Not had sex for almost two years

[Olliedelondon]

I very much love my DW. Before we had our two children, we had a reasonable sex life, although I would always initiate. But since our children we have had very little sex (once every four months maybe) and nothing at all for now almost two years. My DW says that I am unreasonable in my 'needs' and that I should focus all my attentions on looking after the children. But I think it's destroying our marriage and I'm not prepared to sacrifice a sex life and frankly don't see why I should. I also don't think she fancies me. At all. Am I unreasonable? What should I do? I have 'got by' by using pornography in secret. I have also started fantasising about attractive colleagues, although I have never had an affair. The sexual frustration I feel is almost painful...Help?

Milmingebag - I would be happy to devote all my sexual energies just to her. What I crave is intimacy with her and would happily be selfless...

RoganJosh - my children are 2.5 and 9 months.

Ok, well in the circs I agree with Milmingebag - make it about exploring her and having fun without the pressure of 'satisfaction' in the crass sense.

Do something out of the ordinary. Cook dinner while she has a nice bath, buy some flowers? Pay for her to have a spa day? Buy her some luxurious new PJs? Basically this (from 1 minute in):

Lol (but also seriously)

What has been her exact response when/if you have suggested counselling?. Has she stated outright that it would be a waste of time?.

Does she want and expect you to countenance a sexless marriage?.

If she does indeed consider counselling to be a waste of time (my guess is that she is very afraid of sex/intimacy for many reasons unknown as yet to you and the roots of all this could be deeply rooted) then I would go to a counsellor on my own.

Omg just saw your post - if the little one is 9 months and both kids so close together I can understand why you haven't had any for 2 years. Give it time!! I had been assuming they were like 5 and 7.

Infact any one or a combination of all these reasons could be why your wife has decided to withdraw from sex:-

•Negative messages received about sex as a youth
•A lack of clarity about how to initiate sex
•A lack of knowledge about mild practical difficulties regarding sustaining erections, stimulating or increasing lubrication, or compensating for age-related sexual retardation
•A need for more information about cultivating emotional intimacy
•An underestimation of the importance of sexual activity in marriage
•The mistaken belief that arousal should precede sexual activity (in fact, arousal often is a response to sexual activity rather than a precursor)

•Vulvar pain syndromes
•Prostate difficulties
•Back pain
•Chronic physical discomforts (headaches, stomach difficulties, etc.)
•Excessive work demands are leaving no time for sex
•Fragile or friable vaginal tissues from low levels of estrogen
•Heart-attack post-event fears
•Fatigue from too much work and not enough rest

•Inhibitions about being sexual stemming from earlier trauma or abuse
•Withholding of sex because of negative interactions, retribution, or power issues
•Fears of potential rejection
•Concerns about gender identity or homosexual impulses
•Feelings of depressed, which can inhibit desire
•Body image disturbances (resulting in feeling unattractive)
•Attraction difficulties toward spouse

Did you have the youngest child via IVF? I wonder if that was one of the things that caused your sex life to take a nosedive.

So the 2-year period covers her second pregnancy and newborn/early babyhood of your second child?

To be honest I think sex has to be on the back burner when the kids are so young. I'm not saying it should be nonexistent but I think realistically few couples are having fantastic exciting sex every night in that situation. Has she had a good night's sleep in the past year or so? Is she still breastfeeding?

Perhaps try rebuilding affection first rather than pressurising her for sex.

Ok, new idea. Create a nice scene one evening when the kids are in bed. Take her hand and ask her how she feels after childbirth, what it has been like to have two kids close together, how she feels after her body has done this amazing thing. Ask her other things, like does she think she wants another one. Tell her you love her body even more now than you did before and think she's amazing. Tell her she's very sexy as a mum and that you think she's gorgeous. Then DON'T try it on, but rather embrace her and kiss her.

ps By nice scene I mean tidy all the toys off the floor and put the lamps on / turn the main light off etc!!!

she has previously told me that she has never pleasured herself

^ I imagine she is lying chuck.

