DH is a bit Girly/Disorganised - Anyone Else Have One of these?

[JessieJJJ]

...and how to cope, because its driving me mad?

This week for example, we went to the cinema, I booked the tickets, but it was a new cinema and we couldn't find it. This was after a minor drama where he lost his jacket. So we were wandering about the town, looking for it. He wouldn't ask anyone, so I had to approach 3 passers by to ask for directions, but by then he had wandered off. He wouldn't answer his phone so by the time he eventually stumbled across it, we had missed the first 40 minutes of the film.

Then after the film had ended, he had lost his car keys in the cinema. Fortunately someone had handed them in, but not before we had searched the entire cinema and I had been accused of "taking them".

We then went away in the car for a couple of days. I was going to book the first night's accommodation in a hotel but he asked me not to, as he didnt' want to be tied down. So I ended up paying nearly double to stay in the very same hotel as the on the door price was more expensive than the internet. I said he could do the accommodation for the second night, but we couldn't find anywhere, and were driving around for about 3 hours looking. A lot of places were closed and eventually we only found somewhere by pulling up at a tourist information board, me phoning various numbers on my phone and getting someone to open up a self catering apartment. DH's phone had ran out of power so he couldnt' do any phoning. He then sulked for most of the next day because he ended up paying £100 to stay in a self catering apartment for one night - he literally wouldn't speak to me or answer any questions until about 3pm.

We took it in turns to drive home, neither of us like Tom Toms but I am very good at map reading, so I gave him good directions when he was driving. As soon as we swapped, he gave me several wrong directions involving lengthy detours off the motorway into small villages, etc.. Even when we were visiting an attraction, he stood next to a massive sign saying "Exit" and announced "I'm really lost now, I can't find my way out".

He works as an engineer so should be quite practical, and he is only 45...but he seems to specialise in putting things on upside down or the wrong way round, you would think the law of change would mean he would be wrong maybe only 50% of the time but no, he bucks that trend. If you say "take the first exit at the roundabout" he is more likely to randomly take the third exit, if you say "go left" you cannot trust him not to go right.

It might sound funny but its actually incredibly stressful for me, as if I don't keep a constant watch on him, he might wander off and get lost. And driving in the dark and heavy rain late at night looking for a way back to the motorway isn't much fun. But he's quite rude with it?

Omg that stereotype is the main crux if the problem and needs addressing every time it comes up!! Do you really not get that? If a man behaves in that way why on earth should it be termed girly? It's not girly, it's a man behaving like an annoying, simpering, helpless, childlike person!

OP, I do think that perhaps your husband is dyspraxic. I am a bit 'useless' in that respect and it has nothing to do with intelligence. I'm very clever and capable in some areas but utterly frustratingly crap in others. I hate it and it's definitely not something I do on purpose.

I do think you need to spend some time figuring out what to do. A diagnosis would help in some ways - esp if he's not actually a nasty person deliberately being difficult - but there's every possibility that he is actually just not a very nice guy. Only you know which is the case. But certainly many people have found that an adult diagnosis of dyspraxia and/or ASD is very helpful. It explains certain behaviours and traits to the individual themselves and to their partner/DW/DH and can make a huge difference in understanding and approaching sore issues.

He doesnt seem to be helping himself because like many many people (especially older people) he may have absolutely no consideration of autism and how many different ways it affects people.

Also he probably feels that he is right. Because he feels right.

Agreed his behaviour is untenable in a relationship. I can usually spot the Big Red Flags of abuse a mile off, and this one is definately ringing a different tune (excuse my mixed metaphores) Its the extra behaviour - the behaviour which is outside his interaction with the OP (which is unacceptable) which is suggesting ASD to me.

I know someone like the OH's DH - he is a wet lettuce of a creature, if you ask him to do anything he flaps about whining that he doesn't know 'how' to do it (like mopping a spill, ffs) or spends so long getting it wrong that he never gets asked to do it again. He is intentionally helpless and expects everyone to run around after him fixing it for him, especially women. He also sulks and has rages if he is called out on his behaviour.

