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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

DP directing aggressive panic attacks at me

794 replies

Sapphire18 · 09/06/2014 11:20

Sorry this is long - basis of it is my partner having panic attacks which are in the form of very aggressive behaviour. Here are the details:

I am looking for advice on a recurring problem with my fiancé. We have been together for 9 years and got engaged a few months ago. It was in the third year of our relationship (when we first lived together) that I first experienced him having a kind of panic attack in which he becomes very aggressive towards me. It has never got to the point of actual violence but this has happened several times and is always extremely scary, upsetting and leaves me feeling really shaken up and tearful. About two years ago it really got to the point where I gave him a sort of ultimatum and he did a stress management course. It seemed to help as he learned coping mechanisms like going for a walk when feeling stressed, and spotting the triggers / warning signs. Since he did the stress management course there have been considerably fewer of these incidents (e.g. once every 6-9 months?) however last night it happened again. The previous incident was 5 months ago.

To give you an idea of what actually happens – it’s usually triggered by his frustration that I am not listening to him / he can’t control or change something. E.g. the previous incident was his frustration at not being able to stop me feeling depressed. Last night it was that he thought I was not listening to him when he was trying to explain to me about a DIY problem we’ve been having.

He uses his physicality to stop me leaving the room when I am trying to end a conversation calmly or storm out in an argument. I have tried to explain I am using the same technique he learned in stress management but he thinks I am dismissing the conversation we’re having.

Last night I told him I didn’t want to talk about the DIY as he was using a very patronising tone with me (and it was almost midnight and I wanted to get ready for bed). He blocked me from leaving the room to go to the bathroom. I repeatedly asked him to move and he refused, saying he wanted to make me understand the DIY problem. I felt trapped and got up on the bed to get out of the room by a different route. He jumped up on the bed and held his arms around my legs so I couldn’t move. I told him he was hurting my knee (which is recovering from a bike accident) and he refused to let go. I repeatedly asked him but he wouldn’t so I pinched his ear and kicked him and hit him. Not hard enough to really hurt but as a warning / to make him let me go. He didn’t let go and got me down on the bed, I calmly told him I would count to 10 and then he was to let me go. I was really starting to panic but I thought if I do I will really lash out and then we’ll both get hurt, plus I am already injured from my bike accident. He let me go on 10 and I went to leave the room but he stood in the doorway and said he wouldn’t let me until I listened to him.

By now things were calmer and we were talking rather than shouting. I told him he must not ever use his physicality over me like that. He was still focused on our disagreement over the DIY and I told him that was so minor by comparison – what I was now concerned at was his bullying behaviour. I was quite assertive that he must never ever do that (but I’ve said that before). I thought we’d de-escalated things and then I can’t remember what happened but he flipped out having one of his panic attacks. When this happens he adopts a really weird tone of voice, sounds really unstable and a bit crazy; he told me I don’t love him, I want him to hurt himself, I want him to kill himself; he threw himself around the room and I was afraid he’d hurt himself or break something; he banged his head against the floor; ripped at his clothes until he was half naked; writhed on the floor and curled up in a ball with panicked breathing and sobbing; demanded I hold his hands to make him feel safe; refused my offer of rescue remedy but then took it. These behaviours are all absolutely typical of when he gets like this. I didn’t know what to do but basically took the attitude I would with a tantruming toddler – being firm yet supportive, and trying to get him out of it without showing any emotion. However I was really torn as I didn’t want him to think behaving in this way is the way to control me or get my attention. I couldn’t seem to do anything right, whether I went near him or backed away. I was desperately trying to calm him as I was afraid he’d wake our housemates and I know when he gets like this he doesn’t care who’s watching and has no shame.

In the end I left him curled up in a ball on the floor and told him I was going to the bathroom but would come back. I was really shaken and panicky and didn’t know what to do. He was begging me not to leave him. When I returned about 2 minutes later he was in bed sobbing, saying he was only asking me to hold his hands because he felt so scared and panicked, and making out I’d been really heartless. I told him he’d really scared me, it was unacceptable and he should be in control of himself. He told me panic attacks just happen – I have experienced them too but I don’t think they necessarily mean lashing out at someone else! Then he was very apologetic, but I couldn’t stand to have him hug me, it just made my skin crawl.

I tried to sleep but couldn’t stand being near him, so tried to go to the spare room. He told me I shouldn’t; that he should; took my pillows off me so I couldn’t leave with them; begged me to stay. We tried again to talk but I was exhausted by now and said we should just go to sleep. He told me I am the one who holds all the power in this relationship, and that he did touch me when he was stopping me leaving the room, but it’s the closest we get to any intimacy these days. Admittedly we do have less sex since moving into a shared house.