Sorry.

I think you should make a list of all the things you obviously do around the house for us, you know, if as you say, your DW only looks after the boys, eh?

Who does the meal planning and cooking?
The cleaning - the big weekly clean and the daily?
Who loads and empties the dishwasher? Who cleans the filter?

The grocery and household maintainance and shopping
Who does all the laundry- the sorting, washing drying ironing and organising and storing the clothes to wear in various weathers.

Who waters the plants?
Who does the gardening? Who cleans the decking?
Who cuts the grass?
Who sorts the bins?
Brings things to the dump?

Who buys cards for all the relatives, and plans parties and presents for your inlaws?

Who organises your kids sports lessons, and equipment?
Who organises their social lives?
Who organises your social lives?

Who brings your kids to their school and after school activities?
Who supervises homework?
Who listens to music practice?

Who cleans the windows and keeps the gutters cleared?
Who bleeds the radiators and organises heating oil?
Who selects the utility providers?

Who cleans the windows?
Who does the tidying?
Who does the hoovering?
Who changes the bed linen?
Who teaches the boys to fly kites?
Ride their bikes?

Who does the nighttime teeth brushing supervision?
Who reads to the boys at night?
Who checks for nits?
Who listens to the wheeze and makes the decision to call the GP?

Who organises the holidays?
Who books them and packs for them?

Who feeds the cat /dog / pigs and notices if they are peaky, and keeps track of their worming/ vaccinations and takes pets to the vet?

I think your rubbish wife deserves better than you actually.... 60 hours a weeks work is nothing, most women work more than that, and on the weekends and holidays too....

I think it's very likely that she's knackered, 'touched out' by having very young children with her all day and would prefer a nice hug and a cup of tea rather than sex with you. Not that she doesn't like you but the whole situation isn't conducive to having fabulous sex and I think you should be more understanding. And book counselling, perhaps for yourself only, just to get an outside perspective (apart from Mumsnet!)

Oh dear, your kids are very little. I get that if you have had the kids crawling over you all day you can feel less likely to want anyone else in your personal space. I don't think its unusual to go off sex whilst your pregnant or whilst you have a little baby. I think you could realistically give this some more time.

I really think you have a chance of things working out as your kids are still so little. It's knackering having such little kids but this will improve immensley once they get a bit older.

If I were you I would start to try and do more at home and would try and be kind and considerate towards your wife even if you are not really 'feeling'it. If you don't have a cleaner I would get one. A cleaner might make a world of difference to your wife.

Don't worry about some of the harsher posts on this thread. Some posters love to jump on every little comment you make maybe, because you are male even though your problem is understandable.

I think I have a reasonable idea in the bedroom and have often thought that it is not down to me that she doesn't have an orgasm. She's certainly never complained.

Seriously? And you wonder why she doesn't want sex with you? It takes more than in/out in/out for a woman to have an orgasm you know. Theres a thread on this very board that you could do with reading.

Actually forget it I would imagine that you are the kind who doesn't have the patience to put in the time it takes to stimulate a woman to orgasm and would probably keep checking your watch while you were doing it.

If your little one is 9 months old then you have had sex in the past two years - unless the DC is someone else's!

However, I agree that you have a problem. Its entirely unreasonable for your DW to expect you be part of a sexless marriage, just because that appears to be what she wants. The difference between friends and lovers is that they have sex and if all she wants is a friendship then she shouldn't be married and if she refuses to even discuss it then she should realise that in the long-term it could spell the death knell for her marriage.

MN always recommends counselling and I can see how this might help you if you both go, but I really don't see what you will achieve on your own. I also disagree with saying it's early days and give it time - if your DW hasn't wanted to have sex with you once in nine months I would say that's a problem unless she had traumatic births both times. Yes, having a new baby is exhausting, and a baby plus a toddler must be really exhausting, but most people choose to make the effort, because sex is important and it helps a couple to get through the difficult times with small DC.

