Is Mumsnet really a healthy place for advice?

[WildBillfemale]

There seem to be several phrases trotted out again and again irrespective of the problem the OP presents;

Red Flag
Narcissistic
The script
Stonewalling
Gaslighting
Porn addict
LTB
Having a breakdown
On the spectrum
Cherchez la femme
EA
E/affair
MH issues etc

Having seen in the last few days a post that presented facts of an admittedly horrible row but a marriage that could probably be saved with some introspection and will (with the OP stating she loved her husband and wished to remain married to him) quickly turn into 100s and 100s of posts telling/ordering her to LTB is this really a healthy place to post asking for objective advice?
Some posters are excellent in doing that but there are far too many whose views are so muddied by their own unique experience that the advice is actually very damaging.............

As I said on another thread, I personally would never ask for help/advice about step-parenting, ever. This place just goes bat shit crazy about what that involves, and I say that from the pov of a step mum and step child. But I have seen some get some helpful advice for relationships on here. But I do think some people forget that any Internet forum is not real life

I do think sometimes, what people need when they're really upset with an otherwise lovely partner is people saying 'wow, that's awful, what a bastard' - partly so the OP can take five minutes to indulge in a bit of ranting, and partly so s/he can then move on and rationalise to herself (and less, to the rest of us) what the partner's good points are.

If you come out of that process feeling more certain than ever that your DH is a good guy and that MN is wrong to be yelling for his blood, is that such a terrible thing? It's probably more or less the same process you'd have gone through on your own, just speeded up.

I think for the most part the advice here is pretty good.

I do sometimes find myself slightly cringing at the frequency of the AFFAIR shouts when there are dozens of innocent explanations, and the force of posters who are adament that men and women shouldn't be friends, text etc unless in a relationship with each other. I also think that often a male viewpoint would be welcome. But it's a site with a heavy female bias, so it stands to logic that posts will be female biased too.

All that said, the thing that really stands out is the support here.

And generally speaking, the thing that most of us can find parallels with is the experience of other people. I don't know about everyone else but certainly within my group of friends there are people who have experienced lots within relationships but don't necessarily talk about it because they don't want people to know for whatever reason, so it can he a lot more difficult to get that level of experience that we can empathise with in our social circles.

and the force of posters who are adament that men and women shouldn't be friends, text etc unless in a relationship with each other.

this always surprises me, even after quite a few months.

it's like ... there's this strong, honest, robust board where women and a few men can talk pretty straightforwardly and the ethos is profoundly anti-misogyny.

Then there's this weird view that no no no you mustn't be friends with any men becuase there's always sexual attraction in a relationship, if you say there isnt you're denying it or naive, and you can't be friends if there's any attraction.

Hello, incongruity. Saudi Arabia type views :o I'm not sure whom it's more insulting to, men or women.

IMO relationships is a place where far too many people can live out their own agendas and project their own issues into someone else’s situation. There are also IMO far too many posters here who are put on pedistals and held up as “experts” when actually they are generally just extremely opinionated and far more harsh than many others would be comfortable with. There are certainly some who would speak from their own experience (have spotted lweji on this thread who is one such poster) but there is a difference between talking of how it is possible to leave/the decisions you personally have made which an op may or may not listen to, and actively telling someone that this is what they must do, and then becoming aggressive when that op doesn’t follow what they’ve been told to do, and there are certainly plenty of well-known and even respected posters who do exactly that on the relationships threads.

What people seem to forget is that no-one on mn is an actual expert on anyone else’s relationship, and there is no one size fits all approach to how things should be done. It always makes me a bit when people say “we need on this thread, or “listen to she speaks sense/knows what she is talking about.” Because actually most of what the so-called experts on here is just opinion and supposition.

And god help anyone who doesn’t follow the “advice” given on here. I read a thread a few months ago from a poster who had found out her h was having an affair. H was remorseful, ended the affair, vowed to make changes and from what I’ve read since they are working on their marriage. But at the time she was very harshly criticised for not leaving him, not doing as she’d been told, and accused of loving the drama etc etc etc all because she didn’t follow the wisdom of the known “experts.”

And yes, there is a definite difference between how men and women are viewed on here. Man lashes out at his partner – “call the police, leave the bastard tonight, make sure you’re all safe,” (all of which are sound advice fwiw), but if woman lashes out at her h then it’s “could you be depressed/what did he do to provoke you/you need to get some help with your anger but he needs to take responsibility for his part as well.” I’ve seen it countless times on here and god help anyone who suggests that the man should leave and take the kids if he’s the victim. And people hold up the “men aren’t as likely to be victims” excuse to justify that response.

Great post wannaBe

Spot on.

There are some posters on MN with strange ideas, which is to be expected really on a large public forum. But I think generally there is a good balance and people usually err on the side of support. Even on this thread, I've read a few posts and thought, "I don't agree with that," but lots of others which I've nodded along to.

I don't think it's useful to tell an OP (who is keen to change) that she has done awful things and must change. It's possible to be challenging and supportive, but I think there's been too much of the former recently.