This morning he told me he’d been up most of the night having panic attacks, and had to go for a walk to calm down at 5.30am (I did hear him go out then). He was very apologetic, asked me for a hug then got upset when I couldn’t bring myself to. He protested that he hasn’t got like this for ages (it used to happen much more regularly). He suggested we do relationship counselling ‘before we make any commitments’ – i.e. marriage (we’ve talked of this before) and I think it might be a good idea. I am a bit worried at the cost at an average of £50 though, and a little scared at what we might end up saying to one another.

I just don’t know what to do. Whenever this happens I ask myself what I am doing in this relationship. It makes me feel so vulnerable and frightened, and I don’t know what to do. I think he thinks that because he stops short of actually hitting me, it’s ok, or that because he’s panicking when he does it it’s not his fault. When I call it abusive he says I’m exaggerating. I desperately want him to be able to promise me it’ll never happen again but he says he can’t. I am really happy with the relationship otherwise, and excited to be marrying him but I am wondering if this can be overcome or if I should go on accepting that effectively I am with someone who’ll blow up like this from time to time?

Just to confirm, I am not looking for advice to leave him. I am looking for help in managing / eliminating this behaviour and how to address this issue.

OP posts:
oikopolis · 10/06/2014 16:18

Sapphire I can tell you what I would do, but of course it's up to you.

I would call off tonight and go somewhere safe. Feign illness if you must. Turn off your phone because he's going to blow it up with texts/calls. Have friends with you, TELL them what is going on and that you absolutely need their support during this time. Ring 101 and ask them what you should do if he turns up where you are tonight, write their advice down and give it to your friends. Don't be alone tonight.

I would go to the Relate appointment tomorrow (again, tell friends and have someone to drop you/pick you up/wait in car - seriously) and disclose, and then tell the counsellor (in front of him) that you need a separation period to get your head straight, and could he/she help the both of you sort that out. He will not blow in front of the counsellor, and even if he does, well then you have a witness to the behaviour.

When you walk out of the appointment do not be alone with him. Ask the counsellor to arrange someone to walk out with you. And go to your friend and leave.

Delete texts and emails and do not pick up the phone. Your mind is not a rubbish dump - he can't throw whatever trash he wants into it, least of all when you need to sort out one of the biggest decisions of your life so far. You need peace and space. He is a grown man and will not die without you there.

CookieMonsterIsHot · 10/06/2014 16:20

Ok, you are embarrassed about the wedding. It seems like a big deal to postpone/cancel right now. But the alternatives are worse.

How about telling 5 members of your closest RL friends and family about his behaviour? Tell your GP too, (without your partner's knowledge). See what they say.

I rather suspect you will be bowled over with help and support to make the right choices.

Maisie0 · 10/06/2014 16:25

To me, this is what I would do.

I write him a "closure letter" spilling my heartfelt feelings. Knowing what I cannot do it any more, and what I misjudged. We both checked out, fuelling one another. Never dated others to truly find marriage respectful skills. End. Giving him back hope for his future but it cannot be with me.

I won't go to Relate any more. Cos I have decided to end things, so why need to jump through these hoops now ?

I'd try and find help either from family or friends, that won't give me as much grieve on dealing with all the admin and cancellations. When it is all done. I would hope to find a very very decent and close gf that won't give me any judgmental moves, and we go on a holiday to clear my mind and bring myself back to my senses. (In fact, that is what my close GF do for me, and I would do for them too. No questions asked. No need to dig or to say. We know what we know and that is intuitive enough.)

Cos I need to carry on with life, and find happiness in a good relationship.

SauceForTheGander · 10/06/2014 16:26

I called off a wedding. It was horrendous at the time but I still see this decision as evidence of my ability to do absolutely the right thing. he'd punched me on the thigh in a drunken mood, the culmination of massive argument he woke me up to have - and I had a huge bruise for weeks. Sadly that wasn't even the reason I gave him and I didn't even realise that was abusive.

I know it feels awful - but people close to you just want you to be happy - and if that means postponing a wedding they will support that.

Sillylass79 · 10/06/2014 16:30

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

thornrose · 10/06/2014 16:35

I don't admit this often but I'm going to admit it to you Sapphire, through tears of guilt and shame!

I chose to have a child with an abusive man, 14 years ago, and it still tears me apart to this day.

I was pregnant and had a miscarriage and I desperately wanted to be pregnant again and have another child, more than I've ever wanted anything in my life. So I had a child with him.

My ex partner was becoming more jealous and insecure and getting more physical but I couldn't face walking away and starting again. We'd been together 6 years and I was 32. I panicked about how long it would take to meet another man and get to the point of being ready to have a child together. I convinced myself being a dad would be the making of him.

