's interests and emotional welfare as it would all help in building your case.

I agree, great posts from Fearless and also from Laurie.

When I got divorced years ago I remember a book I read which mentioned the greatest mistakes people can make during a separation divorce.

The one I remember the most was "the injured party letting the other party have far more of the money/decisions/assets/kids time etc than is fair in the hope that when the other party sees how kind and reasonable they are they will realise what a wonderful person the injured party is and go back to them."

It dawned on me that I was so shocked that my exH didn't love me any more that I didn't feel able to act with any of the righteous anger that was appropriate - this was because I was so devastated at how little he thought of me and was terrified of him thinking less still. BIG mistake. Because it didn't matter what he thought any more. It took me YEARS to work that out.

Tell him that you'll consider discussing that once the ink is dry on your decree absolute. I can't believe the nerve of him. Chances are you'll still be legally married in October and there is no way that you will allow you children to go on holiday with your husband and his mistress.
What an absolute bastard. Just ignore.

As a lurker who felt I had nothing to add to the excellent advice and support you were getting, I am breaking my silence to say that it can be argued that it is not in the children's best interest to be separated from you overnight for any length of time. I have done some research into this and read a number of articles stating that recent research has shown:! "Older infants, aged 2-3 years, who spent 2-3 nights per week with the second parent, also showed greater problematic behaviours than children in lower frequency overnight care, including heightened separation distress, aggression, eating problems and poor persistence.

 These findings are consistent with the only other study of infants in overnight care, conducted by Solomon and George,20 who found a greater propensity for anxious, unsettled behaviour in infants when reunited with the primary caregiver, and greater propensity for development of insecure and disorganized attachment with the primary caregiver."  <a class="break-all" href="http://www.child-encyclopedia.com/Pages/PDF/McIntoshANGxp1.pdf" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">www.child-encyclopedia.com/Pages/PDF/McIntoshANGxp1.pdf</a>

 Another extract states,  "There's a lesson here, we think it may be that parents and those of us in the family justice system who work with them should be more aware of the developmental stages of our children, and how proposed arrangements may affect them, when looking at contact arrangements after separation."  <a class="break-all" href="http://www.cflp.co.uk/hush-a-bye-baby/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">www.cflp.co.uk/hush-a-bye-baby/</a>

 The whole question is controversial but since the twins' father and WF seem to be totally wrapped up in their own selfish agendas, it might be worth pointing out in mediation that it is the twin's long term WELL BEING that is the priority here. They really don' t need to be separated from their primary carer, you, for the length of a holiday before they've even had a chance to adjust to the radical changes that those two sh*ts have subjected them to already. 

 Their appalling behaviour is despicable in every respect, but their disregard for the impact of their self-centred and self obsessed behaviour on two very young toddlers leaves me speechless.

Yes, spell it out.

He thinks he's some romantic hero, Phee, and you're, well, just getting on with it just fine.

He must think the world is revolving around his sorry arse. Don't let it. Please.

Get thee some fire in your belly. Obviously that will be a tad easier when you're well again and rested. But don't leave it too long.

He seems to be continuing to sweep you from your feet. Now is the time to stamp your foot and kick him hard with the other, albeit metaphorically.

October is just over 4 months away. Not a fucking hope in hell. I am wondering if your ex does some variant of negotiating for his job? This would be a classic example of opening with an outrageous request in order to make subsequent demands appear more reasonable.

I concur with the other advice, do not discuss anything until mediation and plan thoroughly what you would say on any points you think will come up.

I am still just at the audacity of this man. And WF. They are on a different planet. Not helpful sorry, but every time I check up on your thread phee I am aghast at his latest contact.

Phee write out what Laurie said - The harsh ugly truth ... right to the end of the paragraph and as suggested repeat it aloud at the session.

I'm de lurking after coming across your 2nd thread and try and catch up when I can and am truly aghast every time I read about what his new wishes are. Reason I didn't post before as I am still as a friend coming to terms that my friends twins were put up for adoption after her OH left her with twins who was discharged after 3 months after being 3 months premature. She had an 18 month old as well.

Yes he ended up having another baby with OW and treating her as badly as he did my friend. Animals (charming, sexy guys to the unknown person) like them don't deserve your kids.

