Is Mumsnet really a healthy place for advice?

[WildBillfemale]

There seem to be several phrases trotted out again and again irrespective of the problem the OP presents;

Red Flag
Narcissistic
The script
Stonewalling
Gaslighting
Porn addict
LTB
Having a breakdown
On the spectrum
Cherchez la femme
EA
E/affair
MH issues etc

Having seen in the last few days a post that presented facts of an admittedly horrible row but a marriage that could probably be saved with some introspection and will (with the OP stating she loved her husband and wished to remain married to him) quickly turn into 100s and 100s of posts telling/ordering her to LTB is this really a healthy place to post asking for objective advice?
Some posters are excellent in doing that but there are far too many whose views are so muddied by their own unique experience that the advice is actually very damaging.............

No - a good place for debate but not advice.
If you are feeling low keep off, it isn't for the faint hearted. If you are strong enough to take the useful and ignore the rest then it is fine.
Many posters have their own agenda and move away from OP as they are using their own experience instead.

I think it depends where in the relationship issue you are at the time that you post your OP. If you have already left someone or are in the process of doing so, the advice can be invaluable because a number of MNers have already been through it and can advise not only on the practical aspects but also on the emotions that the OP may expect to go through.

I think where you have to take the advice from MN 'with a pinch of salt' is if you're still in the thick of your relationship. Everyone has a different level of acceptance and also what makes them happy.

My marriage is pretty crap right now, DH has moved into the spare room. We don't talk at all and avoid each other at all costs. BUT and it's a big but. We have been here before and come out the other side. I was single for many many years and I HATED EVERY SECOND of it. I would rather have this situation than be on my own. I know that the general MN consensus to my situation would be LTB, but just because I'm not happy now, doesn't mean I would be any happier without DH. I think how people deal with their relationships is based on their past experiences, whatever they might be and that indepth information is rarely provided in the OP so advice cannot be given accurately in those situations.

I wanted to keep my relationship during the bad times when I now wish I would have left.
Wanting to be in the relationship doesn't mean we should be in it.

The one thing that does annoy me is the posters who can't just give different advice to others without feeling the need to ridicule what people who disagree with them write.

I agree with this.

I also don't like how posters make assumptions about other posters lives.

I was once accused of not having a clue as to what DV was about. On fact I have a grater insight than most.

It is a good place, bit people have to accept that not all will agree with each other

wildbill you do make that same point over and over on you posts in Relationships. You certainly seem to have an agenda which is he's only having a bad day/week/month/life. Often you ignore much evidence to the contrary.

But that is your opinion. And this is an open forum.

So contrary to my previous comments here, I will concede that this often can be a place to get bad advice.

Sorry for typos... On my phone

Of course you get bad advice here.

I'll even say that sometimes even the best pps give bad advice.

But it's a forum, and people get lots of different advice and will take what they want or feel appropriate.

Not even in real life we can make people leave. And I wish I could make a friend leave. But we can't, and it certainly won't be MN if the person is not ready.

However, sometimes it feels like there is no other option than stay and MN often ends up showing a whole range of possibilities and resources.
It may also help validate feelings that we want to discount, because we have been trained to "work at relationships" - even though they may be bad for us, and even though we may be the only ones working on them.

Becool - new to the relationships boards, but agree with your last post (8.20am) entirely.

Ref the thread originally referred to, I am glad there's an 'update', it answers a lot of the criticisms raised in the original.

I have found, in a short time, it reaffirms the strength in my own relationship, but helps me be a little more assertive at times, and, given I come from a dysfunctional family, that does help me a lot.

Lots of perspectives and viewpoints, which is great. In the main.

I've been told on here by numerous people to leave my dh. I take it with a pinch of salt.

He's not abusive or nasty or anything but simply refuses to do anything socially with me such as evenings out, holidays. While I accept its not great and I wish things were different I'm happier staying with him and have kind of carved out my own social life with friends instead of him. It does honestly work for me but many on here can't understand that and think I should leave.

I take it all with a pinch of salt.

The one thing that does annoy me is the posters who can't just give different advice to others without feeling the need to ridicule what people who disagree with them write
There are some really nasty people on mumsnet. Ignore them.

I am very pro LTB on many threads (not all obviously). I don't have any shame in that, because, well to be frank, I have no ulterior motive on these boards. I'm not a divorce lawyer, or a family lawyer, or a bitter multiple divorcee (as the MRA boards like to imagine most women here). It doesn't make a difference to me one way or the other, so why would I not give advice that I think is genuinely in the interest of the OP?

I have seen too many women amongst my friends and in my family, stay in truly miserable marriages, and completely sacrifice their own happiness for no reason whatsoever, other than a tacit acceptance from society in general, that they should. I don't know any men like that (although I am not saying that they don't exist of course).

The fact is, you only get one life. Many problems in a marriage can be worked through if both parties are willing to do so and the problems aren't abusive. The problem here is that many of the women say that they have suggested counselling, and their partners have refused. Or they try to talk about issues with their partners and get shouted down or stonewalled. Or the issues are so long standing that there is just no going back from them.

