Help me decide what is best or least worst!

[Onepollock]

I left my H 2 months ago taking our two young children to my parents. I had a long running post here which I pulled when I found he'd been accessing my MN account.

I left because the atmosphere at home had become really hostile, he was drinking heavily, name calling it ignoring me, refused counselling etc.

2 months on we're no further forwards. Our oldest starts school in Sept and i'm desperate to get home so he can go on bus to school with his friends etc.

I have asked him to leave the house and he'a refused. I have now suggested one night a week and every other Fri and sat he would sleep in house with kids if he agrees not to drink. The rest of the time he would stay at a place we've been offered. This would be until end of year and then be reviewed but would at least get me back in the house. He has now suggested counselling (post seeing a lawyer whereas before he had laughed at me when i suggested it) and i've said i will go with him during this 4 month period.

however he's said no as its 'all on my terms' and I can return to either oexist with him under pre agreed terms or that we should share the house exactly 50/50.

The children aren very young (just 4 and 2.5) and aren't used to me being away from them very much. In the 2 months I've been away he hasn't contacted them at all during the week.

Would you do 50/50 to get back into the house. I think I have accepted our relationship is over but want to know what the right thing is to do for the children.

Thanks.

It's possible he actually hates himself, but you pay the price.

IF he's willing to work on his drinking, then let him. Let him sort himself out.
Then you can decide if you want him back or not.

Not at this stage. Not at your expense, or at the expense of the children.
If you back down now he will have no incentive to change.

Start the divorce. Leave your solicitor to deal with everything apart from when the children go to see him.

Ask the solicitor where you would stand on getting him out of the house as it is better for the children to be there and he has another available place.

If he talks about anything but the children refer him to your solicitor and end the conversation.

You will not get anywhere engaging with him. As far as he is concerned he is right, you are wrong and his drinking is not an issue. You cannot change this so don't waste your life trying to.

Just divorce

Who has the time and energy for this headfuck ?

You are caught up in such an emotional web. One step at a time and keep on going away from the centre of it ( your husband ). Get and follow impartial advice, such as your lawyer's.

Your kids are very young, at that age they will adapt quickly to new circumstances , even make new friends entirely. I understand why you are trying to give them what you have idealised for them, but an alternative is not going to affect them as much as you think.

Your H is a fish on a hook and is flopping around saying or doing anything to try to get off. Ask your lawyer about that one. Don't waste time counselling try to make it as quick and clean as possible. Be the bitch if you have to. You are making decisions in the best interests of your family. He doesn't want anything to change.

I have just taken our son to his graduation ceremony for preschool! H said he wanted to come but then didn't. He missed out it was so sweet. He has however clearly told his family I am obstructing his access by not allowing overnight stays. Even though he often turns me down when I suggest he sees them during the week.

He has completely done me in. I can't think about anything else. I can't concentrate on work. He went round to neighbours last night and told them we're working on things and we'll get there!! Maybe we might have done if he would let us move back into the house in a way I would feel comfortable with. He keeps saying you want your own way. Its on your terms or nothing. If he thinks that any of this is on my terms he is deluding himself while sitting in a 4 bed fully paid for house while I drive around the countryside dropping off children. that's my problem apparently because I chose to move out! Forgetting the fact that we were arguing bitterly or that he was drinking heavily and no progress was being made at all. He seems to have re written what happened eliminating all of that and creating a story whereby I just left on a whim. We have such fundamental problems that moving back in together before we've done some work on our relationship is madness. I'll only have to uproot the children again which would be so unfair on them.

I know it seems like I'm pathetically going around in circles here. I'm sure it seems obvious to you but at the moment I have a life in our village which we all love. I know I will start again if I have to but I'm upset that I have to.

Can I just move back in and change locks?! (sort of only joking here....)

You are right. You are going in circles and can't think. Which is understandable not pathetic, as you are dealing with an irrational person who is exploiting the situation. That's why you need to get impartial advice and follow it. An impartial adviser can cut through your fog and his BS. That's why so many PPs have told you to go get a SHL!

Its OK to be very upset. Have you got some RL support? But its also OK for you to take charge and make a decision here for the best for YOU and follow it one little step at a time with the help of someone who can see through the fog.