What I would suggest is tell him whenever you are ready to respond to his email that your parents or even you have booked a holiday for the kids already. Do not let him walk all over you. If his new relationship is going to last they have lots of time to book holidays away. But right now is not the time.

What I might suggest will certainly upset many ladies but please take time to read to the last sentence before lashing at me:
I would have said : OK man take them for a week abroad. But maybe that is because my twins are ADD- funny witty but utterly exhausting.
So imagine them abroad with twins (toddlers) and another child roughly their age. It can be very funny but it is not romantic and is very exhausting and stressing. They have their own special world and if they are lively lovely twins who like to play it up in the night- especially in unusual settings- then if you are not their parent you will not want to put up with them (and it is an understatement).
So maybe that would be a crash course in their daily life with three kids- it is not like with a single kid at all.
Your ex think that WF is a wonderful woman because she deals well with her child- one child on her own; but that is not comparable to twins.
In fact it might be that he went into the affair because he was over-stressed with the twins, and his self-centered, immature mind could not understand how Phee, a SAHM with a wonderful (so wrong!) dad is having it tough when the WF is dealing with it all -her child + job + divorce+ GF's ex- so elegantly and on her own.
So I would have sent my twins to spend with them some holidays abroad.
That might be an awakening experience. I would not worry for the twins: after all he will be with them even if the WF will turn mean to them.
I would also demand some Skype communication on a daily basis to follow up.
Of course they might take them to some resort that cater for kids all day long every day when they look for stationary cupboards - but still they will have to deal with the twins bedtime etc.

Otherwise they are a disgrace to parents and lovers.
Take care Phee! Hugs.

Going on holiday with their fathers mistress?
Er-no.
Looking at what we have seen and know about her, she is despicable, the children need protecting from her. She thinks only if herself, which is not a trait we want in a care giver. He hasn't done much better.

Glad you have it all on email. Trying to manipulate you into getter his own way. How fucking dare he.

This could mess your DC up Ophelia, if you let him do it his way. He cannot be trusted to act in their best interests. You must.

Get some help with childcare. Childcare.co.uk.
Go & stay with your mum, have a friend move in, start to compose yourself & your papers for mediation.

I know what you mean mama, but its not in the children's best interests...to be scolded by their absent father or his mistress.

Meet another child. Another household with different rules.

Daddy in bed with another woman, not mummy.

Mummy not there, when she is usually there.

Confusing at best, disturbing at worst.

He's left you to cope with the twins on a day to day basis while he walked round like a lovesick teenager posting the evidence on Facebook. The twins need the stability you've given them. They're not a lifestyle accessory for him and her to play happy families with when they feel like it. It doesn't sound like he's thinking of them at all.

Morning Phee Fabulous post from laurie. She's absolutely right - this is not a situation where there has been a mutually agreed split and, a few months down the line, he has met someone else and wants to introduce the DTs to her. I think you really do need to let the mediator know the nature of their 'relationship'. Phee What do the DTs know about the situation? Do they know that Daddy is not coming back? I remember a PP saying that the rationale around waiting 6 months before introducing a new partner is not so much about whether the relationship will last but about children not seeing their father leave and then their mother 'replaced' with someone else which is exactly what he is trying to do. Has he ever looked after them on his own for a week? If they went on holiday, I presume twathead and WF are planning on sharing a bed. How the hell is that going to look to the DTs? When making decisions about access and residence, the only question to be answered is whether it is in the best interests of the children. You clearly understand that, he doesn't because all his decisions seem to be governed by what is in the best interests of his penis. You are not being unreasonable to say no to this and no sane person would disagree with you. He seems to regard being a parent as being all about going to restaurants or theme parks or going on holiday. If he's serious about 50:50 residence, he needs to realise that there's a bit more to it than that. In fact, his whole attitude to life seems to be that he only wants the 'fun' bits and none of the boring stuff in between.
I agree with a PP who said that, at every turn, you have to imagine the worst thing he can do and plan for that. She was absolutely spot on. Every time I think his behaviour can't get any worse, he surpasses himself.
We're all her for you, lovely. Every day, there are people who have read all your threads but haven't posted coming to give you support and I can guarantee you there are hundreds more lurking and willing you on. I hope you're feeling better. ((Hugs)) x