Girly is the last word I'd use to describe him... however, I do think he has problems, I'd hesitate to diagnose them (is there a condition called being a pathetic whiny twonk?), but something isn't 'right' there. He however sees no problems with his behaviour and expects everyone else to do stuff for him/save him from his own helplessness etc... it's very annoying and most of us who have to deal with him try to avoid him at all costs. He has a gf and she seems to spend most of her time running around after him placating him. He quite often throws a strop so she'll spend the whole of a social event sitting in a corner with him talking him down rather than enjoying herself. It's really not a healthy relationship.

Yes, but she seems to mean childlike and effeminate.

Does everyone else agree? Would that put an end to the ganging up?

Lots of people being offended by the same phrase, does not make a 'gang'.

If OP offended one or two posters with her comments, she would have one or two people complaining.

The fact that there are so many complaints just indicates how many she has offended.

She clearly does use the word 'girly' to encompass negative traits which she considers to be 'girl-like' and this is clearly sexist.

If that is all OP takes away from this thread, she will have done well.

You cannot offend a lot of people and then complain when a lot of people speak out against it.

And there has been a lot of good advice too if she cares to take it.

Not that childlike and effeminate should be conflated with disorganised and useless. As I said, it's unfortunately worded but I feel sympathy for the OP.

Btw, my 9 yr old daughter is dyspraxic and she has lost any number of coats/possessions, but she has never behaved as badly as this 30-something man...

I understand what you are saying, but if he DOES have ASD then it isnt an excuse, he really CANT do those things, although the acknowledgement that he cant, and his own understanding that he cant, could drastivcally reduce the sulks, anger and defensiveness.

No, I know. I did meet people when I talked about getting my son's obvious dyspraxia diagnosed who suggested that if I did, then rather than 'trying' or learning coping strategies or whatever, he'd just resign himself to it and say, "Oh I can't help it, it's the dyspraxia". When in fact, had the effect you are suggesting.

Afternoon chaps - gentle reminder of our talk guidelines eh wot?

I suppose the 3 big questions would be

1. Would the husband be open to the idea of diagnosis
2. Would the husband be open to understanding that his behaviour is unacceptable, even if he feels it is (due to the diagnosis)
3. would the Op be open to the fact that he may always do alot of the stuff she complains about, and be happy to take on the responsibility for stuff he simply isnt capable of, if the bad attitude stopped.

Sounds like my twat of an ex. He couldn't make a fucking decision either. So when I did, it meant it was inevitably wrong. He couldn't map read, park or organise anything and was constantly losing stuff too (again, all my fault).
He was also abusive and sucked the joy out of absolutely everything we did, die to his constant strops and sulks. Funnily enough, an engineer as well. Academically intelligent but otherwise clueless.
Was like a breath of fresh air when I left him. He's miraculously seemed to manage moving house/country/job by himself a few times since.

I am also aghast that she wont entertain suggesting her husband looks at the possibility of having ASD in case he then 'uses it' as an excuse to be how he is....

YES Nettle.

Pile of goadiness on several levels.

Self-infantilising happens just as much in men as it does in women. Would anyone who still doesn't seem to get it care to explain why on earth it makes sense to term it 'girly' rather than just focusing on the behaviour itself?

Sigh. I'm not going to bother with this anymore. Those who don't get it are unlikely ever to do so.

OP I understand it might be upsetting for the thread to have taken such a different turn when you were hopIng for help and advice, but I think you do have to accept that on a forum like this, this sort of casual sexism will be picked up on quite ferociously, as it should be IMO.

I do hope you find some solutions to your relationship issues and wish you well with that. Please do some research on dyspraxia/ASD, just for your own benefit. It might offer some help and assurance.

Oh great, now I'm getting passive-aggressive PMs. Thanks. Please desist.

Of course it does, Holger.

When I first started reading this I was appalled at the use of the word girly. And I still think it is used too carelessly because much of the DP's problematic behaviour is not served by "girly". But if she finds him effeminate and childish, as she tried to clarify, I can see how that would take her to girly.