As for you falling on your sword, as it were, and putting up with a sexless marriage for the sake of your DC - good luck with that. Tackle this now - and insist that she is part of finding a solution with you. If she refuses, point blank, then I don't see this marriage lasting.

What juneau said. But also what Venus said.

When I went back to work fulltime and my husband started at home full-time, he was musing on his likely schedule and said 'I guess the home stuff will take an hour a day or so.'

I have never forgotten the apocalyptic fury I felt at that moment. He, I may say, was staying at home with one school-age child. I had done 5 years with a baby and preschooler. And he had absolutely zero conception of what I'd been up to all that time. Leaving entirely out the amount of time I spent looking after HIM and his emotional needs.

Rather than 'The Joy of Sex', can I suggest that you read 'What Mothers Do, Especially When It Looks Like Nothing'? and also 'Wifework'.

None of this changes the fact that I do agree that it is not OK for one partner to decree a sexless marriage, not OK for your wife not to be willing to discuss this, and I agree with Apocalypse too that there may be deeprooted issues which affect her willingness to talk about this.

I have recommended [http://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2013/dec/28/mission-to-save-marriages this article]] to a few people on here. I'm not a Christian by the way.

Like I said earlier in the thread ignore the nasty posters. Some people like to embellish OPs posts with imaginary details.

Hey, what did I say? . I certainly wasn't nasty or embellishing the OP's posts

Hi Itsfab, just to clarify, what you posted contained very definite personal attacks.

OP - you have described, nearly perfectly, the situation I felt like I was in until fairly recently (including the MN thread to match). The solution that's worked for us probably won't work for you, but the possible solutions to (both) your problems probably aren't as binary as they look right now.

Mostly agreeing with the rest of the thread.

(PM me if you like)

Your wife was pregnant while looking after a one year old, and gets little help.

No wonder why you coming in demanding "me! Me! Me!" Isn't helping. I need more, she's a rubbish wife, why can't she come to her senses, I could cheat.

You sound so bloody selfish. If you were my husband I wouldn't have sex with you either.

Start taking responsibility for some child minding, cleaning and organise regular time off for your wife. Put your business skills to work at home. Man up, you are a rubbish husband.

If she is uncomfortable with you touching her, have you considered that 9 months after giving birth again she is uncomfortable with her body. How can you support her to change that?

I agree with previous posters that with the kids so little, no sex is hardly surprising, and probably a lot more common than you think. The first thing I'd do is completely back off and let her get through the worst of the nappy stage as best she needs to.

Having said that, I do think from the delay consummating marriage and other things you've said, that she just has an extremely low sex drive and/or some kind of hangups preventing her from feeling sexual. Sometimes people like that seem to overcome their dislike or disinterest in sex enough to get a relationship off to a reasonable start, but then once things settle down and kids come along, that's their cue to put sex in the past completely, and see it as something that has done its job and can be forgotten about.

I'm skeptical that all the housework and romantic dinners in the world are likely to make a major difference to this. But I suppose once things have settled down baby-wise, there's no harm in trying.

I'd be concerned about the complete lack of orgasm though. There are some women who never orgasm, but it's rare. More likely there's too much focus on PIV and the two of you need to explore foreplay more as a thing in itself, finding where to take it for her satisfaction. Although as I said, the time for that is a way off yet.

To be fair the OP is working a 60 hour week. That is a lot of hours and it is easy to see how he might be out of tune with what's happening at home. He might get home after the kids are asleep and if his wife is BF'ing then he might not be in the habit of getting up in the night. This isn't to say he shouldn't help more but it does make it understandable.

I think a lot of couples would struggle with one partner having the lions share of looking after two little kids whilst the other works such long hours. It's hard work just finding time to do the day to day work without finding the energy into looking after your partner too.

A cleaner and/or a mothers help might make a big difference if finances allow.

I have known quite a few people, mostly men, who work long hours or work away from home.

They generally think that they are working hard and earning money for the benefit of the family.

Some of them realise, before their family breaks up, that they are constructing a family of which they are not a part. More of them realise afterwards.