The thing I really hate reading on this board is stuff along the lines of, "You won't follow all this marvellous advice; you never do." Usually said to a troubled OP who is doggedly returning time and time again but is still trapped in an awful situation. It's just a horrible thing to say.

Of course it is not... and totally different to asking 'real life' friends too. People write things on the internet that they would never dream of saying in real life.

And I can't help but feel there are a lot of MNers who quite frankly get off on the drama of some of these relationship threads. And I suspect quite a few OPs are simply made up scenarios designed to get a good bun fight going.

Perhaps we need a poll...

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/relationships/2169738-Did-MN-give-you-good-advice-or-shit-advice

Mmm.

I know what you mean, wannabe, but I think there's also (from some quarters) a bit of undeserved resentment directed at the posters who get listened to a lot. I rarely post on here and when I do, it's to ask for help and support - so I am not saying this because it's my nose out of joint. But I do notice how often people seem almost offended that their one-off post wasn't preferred to that of people who are generally known for their sound advice. Sure, the most prolific posters aren't always the most knowlegeable, but there is a good reason why some people become known names as 'experts', IMO. It's because they know their stuff.

StickEnUp, I hope the OP sees your post because I agree with you.

I think a forum link MM can be an amazing resource of information and support, but can only every 'supplement' RL information and support tailored to the person and their exact circumstances.

This strikes me even more at times in some of the Mental Health posts - I know virtual hand-holding on here can be, quite literally, a life-line, but that also puts a disproportionate amount of responsibility on some random internet stranger which I suspect can be quite a burden. I think in general the Relationship board is great, I agree it cuts through lot of the everyday 'you must work at your relationship' which is obviously futile if only ONE party involved is making an effort, but accept sometimes advice can be a bit one-sided.

I stick with my initial post on this thread that I do think MN is a 'healthy' place to seek advice re relationship or MH or many other issues. It's a forum, a very good and varied forum where lots of wise, kind and experience people are prepared to spend time and effort to help others, but that's also it's limitation.
It's a forum. Not RL, not privy to all the information necessary and yes, prone to subject opinions being voiced. Always answering everything from ones one experience can be quite limiting IMO. But if still love MN

wannabe, are you referring to my thread re. my DH's affair?

It's a good place for advice because otherwise where else can you go? If you, like me, don't have a group of diverse friends and family who don't mind the status quo changing? Put up and shut up seems to be the norm for me in rl, but they aren't living it:( and I think people post having read threads and want to see what others think and what to do.

Also, its a good way to check if what's happening is ok, and you don't think you are going mad.

Also, I feel quite good about a recent pm I received about how my suggestion for something ( via a pm as it was a law firm) has totally changed her life and for the better. So, if just by doing one small thing, and taking the time to do it, i have helped someone, I'm very pleased.

Actually, I posted over a year ago about someone I was dating at the time and nobody said to LTB.

Under a different username I posted about my marriage.

The advice I received really did open my eyes.
It made me realise I should call Women's Aid and speak to the Police.
I did both and left.

In the haze created by living in an abusive relationship the most honest advice given by strangers with no vested interest in your situation can be invaluable.

Without drama or hyperbole I can honestly say that the posters on MN relationships board saved my sanity and very possibly my life too.

Sometimes, the advice given is extreme, sometimes posters are vehement.
But an OP can choose to act on the advice given or not.

Spot on wannaBe. There is no way I would ask for advice on a personal problem.

You are also spot on about dual standards. Very different advice is dished out depending on gender.

Very different advice is dished out depending on gender.

Yes, I agree, that can be true, but is also often entirely appropriate.

You can get different advice depending on gender, but not from all posters.

Four125 & all the others posting in the same vein - thank you for posting that, it's nice to hear from posters who have been helped and who are now living safer & happier lives x

there is a definite difference between how men and women are viewed on here. Man lashes out at his partner – “call the police, leave the bastard tonight, make sure you’re all safe,” (all of which are sound advice fwiw), but if woman lashes out at her h then it’s “could you be depressed/what did he do to provoke you/you need to get some help with your anger but he needs to take responsibility for his part as well.”

Actually I haven't seen that, I've seen a woman being told to leave the marital home for being violent.

However, assuming that that is the case and it might be on occasions, I do think there is a difference between someone coming on the board confessing and worried because they were violent to their partner, or another person saying that they have been the victim of violence.

If a person is remorseful and already seeking help...

And again, I don't agree with violence in any shape or form, but even the weediest man is stronger than a woman so when we are talking about physical violence, we are not comparing like with like.

I don't ever tell people I think they should LTB, I only tell people if I did under similar circumstances, what my reasoning was, and what it's been like since.

Not because I think my decision would be right for everyone, but because I think that what helped me when I was in that position, was hearing from other people who had been through similar and had survived.

Very aggressive LTB posts have their place, because it shows you that what has happened is serious and would be unacceptable to most people, but they're also quite hostile and frightening when you're right in the middle of an awful situation.

Some posts will reassure you that you're not over reacting; some posts will give clear impartial advice on what you should do next; others will give you the benefit of others' experiences and reassure you that you will come out the other side ok; and some are people who are very troubled and are just projecting. You have to use your own judgement to work out which is which.