On affairs there is almost always a huge split of opinion. It's almost like a black and white issue.

There are those who think an affair is a deal breaker, and that there is no point of return from it. This is my perspective. Having an affair to me is the equivalent of murdering a relationship stone cold dead.

Then there are those who think an affair is often a starting point of negotiations within the marriage, and that if you work on the marriage then it can be saved. It's the equivalent of a relationship being sick, not dead.

I think that's why temperatures run high on affair threads.

IMO some people get some help from it some of the time.

But I partially agree with the OP in so much as the Relationships forum can be at times dominated by people who find it impossible to be objective and 'advise' only from their own perspective - which often includes a broken relationship. On balance, the forum seems to be inhabited more by women who have been hurt/ left/ betrayed than women ( and men ) in long term happy relationships. Some of the advice is relevant but often it's a place for them to vent via another poster's distress, and they use it as a cathartic experience.

Investing too much time and energy on a forum is not IMHO a healthy way to live - there are careers and professions where people who want to do this could do so, professionally.

One thing I do disagree with strongly is the use of psychological 'labels'- like narcissism etc - because unless the poster is a trained psychologist/ psychiatrist it's just not right to tag people in this way- especially on the basis of an internet dialogue with a 3rd party.

Women who are being abused, but are having it 'normalised' by themselves, other people, do not post on the domestic violence board. They post here, in relationships. Of all the forums I have been on this one, on MN is probably the single most valuable resource for women in bad or abusive relationships, with husbands, partners, mothers, fathers, in laws, siblings, friends, colleagues - you name it - they get support.

They are supported to leave, go no contact, get help. They are belived.

They are not told that they have to put up with it, for any reason.

I so wish I'd had this place in my 20s. Then I wouldn't have tried to 'make it work' with a functionally alcoholic emotional abuser.

Women should not have to put up with being treated like shit, just because they are women.

I'm also wondering when this topic will appear in the dreaded DM

Investing too much time and energy on a forum is not IMHO a healthy way to live - there are careers and professions where people who want to do this could do so, professionally.

While I agree with the first part, lots of people volunteer in many organisations, including Samaritans and so on.
This forum is somewhat the equivalent, except that people are not trained.

Most posters will direct other people to seek help from professionals and trained volunteers, which is only right.
But many people find it scary and overwhelming to seek a professional, often about what they think it's a relatively minor problem.

It's interesting to see on the update that the FIL was shocked and recommended that the OP should call the police should the OH threaten her again. So, it must not be only us old hags in here.

While I agree with the first part, lots of people volunteer in many organisations, including Samaritans and so on.
This forum is somewhat the equivalent, except that people are not trained

And that is the whole point!

People who are Samaritans have on-going training. There are boundaries. I have 2 friends who are Samaritans. They never give advice. They never talk about their own experiences.

I have 4 friends who are BACP counsellors. They have on-going supervision. This is part of the job.

One of the reasons is so that they do not allow their own lives and experiences to impact on their professional role. Counsellors do not give advice. I have had 4 experiences of counselling over my life. I couldn't tell you anything about any of them- they don't 'share'.

And RTFP:
"Most posters will direct other people to seek help from professionals and trained volunteers, which is only right."

So what's the point of an internet forum Pinkfrocks? If those of us who contribute too regularly (IYO) should stop giving advice and go work for the Samaritans, if anyone who has been divorced should keep quiet, and if the rest of the contributors should not 'share' their personal experiences.... who is left?

MN works because it's real people sharing real experiences with other real people. It's a conversation.

great post notquitesoonedge

One thing I do disagree with strongly is the use of psychological 'labels'- like narcissism etc - because unless the poster is a trained psychologist/ psychiatrist it's just not right to tag people in this way- especially on the basis of an internet dialogue with a 3rd party.

I actually at times think that this can be quite dangerous. Armchair diagnosis are never IMO a goid idea.

Our role is like a friend's role, except we are anonymous.
To tell friends it takes courage and it may change their perceptions. They are often mutual friends.

Here it's a safe place to get opinions and bounce off ideas.
People won't post if they don't think they have a problem to start with.

We refer to the professionals.

I think that sometimes we get so used to reading "words on a screen" that we forget that there is a real person behind those words, it isnt just an interactive online game.

Totally agree with this.

I just think that there are some posters who- if they want to be really useful- should train and do this kind of stuff in RL- if that's what floats their boat- because being on a forum so much shows a gap in their own lives which means they are not always best placed to offer non-judgemental advice.

(And I hold my hands up that sometimes I waste too much time here)

Lwiji

It's as if you and I are reading a different forum!

There is some referring to counsellors etc but not always.

The fact that it's anon is not always positive! There are numerous posts here from people who say things that I assume they would never say face to face to a friend: 'Fuck the fuck off', and similar.

MN forums are renowned for being bullying, witch hunts and not a nice place much of the time.

You ought to read the papers more and see the consensus out there!