Having the talk

[lavenderhoney]

I'm planning to tell my dh its all over and I want a divorce. He isn't going to be very happy about it. I've asked in the past and he has stormed off, refused and told me I'm crazy. He has no problem discussing our problems with or infront of dc age 7 and 4:( he is not a nice man and he is going to be very nasty indeed, I think.

I left almost 3 months ago ( we did live overseas, he is still there and will be for the future , and he is not from the UK) and now is the time. I should have done it before but for various reasons the solicitor said to wait ( financial). I have to talk to her this week and get things moving but I obviously have to tell dh what's coming.

I need some advice on how to handle it, what to say, and what to do with his reactions. And what to expect. I'm bricking it, frankly:(

But if you've told him the times you will answer calls, then only answer then, he has no choice really but to call then or have no contact.

Aimey, I don't understand your point with calls. He onlu calls to skype the dc once every two weeks or maybe once a week. I don't answer if they are t there or its late at night.

I don't want him to stay. He is pushing to. He has already asked the dc over skype if he can stay with them and share a room.

Do your children know you are divorcing him? You need to explain to them that as you are divorcing him, he is no longer allowed to just come and stay with you. You are the adult here and you get to decide who stays in your home. If he's asking the kids if he can stay in their rooms, you say 'that will not be happening, stop asking'. Take control and don't let him weasel away at the kids. Preempt his arguments by having some frank (age appropriate obviously) discussions with the kids about the reality of life after divorce.

In the nicest possible way, you need to start being more proactive in your own life and stop just being reactive to your ex.

Hi Lavender,

I'm just thinking how far you've come in the last year. Loosing your mum and how awful STBX was with all of that. Keeping it together for Christmas then moving yourself over here with pretty much no help. Getting settled with the DC happy in school. Developing a life for yourself that's independent of him. Surviving his visit over the summer. Worth remembering that as you face the next hurdle.

I do think pp are correct when they say you must explain to DC and STBX that he simply cannot stay in your home again. I don't remember exactly where you are with ownership / tenancy and his involvement but is there any possibility of an occupation order if he won't be reasonable (and we know he won't)?

Another age appropriate conversation with DC is definitely needed. I know you want to protect them, but you also need to be honest with them. YOU have their best interests at heart. YOU love and care for them every day and would do anything for them. YOU know how best to explain it to them and position what their father is doing in a way that allows them to have a relationship with him, but is based on the new reality of their parents being apart in every sense.

We're all rooting for you!

Stop letting him pull your strings.

TELL HIM he is not staying END OF.
TELL HIM you will only converse through a solicitor
TELL your children what is going on. They're not stupid and deserve to be told what is happening and that he can visit but cannot stay in the house.
SET TIMES for Skype. Do not answer any other time and DO NOT engage with him during the call.

Contesting the divorce - let him, and let your solicitor deal with it. That's what you are paying them to do. You can also get HIM to pay your costs - if you didn't know or your solicitor has told you otherwise.

He doesn't want to deal with your solicitor. Have you asked yourself why? He can't badger, abuse, guilt trip and manipulate your solicitor can he? That is exactly the reason for it. He'll soon get bored of it.

I know it's a difficult time for you right now, but the more you let this man manipulate and pull your strings the harder you are making this for yourself and the children.

Cut contact with him. He only needs to have contact with the kids, not you.

It's a potential repeat of the Summer holidays, isn't it? It doesn't have to be like that though.

Twinkle, I know. But this time I won't let him stay.he will moan on about the cost and how I am taking money away and he won't be able to afford presents for the dc etc etc. not to worry, he will just say everything I have done is with his money and doesn't daddy work hard for them. Like I don't have a job and pay for everything. He has been a bit lax on sending money anyway.

However he will expect to spend all his time at mine and I don't see how he will entertain the dc in a hotel room, he doesn't know the area and like summer will do nothing to look anything up etc. he will expect me to provide all the food for the dc and him, and generally watch TV and moan it's cold. Plus now he will go on and on about the settlement as well. Plus he is furious I want to divorce and won't give him another chance.
He actually complained to the lawyer about that, and says the court will think I am a total bitch for not trying again. He is deluded.

I used to send my kids off to stay with their father in a travel lodge as he had to travel long distance to see them. His access, his problem to entertain them. You probably won't want them to stay with your ex, but there is nothing to prevent him taking them out for access - you only have to make the children available. You Do Not have to facilitate this access in your own home!

