You are not responsible for the rape or sexual assault you endured

[differentnameforthis]

In light of many threads about Ched Evans' & his victim & in light of those who believe she could have prevented it by being sober (!), I thought it was important to raise this issue.

It doesn't matter if you were drunk
It doesn't matter if you were alone
It doesn't matter if you got into a taxi/car/train/bus with him
It doesn't matter if you went to a room with him
It doesn't matter if you knew him
It doesn't matter if you didn't know him
It doesn't matter if you started to have sex with him & said no
It doesn't matter if you had sex with him an hour/a day/a week before
It doesn't matter if you had sex with his friend
It doesn't matter what you were wearing

YOU ARE IN NO WAY RESPONSIBLE FOR THE RAPE/SEXUAL ASSAULT YOU ENDURED.

We believe you

Whiskwarrior my reason for being in this thread is I didn't like the way people were confusing sensible advice for "victim blaming" and tried to correct them.

Wouldyoulisten I missed your question please repeat it and I will answer

Fit an intruder alarm = crime prevention advice.

Why didn't you fit an intruder alarm, if you had had one, you might not have been burgled = victim blaming.

People who don't fit intruder alarms should take responsibility for the effect their actions have on others = burglary apologism.

EElisavetaofBelsornia "if you had one you might not have been burgled" isn't victim blaming by itself but in the sentence you place it in, it is. But in general I agree with what you're saying and it's basically what I've said

"Don't walk home alone" = Crime (not just rape) prevention advice

"why did you walk home alone" = Victim blaming

"People who walk home alone should take responsibility for the effect their actions have on the rapist who attacked them" = rape apologism

BuffytheReasonableFeminist I think that's rather a sign of the extreme lengths people go to in having all sorts of things classed as "victim blaming". You literally feel that any disagreement with the party line will be called victim blaming so you feel you need to justify what you're saying.

I don't feel to blame but

why was I so horribly naive?

Statistically, as women are far more likely to get raped by someone known to them in their own home than anywhere else, if you were actually wanting to give women useful advice about how to avoid rape you would tell them that they should spend more of their time drunk in bars or walking home alone, and less time alone with a man in their house.

As it is, telling women that it is sensible to avoid being drunk in bars or wearing short skirts etc only adds to the myths about rape and rapists. It actually makes it easier for men to get away with raping women they do encounter who are "making themselves vulnerable" so giving women that type of advice MAKES IT MORE LIKELY THAT SHE* WILL BE RAPED.

*if not her on that specific day, some woman sometime who is in that situation.

You left out

"Don't walk home alone" (said to a person who has been raped as advice to help them avoid more rapes) = victim blaming douchiness

I think people are getting bogged down on the semantics of what 'victim blaming' means. It may not necessarily mean directly pointing the finger at someone who has been raped, but it does encompass the sorts of attitudes that create the idea that the reason women get raped is something of their own doing. 'Victim' doesn't have to mean the individual, but can mean people collectively who have or are at risk of rape.

Aduaz - my question was, why wouldt you say that to someone that had been attacked? What does it achieve to say ' perhaps you shouldn't have walked home alone ' (or words to that effect) the only thing that achieves is Making the victim feel like they could have done something to prevent the attack and that's not the case.

How ever your latest post suggests you may have got it to an extent.

Thank you to others for confirming I am not in fact invisible.

Thistledew agree with that.

Although I'm not sure it's that many people on the thread TBH

As long as you are Saying ' don't walk home alone ' to someone who hasn't been raped/attacked. Although to be clear it is pointless advise because women are more likely to be attacked/raped by someone they know.

Well, quite. Generic crime prevention advice, more applicable to men than women as they are much more likely to be attacked by a stranger. Not rape prevention advice.

As it is, telling women that it is sensible to avoid being drunk in bars or wearing short skirts etc only adds to the myths about rape and rapists

I couldn't disagree more

Put yourself in the place of a rapist. Who would you choose to rape? Bear in mind this isn't sexual, it's about power and not getting caught.

You pick an easy victim in a situation where you're unlikely to get caught.

If you make yourself an easy target when there's a rapist about you're more likely to be the victim than somebody who is has their wits about them, is in company, and could have something in pockets.

I don't see how anyone could disagree with that? How could being more aware and reducing your risk make you more likely to be a victim?

So yes, we ladies will get drunk I'm on the booze tonight and we will dress up, nobody is saying you shouldn't, but there is an increased risk and you and your group of friends should be aware of this.

That's not victim blaming, that's having an awareness that if there's a rapist in the vicinity you are more likely to be raped than somebody who has taken more precautions.

At the end of the day, most rapes are by people known to the victim as mine was. I couldn't have prevented my rape but that doesn't mean I don't think sensible precautions aren't worth taking or that the only person to blame is the rapist.

Buffy - yes you are right Of course

Joysmum, have you not been paying attention to the many posts on this thread stating that women are at far more risk while sober, moderately dressed and in the company of a man they know/trust?

Yeah I'm just really unsure about all that Joysmum.

We don't actually know do we. What we know is that sometimes women and girls are raped when they are in situations that some on this thread would deem "risky" and when that happens everyone points it out and says well what did she expect she should have watched herself better.

Meanwhile all the rapes that happen in "non risky" situations go largely ignored.

And the rapes in "super-non-risky" situations end up with the rapists being branded as "monsters".

But all of this is disconnected from reality isn't it. This is about how society feels about men who rape and women who are raped. About virgins and whores, good girls and bad girls who got what was coming to them, and men who can't be expected to behave any other way.

It's all bloody rubbish to be quite frank.

I want to ask this but a bit scared so pleased be gentle and explain

I get that rape carried out by the rapist is always their fault and never the vicitms.

But heres the thing...because I/we know there are rapists amongst us (is it ok to say this is a fact even?) then is it not resonable to take precautions to reduced the risk of being raped - even though I know we are not responsible for other peoples actions but as potential targets should we not - and if so what should we do?

I've thought about this a lot since having my daughter...if thats wrong too then shoot me but I'm asking as a concerned parent.

If I see a care drivng poorly on I hang back or overtake and get clear as i dont trust their driving. My instinct is to minimise the risk of accident. While I know you cant spot a rapist an thus avoid - the threat of harm from them is out there so what id anything should people do?