Thanks stampy. I've been giving it one last shot for a long time hoping he will come round to the understanding we need to be apart not least because as our relationship is no example to the children.

i met up with him last night to see if we could agree on me moving back to the house for a while and him seeing the children regularly but basing himself elsewhere. We couldn't! I am still being selfish. We should coexist. Or share the house 50/50. Essentially he doesn't want to move out of the house which and that seems to be his primary concern. He has re written history and said I haven't accepted how badly I'd behaved in the past! No mention of his heavy drinking or name calling or ignoring at all.

So for sanity's sake I have to go for a divorce. The petition is all ready to go. I think we have to go to mediation? I think he will probably contest the divorce as well but at least I can get this started. I've already spent 3k on solicitor's bills just to get to this point! I think I have to accept we won't get any further collaboratively!

Contesting a divorce is futile and very expensive.

Only absolute complete dickheads do it.

No solicitor would advise him to contest.

Just take it one step at a time and you will get there. First step is telling your sol to issue the petition.

You do need to submit the petition. Good luck.

Just divorce
Who has the time and energy for this headfuck?

^^THIS^^^
With bells on.

He probably hates himself as well as everyone else but it's easier to blame others for his shortcomings, in fact, his complete lack of respect for you and the kids.

Please do not put yourself in a position again of him being able to abuse you and upset the children.

Why do you even care what he thinks, his brain will be rotten with the booze anyway. Co exist, you tried that, didn't work!!!!!!!

How are you going OP? I remember you're original thread, and am glad to hear from you.

Hi Scouse Thanks for asking.

I put in a divorce petition today so feeling quite shaky. I saw H earlier as I had to drop something off and after 10 weeks with him refusing to move out of the house when I suppose I should be so angry with him I can't help but feel dreadful or question whether I have done the right thing. Either way I need to have somewhere to live with the kids but I don't think for a second he think I will divorce him. We haven't sent a draft first as he is very likely to try and get a petition in first if he sees it so it will come as a surprise.

Why do I feel so guilty?

You are so used to putting yourself last that doing something positive - and this is a positive thing- for yourself is leading to the guilt imo.

Only someone truly selfish would stay in the house refusing to let you and the dcs come home. You will never get anything you need or any help from him. Plan for him being a complete twat and then if he has any decent action it's a bonus - if not then at least you are prepared. Good luck - the only way is up and onwards.

Oh but I am 'allowed' to come back. Despite my behaviour he's keeping the door open for me and the children! Apparently I'm lucky he's still talking to me.

All the drinking, swearing, belittling etc were isolated incidents that I've put together to construct a picture that sounds good to other people.

Why do I sort of buy it? Is it a guilt that perhaps he's a bit right? Sometimes I think towards the end I deliberately discussed difficult subjects with him to see how bad his reaction would get.

He says he still wants it to work! But at the same time wants me to recognise the problems were all mine.

Please don't buy it. How could all the problems have been yours? It was his behaviour that's problematic (in lots of ways) and he's responsible for it, not you. He's just denying that responsibility The 'it's not my fault but all yours and I'll still have you back' thing is classic bullying. He'd like to control your views on all this too by telling you what to think and you (being conditioned to this) are wondering if he's right and your own view is wrong... Have faith in your own opinion. It's valid and worthwhile. He's welcome to his but he can't (and shouldn't want to) dictate how you see things.

He sounds like he has zero insight or ability to reflect on his own behaviour. You've done the right thing with the petition. Time to take back control..

One this man is seriously, seriously deluded and is completely ignoring the truth and reality of the situation. He is so, so, so deluded that he has completely rewritten the 'story' and what has happened/is happening, despite what the facts of the situation are, despite what you and others are telling him, and despite the reality of the situation. I think your description of him is the most out-of-touch-with-reality description I have ever read about a person. Dealing with someone like this is a hard road to toil, and I fear that this will be a long and arduous battle for you.

This is why many posters are saying to you that you should just go your own way in this:

1. Proceed with the divorce (without his input, take the advice of your solicitor only)

1. Disengage from him (reduce and eventually stop contact altogether, do not listen to his rantings and make your own decisions)

1. Listen to your own mind and your own thoughts and feelings on this. You have come across as rational and thoughtful in your posts. Trust your own mind and your own reality in this situation

I wish you all the strength and best wishes in the world One - he is not going to be easy to deal with, and is really out of touch with the truth.