Your ex is a bully, and will continue to bully you until you show him via some boundary enforcement now that you will no longer accept his bullying behaviour. Your solicitor works for you and can tell your ex all the things you are too afraid to do for yourself yet.

Definitely establish days/times that the children are available for Skype and do not accept any variations.

Do not let him say he is coming to stay with you - shut him down firmly every single time.

Use your solicitor. Get the boundaries in place. Get your ex in his place.

My point about the calls was that you said "he won't agree to calling at set times" and I was saying that you can ensure that he only succeeds in calling at the set times by only answering then.

As you say, he is deluded.

He can do all the expecting he likes, but you don't have to go along with that.

But I get that it is really hard for you, to tell him no, and I don't know how you can get the strength to do this without someone in real life to help you, for instance, by doing 3rd party hand overs when he comes. You are really influenced by what he says, you believe what he says, you feel guilty when he wants you to. You would be so much better off not hearing what he says. This business of him telling the kids stuff about you, spending his money, can't afford presents because you are causing that.... that's behaviour that you need to take to your solicitor, it's detrimental to your children's wellbeing for him to be saying things like that.

As others have said, you need to talk to your children a lot about the situation. Telling them that he will not be able to stay with you, and that it is not fair of him to ask to.

Yes, he will moan about everything, but you need to somehow not be hearing his moans. lavender, I really am rooting for you, have been since you first posted. My mother was ill this time last year and died soon after, so I resonated with some of your situation. I don't like seeing that a year on this man is still making you feel, for want of a better word, crap.

Thank you for explaining- it's just he only calls once a week at weekends for the dc and if we don't pick up because we are out he leaves it for another week. The dc don't have any expectations to hear from him at all. He has been calling this week as he wants closure on settlement. He hasn't asked about dd at all, hospital, nothing.

He only wants contact for a month once a year when he plans to take them abroad to stay with their GM, who doesn't speak English and is over 60. She wants to take care of them. This will not work. Plus, I don't see how an almost total stranger can want to care for 2 children night and day and think this is ok. He doesn't want PR and if you put a gun to his head wouldn't know what school they were at. Or the name of their doctor. Or friends, or asthma care.

He won't agree to divorcing unless it's on his terms which are insane, frankly, and I can't believe I even dated the lunatic, never mind married him. What the FUCK was I thinking:(

I have been to the doctors and he says all my results are back and im perfectly healthy in every way so it's all stress related, the issues I have. He was very kind and said to pop in whenever and see him for a chat and a rant.

I have posted in legal as well.

Your posts are still full of "he says", "he wants", "he thinks". None of this matters. The only things that matter are what YOU want, what YOU think and what YOU say.

You appear to be almost paralysed and not doing anything because of his wants and desires. You really need to get a Rottweiler solicitor (have read your other thread about how your solicitor thinks it would be nice for the children to have him around at Christmas?!?) and take charge.

You only get one shot at life, no rehearsals etc. so stop letting him fill your brain and make choices for the life you want to live.

I am paralysed with indecision and over whelmed in all aspects of my life, it's true.

I emailed DH today to arrange a regular call with the dc. He then emailed me back on a different email telling me he wanted to arrange a time to call the dc. Bizarre.

I have to pull all the numbers together and DH keeps hassling me to hurry up. It's half term, I do actually have a job and dc was in hospital last week. I asked him to give me some time.

My lawyer is ok, and most lawyers won't take on a case midway through.

I was going to ask a dozy question..

Can you be sure he would give the children back.

Of course you can't!

Lavender please run the figures by your sol first
You're entitled to a share of his pension and everything so you'd need a valuation on that to be able to put any kind of deal together

That's what the form E is for
Everyone declares their income etc and that's your starting point

Dolly, he will be the last person on my list to see it!

He is outside jurisdiction so cannot be forced to divulge his income or assets. He can say what he likes, but doesn't have to provide paperwork, or even say what he has, savings etc. I could put a stop globally on accounts I know of but that is for the super rich and is only worth it ( very high cost) if you are in that bracket. I'm not!

i don't think he will whisk off the dc.

I think he wouldn't actually WANT to have the dc full time, but I do think he'd keep them to scare you. If he managed to get them to the ME then you'd be stuffed

He's repeatedly asked for the children's passports. Then for copies of the passports (so he can report them as lost/stolen and get duplicates made up?) That suggests to me that he IS considering taking them out of the country. Please be very careful and tell your solicitor you fear he wants to remove them from the jurisdiction.