Our relationship changed after having dd, we were happy together. On reflection having a baby curtailed my freedom which suited him and made him less insecure for a while. Over the months I lost weight and started to want to have some of that freedom back. Tensions started to rise and eventually we had our first violent row since dd was born. He tried to physically stop me from taking dd upstairs when she was in my arms. That's the day I knew I had to leave. I walked out and took her with me a few days before her first birthday.

I was lucky, the violence and emotional abuse didn't affect my dd. She has no idea it ever happened. Ex died 4 years ago and the secret will go with me to my grave. I never want dd to know her father abused me. It makes up in some way for my stupid, stupid decision to choose him as a father, knowing what I knew about him.

Cancelling a wedding is so very overwhelming but the consequences of staying and potentially having children with him will be far, far greater. Please don't go back to him.

I've read and re-read and agonised over this post. I'm going to press post message just in case, even in a tiny way, it might make you think again. It's not too late for you, you can walk away.

hellsbellsmelons · 10/06/2014 16:36

And please remember - abusers can really ramp it up when you are pregnant and when a new baby arrives.
The attention gets taken away from them and things can get really really nasty!

Do NOT meet him tonight. You are not ready. Take control.
You can go tomorrow but you need to advise the counsellor that he has physically, verbally and emotionally abused you.
This should put an immediate stop to the session if the counsellor is any good.

Take your original post if you don't want to say it out loud so that the counsellor can read what happened the other night.

I also called off a wedding. It was horrible. But it was absolutely the right thing to do. It took people a few months to come round (no abuse towards me at all, I just didn't love him) but everything was just fine.

I really feel for you. This must be quite alarming.
You have no other relationship to compare so this is your 'NORMAL'.
But... this is so far away from normal.

As stated previously and as stated on many many threads before this and many more after.
The only acceptable amount of abuse in a relationship is NONE!
That's right NONE!!!

Georgethesecond · 10/06/2014 16:53

It's always "leave the bastard" on here and very often I disagree and I think posters lack information and perspective but just get caught up in the drama of it all. And that some posters have an agenda and never say anything else. But OP - what you have described is not ok and can never be ok. It may feel bad calling off your wedding - but if you don't and you let things go on longer, you'll end up having to tell people that you're getting divorced. Maybe having to tell your child that you are leaving their daddy. I know calling off the wedding doesn't feel like the easy option - but in reality it is, because these are the other options you will be left with.

Sapphire18 · 10/06/2014 16:56

Thank you Georgethesecond - whilst I really appreciate everyone's advice I have found some people tend to jump to conclusions over things on here, and in some cases when I have posted under another name I've found them to be way off the mark. What sticks out here is everyone is saying the same thing. I don't know what to do tonight. My friend is busy and I don't want to bother her. Other people I can think of either live with partners who I'd feel awkward bringing into this, or are our mutual friends. When i think of contacting a different friend from last night I think 'oh no, another person to tell'. I don't whether to meet him, or wait to say something in the Relate session. I just feel so conflicted.

OP posts:
oikopolis · 10/06/2014 16:56

It may feel bad calling off your wedding - but if you don't and you let things go on longer, you'll end up having to tell people that you're getting divorced. Maybe having to tell your child that you are leaving their daddy. I know calling off the wedding doesn't feel like the easy option - but in reality it is, because these are the other options you will be left with.

So so true

CookieMonsterIsHot · 10/06/2014 16:58

Have you called it off tonight? If you feel sick and panicky about it, you could tell him by text that you don't want to see him until tomorrow at Relate. Then switch your phone off.

Taking a print out of your original post to the counsellor is a good idea BUT ONLY if there is no chance of him finding out that you are on MN and your user name (though you can change that of course).

AttilaTheMeerkat · 10/06/2014 16:58

Call your friend, she will not be too busy once she is told of your circumstances now. You need a friend.

oikopolis · 10/06/2014 17:00

Sapphire you really should tell your friends.

This is all going to come out anyway - it's only a matter of time. You may as well tell them now, so that you are not alone.

Why don't you just pick up the phone and call the friend you're thinking of right now? What's the worst that could happen? I feel like you being alone tonight is infinitely worse than the momentary embarrassment of letting a friend - someone who loves you - support you.

Georgethesecond · 10/06/2014 17:02

I think you need it talk it over in real life, tbh.

AdoraBell · 10/06/2014 17:02

Saphire regarding the wedding and telling people, you have already said that he frightens you and has physically hurt you.

Which would you prefer to choose between a)slightly embarrassed and b)afraid combined with physical pain?