Thank you zazzles. I know this sounds mad but perhaps it is me who is deluded. I'm now totally confused and I don't trust my judgment any longer.

The divorce petition is in and I felt I'm ready to move forwards. I have been meet H and his sister so the children can have a few days with his sister and him by the coast and I can work. I have to admit we had a lovely day on the beach and I felt so sad about the fact we won't be a family any longer plus I felt selfish as the children clearly loved us both being there. He said he wished I was staying, that he really does love me and I felt appalling as he doesn't know the petition is in.

I said for there to be even a vague chance of it ever working he must commit to counselling alone. Stopping or cutting back on drinking and allowing me and the children to move back to our house and for him to move out while he is going to counselling. We can then review at the end of the year. I know none of this will happen but it is the bare min we would need to have even a vague chance of getting back together.

He then started saying I had no reason to leave, he didn't acknowledge any of the dr king, swearing, ignoring and the cruelty plus never resolving arguments he just said that I needed to acknowledge taking the children away and going to a solicitor was a huge mistake. At the time I didn't have an option other than living in unresolved misery for a long time. He did try and be nice at points but always under the surface there was this simmering anger. I feel like I'm dealing with two people or at the very least the front shown to most people does not match with what he really feels.

I know you'll say I should def go and I know I deserve to have someone who believes my point of view is valid but today, as long as we didn't discuss anything to do with our problems, we had a very nice time together and the children deserve two parents together if that's at all possible.

Should I pause divorce proceedings? Can I?

No, don't pause them!

He has a way of making you feel guilty, but you really shouldn't. I've been reading this thinking there is no way I could live with him - he would drive me crazy. If anyone (eg neighbours) speaks to you about it, just say, "He's an alcoholic and impossible to live with. Yes, of course he can act normal with you, but believe me he's a nightmare at home." Let them believe whatever they want, but don't forget if they were living with him, they'd be looking to leave him, too.

Have you spoken to your solicitor about getting an injunction to make him leave the house?

Yes and he said I had a 50/50 chance so he advised against trying. I don't have much in the way of evidence against him and idiotically when i popped back to the house last week cleared up a huge red wine spillage all up walls and floor that he had obv done when he was pissed and hadn't noticed/remembered.

When I first left the solicitor wrote a letter asking him to move out (he owns another flat) and if he didn't we might have to consider trying for an injunction bit now we haven't H is using it as a big stick to beat me over head with saying I should apologise for even suggesting it and for going to a lawyer in the first place.

Oh OP. He is a right plonker. Do not apologise for seeking a better life for yourself and your children. You have nothing to be guilty for.

You say that you had a nice time the other day, not discussing any of the problems that are present... But is that anyway to live? You've said that you tried "coexisting" for months, and that it was never going to work. You are doing the best by yourself and by your children with this divorce. A life of joy and happiness is waiting for you OP, and you will get there even if you can't see the wood for the trees right now.

thinking of you and wishing you courage and strength

One you aren't deluded in the slightest. Don't even allow yourself to think or ponder that thought.

Know why? I have been posting a bit lately, but I have lurked lots and lots here over the last few years, trying to figure out my own issues. I have seen some real, actual deluded, selfish and irrational people post on MN as well - guess what, they get a pasting and get called out here, they are told they are selfish, self absorbed and off the planet. No one here is questioning you on what has/is happening in your life. The only one that doesn't see your reality is your STBXH (I would suggest you start using this acronym), and he is an alcoholic. Please remind yourself constantly "What I know to be true, is true, no matter what anyone else (particularly an alcoholic) tells me." You see the facts and are acting in accordance with the facts, not some made up fallacy that makes your STBXH look 'normal'. He is not normal, he is addicted to alcohol. Why believe someone who sees the world through the hazy lens of alcohol?

If I recall correctly, there were other posts in your last thread that pointed out other family members were trying to influence you from taking measure that ensure your and your DC safety - look at them with a critical eye, and come back for further perspectives if you need them.

Wishing you all the strength and courage in the world to see this through One. Remember it takes several goes for someone quit smoking, if you falter, pick yourself up and start again, you will get there.