I can't believe your solicitor says it would be nice for him to spend time with them at Christmas! Didn't I read that the previous contact resulted in your son having nightmares and bedwetting? I'd be requesting any contact was supervised, at a contact centre, citing the passport requests and the disturbed behaviour from the last contact.

We've all said repeatedly to NOT let him have the passports, copies or even a slight whiff of them.

He knows the biggest way to get to you and hurt you would be to take the children away from you. Once they are out of the country you are stuffed, and if he gets them to the ME you are well and truly stuffed.

I still have serious reservations about the advice your Solicitor is giving you

I do wish there was someone else you could ask advice from

If he comes here at Christmas then yes I think seeing the children in a contact centre would be the best idea. You know they're safe then

I know he won't like it, but it's not about him

Why are you so confident that he isn't going to get passports from his own country of origin for his children..? Is there more background information here that you can't or don't want to share (absolutely fair enough, your choice)..? The information you have given suggests otherwise though.

You still seem to be acting under a belief system about what a reasonable, normal, decent, person would do in his position. Why are you doing that do you think?

Why do you think your lawyer is okay? Any SHL would consider taking on your case at this stage. What has made you think this would be so difficult?

What would have to happen for you take the initiative and protect yourself and your children? Can you describe what your personal line in the sand looks like to you?

More than one poster on this board has switched lawyer part way through. I'm still bemused by some of the advice you're getting, although I do know it's not a straightforward case and there may be details you aren't able to share here.

Please think about some of the concerns we've raised. We are on your side.

He won't get the passports. He hasn't contacted the dc for over 2 weeks. He refuses to set any times to call. He refuses to acknowledge the divorce serving or hire a sol himself. He is outside jurisdiction and the law is very complicated for the country he is in as you have to follow british guidelines wrt that along with their requirements . It costs a lot of money.

My sol is v experienced in expat divorces. Unfortunately my stbexdh is one of the most difficult and unreasonable and obstructive people they has yet to come across.

He is determined to go to court. He refuses to divorce. He is a bloody nightmare. I am very alone and im not coping. My stress and anxiety symptoms are very bad. Doctor won't give me anything. I don't want him here christmas and I have to sort this out.

I don't know if he will get any passports. He doesn't have any documents. He will use the dc to destroy me. I can't do everything- I hardly sleep and am busy alienating the few friends I have left. I put on a great show, for work, for dc, anyone I come into contact with. I miss my dm, I'm trying to cover all bases. I can't relax or get upset because I'm scared of how I will be if I do. I don't want to get out of bed. But I do. Just.

Good to hear from you lavender though I wish that things were easier for you.

If he is one of the most difficult and unreasonable and obstructive people that your sol has come across he must have been hell to be married to .... at least you don't have to be near him from day to day now!

Can you see another doctor? I know it's just another thing on the list but if you can get something to help tide you over, that has to be something. Not sleeping is a terrible draining thing that makes absolutely everything worse. Even a few good nights would help

My advice for Christmas - rent a cottage or log cabin somewhere and go there with the children.

I know you want Christmas in your own house BUT, you will not be able to relax and enjoy it fretting about whether he is about to knock your door or not.

So book something and go.

I'm glad to see you back Lavender, as I had been wondering how you were. I'm sorry to hear things are so tough at the moment. It must be very hard coming up to the time of year when you lost your mum and being reminded of that difficult time of year. I also find I get low at this time of year due to the dwindling daylight - are you making sure you get out & about/get some fresh air/daylight during the day? That might help a bit with your low mood (or at least rule out one potential contributing factor).

On the STBXH front, well, as Meerka has said thank your lucky stars you don't have to deal with him day to day. I know it is hard, but just keep going. You will get there in the end. The sole object of his obstructiveness is to wear you down and let you know (he thinks) he is in control. Don't cede that control to him. Set your own course and keep going, however tough it feels. I'm really pleased to hear you have solicitors who are experienced in managing ex-pat divorces. Be guided by them about the best course of action and keep buggering on. You will be free of him in the end.

With Christmas, decide what YOU want to do & stick with it. You do not have to host him - you are DIVORCING him, he doesn't get to decide any more. His accommodation arrangements are not your concern.

As Meerka says, try another doctor in the practice. Also look into whether you can get any counselling.

Take care. x