Has he always been like this? Is it getting worse? Could he be developing(early onset) mental health conditions, which are being masked by his behaviour/personality so far.
Sorry to throw this into the mix, but you need to see whatever hes doing in its entirity and not cover it up. i dont care how you describe it, you need to put this into contex. Consider seeing a doc for advice if neccessary.

Haven't heard "girly" in years, reminds me of how teenage boys used to speak.

My DH is pretty hopeless at times. Wish he was "girly", that would make him more like me, and I'm great at just about everything, including map reading and DIY. I think I'm a bit "blokey"

Effeminate is a separate issue with its own problems of definition and inherent 'isms' - but in any case I can't really see where that's necessarily evident from the description unless it's meant as a cover-all for the types of behaviour she describes, which comes back to that 'feminine is inferior and a bit crap' stereotype which is incorrect and insulting and needs addressing. Childishness, again, has nothing to do with girliness. Men and women can behave in a childish way, men and women were children once. Why should childish behaviour be termed girly?

I'm not dense. Thanks to those who made Tha helpful suggestion. I've read up extensively on ASD, and much modern medical thinking and the advice of my GP is there is little to be gained from an actual diagnosis in an adult employed person who copes quite well. I have asked DH and he doesn't want to be diagnosed. Anyway, there could be something very different wrong with him. But its not all about him, vile, unpleasant and dim as I may be, as well as sexist, its also about whether I want to continue putting up with it. A diagnosis would make very little difference to me, but I.know DH well, and I know he would be likely to use it as an excuse for feigned helplessness. I'm a bit gobsmacked to have these bizarre fictitious reasons for not obsessively seeking a diagnosis on someone else's behalf. Its a bit odd. Its also odd to equate it with a mother seeing the benefits of a diagnosis in a child. Can you really see no difference there? What food would it do in a mildly affected adult?

The Dove advert, I believe it was, in the link encouraging young girls to interpret what they thought running like a gurl was like? Seen it before. You know its to sell you a brand, right? And to imprint on you a certain message? That flapping, helpless act adopted in the video describes exactly what dh does. Perhaps one of the word meisters could give a list of more suitable terms people are permitted to use? None have quite described himso far, flaky being closest, but not quite capturing the essence of wounded, affronted patheticness. FWIW I would describe girly girls in exactly the way, but obviously this is Not Permitted, so you just telll me what words a dimwit like me can use, and no doubt you can go to.bed happy tonight, having policed a small part of the internet.

I am sure I do have many faults, I don't agree that lack of self confidence is one, and I think its all too was to pull peoples characters apart and label them, but what does it achieve?

I agree its common in engineers, whatever "it" is. I'm not convinced AS or dyspraxia explains all of this.

Holger and others, if you feel so strongly about a particular word, why don't you start your own thread to debate it? The OP is seeking support, which is what MN was set up for. If you want to debate semantics, there are plenty of topics you could post in. Start your own thread, and link to it here if you really feel you have to keep hammering the OP with your opinions on a particular word.

JessieJJJ: I suggest you watch the Always (not Dove) video the whole way through. Then you will see how it explains how very demeaning and offensive was the initial part (which appears to be all you watched). It goes on to show the strength of girls, and how the term 'like a girl' should not be stereotypically abused.

There are many suggestions on the thread about other ways to describe infuriatingly helpless behaviour. Do you really find that none of them apply?

I think I've offered plenty of assurance and advice, as far as is possible on a thread like this, I've not even overly concerned with semantics. But I won't ignore the obvious use of silly, insulting, outdated terms when there are other just as useful terms that could be adopted.

Anyhoo, as far as further advice is concerned, I do think from your last comment that your relationship has gone as far as it can. I don't think you like or respect him very much, which if his behaviour is put on, as it many times can be, is quite understandable.

Did you start this thread hoping for people to say he's completely unreasonable? Because if you are done and want to finish with him, you don't need approval from a load of people on the internet. At the end of the day, if he has eroded your affections completely then whether or not it's deliberate is really rather irrelevant, don't you think?