LisaMed · 10/06/2014 17:04

How do you think your mutual friends would react if they heard what happened? Take away the 'they would never believe it about him as he is lovely with them' but think how they would look at him and how they would react. How would they react if he treated them like he treated you?

They probably wouldn't be very positive. They would probably want to create some space away from him. That is, if they didn't call the police.

I don't know of any way that you can stop that awful scene repeating and repeating and repeating. That is the long and the short of it. If you stay with him then you are going to get the same again and again and again and it is likely to get worse as things do drift to extremes one way or another.

Hugs.

Lweji · 10/06/2014 17:06

You can stay here tonight or you can switch off and read a book, watch a film or something.
You need to take time to process it all without his pressure.
You owe him nothing.
Not the talk and not the Relate session. He can go by himself.

Just tell him you'll contact him when you are ready. And take care of yourself first.

DenzelWashington · 10/06/2014 17:06

This is so very hard for you, and I'm so sorry. One thing: whatever else you do, please promise you will tell someone in real life what is going on, and do it tonight before you meet your fiance. This is important.

Someone in RL needs to know what you are going through, where you are and what is happening to you. If you were my friend in RL, I would want you to tell me. I would cancel whatever needed to be cancelled to be there for you, have you to sleep over if you wanted that. I bet your friends are no different.

BeCool · 10/06/2014 17:09

Just read this tread and reading the OP I was very confused as I was reading about someone who was high aggressive abusive person - I didn't see anything about panic attacks in there at all. just very scary very real abusive behaviour towards you.

Sapphire you may proceed with this wedding, but just know lots of us here have been through this. There is a reason he is so lovely "in between" the abuse, which is to keep you hooked. But experience shows sadly he will only get worse and things will escalate after you are married.

In case no one has mentioned it yet, please please please read Lundy Bancroft's book "Why Does He Do That" - a few quid on Amazon. it's an eyeopener.

This is HIS issue, only he can change. You can't control this and you do not make it happen.

magoria · 10/06/2014 17:11

It is easier and cheaper to postpone a wedding than going through a divorce will be.

He will not be fixed in a few months and there should be no wedding or marriage until he is.

BeCool · 10/06/2014 17:12

He's really taken this to an whole new level hiding behind claims of 'panic attacks' - it's really devious and sickening.

Sapphire you already have an amazing insight as to what is going on! Work with that, progress with that. Reread your OP after all the responses here. Leave him to work through his own crap rather than focusing on how to control you.

Cocolepew · 10/06/2014 17:14

I hardly ever write a reply on the relationship board, but you must leave him. Imagine if a member of your family or a friend confided in you what you have written. But was too embarrassed to call off her wedding.
You'd be horrified for her and tell her to do it to keep herself safe.
So call yours off.

Please keep yourself safe.
He's not the man for you , you'll will never be happy as long as he is in your life.

Lweji · 10/06/2014 17:15

I was friends with a couple where I have since found out he is abusive. I'm still friends with her and barely tolerate him, for her sake.
I wish she got out.
I don't wish you in her position.
I don't wish you in the position I ended up in because I thought he could be better and I never told anyone. I don't wish your children not being able to have proper contact with their dad.
I don't wish you being afraid in your own home or going through a nasty divorce with an abusive men, where you are as afraid of leaving as of staying.

His bad times are sufficiently bad for you to be in danger.
I know it's hard and you'll need to find the strengh to do it, but do break it off.

Maisie0 · 10/06/2014 17:28

As for tonight, out of so many friends and families out there, which ones can you trust ? Which ones do you think will be there for you and why ? See this as an exercise for independence and you may realise that you are stronger than you think. Trust your judgment. Ask the ones that you trust, and you do not have to tell them every single details, but just the basic that you want to break up and that you need to, and ask for their support without questions, before it brings you to tears again. You do not have to put your friends in a position to choose, but just that you need their support on letting you stay or other, and I think that is enough in itself.

Wadingthroughsoup · 10/06/2014 17:39

Oh my word, you poor thing. This is sickening. I'm so glad you seem to be taking on board some of the excellent posts here.

Many years ago, I had an abusive boyfriend who used to pull stunts like this. One night, he 'collapsed' dramatically on the floor during an argument, and appeared to be having some sort of fit. When I said I was going to call an ambulance, he suddenly, miraculously recovered. He also used to threaten suicide if I said I wantd to leave the relationship. etc etc. I stayed with him for far too long. When I eventually left, he didn't kill himself. Like your partner, he had also been badly bullied at school, and had a very authoritarian father.

Anyway, this isn't about me. I really, really hope you can find the strength to walk away from this man. As many others have said, calling off the wedding will be far less embarrassing than what is likely to happen should you go through with it.

Wishing you all the luck in the world for a brighter future.