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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Pissed off.....lies, lap dancing and so called friends.

265 replies

Fragglewump · 10/03/2014 11:16

I thought I had an honest marriage until Friday when out for dinner with friends the wife told me that her husband didn't believe in 'paying for it' and that mine probably only did it to 'further his career'. I felt sick and was baffled but didn't tackle as I was a little drunk and totally mortified about exposing this in public. Cue the next morning when dh reveals that a year ago he went to a lap dancing club with his boss and another colleague. He went to a private room with boss and dancer for a private dance. He didn't tell me because he knew it would upset me and he wasn't proud of it. But he did tell our friend!!! I feel sick and teary. It's the lies that hurt most. Dh doesn't think he has broken our trust. I'm upset by the private dance but would find it much easier to move past than being humiliated by a friend. How can I get over this? I feel sad and pathetic. Goodbye honest marriage.

OP posts:
DonkeysDontRideBicycles · 11/03/2014 12:11

Grin @ AF.

OP, how are you today, any progress talking to your H?

AngelaDaviesHair · 11/03/2014 13:09

It's clear what I'm talking about Jan45. You are free to disagree, but why so ratty?

Jan45 · 11/03/2014 13:13

Not being ratty, still don't understand your comment.

enriquetheringbearinglizard · 11/03/2014 13:56

Fraggle I hope you can clear your head to have a full talk with your DH.
I've just read the start of your thread and then skimmed bits where the talk is about the whole lap dancing and sex worker debate.

My take is that your DH hasn't lied to you. He concealed a situation from you, believing that you would be upset and so the best he could do was to stay quiet about it after the fact. In that alone he did seem to be thinking of your best interests (other than not going I mean)
Having decided to do that, rightly or wrongly, he went on to confide in a friend who in turn disclosed it to his wife.
This remained a closed secret until the woman dropped it out to you...whether she thought you already knew or not is possibly another thing for you to think about.

You know your DH better than any of us. You also know yourself. What is it that you want? do you want him to have stood up to his boss on this night out and said No, he wouldn't be joining him at the club? do you want him to have gone to the club but not taken a private dance? or would you have been less upset if he'd gone through with it all but told you immediately afterwards?
Are you more upset about him having gone to the club/had the dance, or more upset about his friend and wife knowing and you being in the dark?

Once you're absolutely clear on exactly what's upset you and what you expect from your DH now, you can start sorting all of this out.

It's not the question, but for the record I'm anti porn, anti sex trade and so is my DH, which is fortunate for us as the most important thing is that you're both on the same page and abide by it. For my own part I would be more upset at not knowing while others did know, than with him having gone once and under the circumstances you describe.

LeadingToGadeBank · 11/03/2014 14:36

Lap dancing involves the woman rubbing herself over specific parts of the customer's body to a state of arousal. The customer isn't allowed to touch. The dancer is. It's a sexual act with clothes on. That's infidelity in my book and I'd bin my marriage over it.

Jan45 · 11/03/2014 14:40

I've been watching the programmes recently about lap dancing bars in Scotland (Strippers is the name of the prog), I never saw any dancers rub any man up to arousal, far from it, there was clearly a gap between her and the man, not one dancer touched the customer.

They didn't have clothes on either, possibly a G-string, the bra came off towards the end of the dance, each dance lasted 2 mins at a charge of £10, seems a bit OTT to leave your marriage over but each to their own.

FolkGirl · 11/03/2014 14:44

But would you be happy knowing that the next time your husband was with you he'd be thinking about the dancer and what she was doing and how she made him feel, Jan?

FolkGirl · 11/03/2014 14:44

And that he was happy to buy another human being, albeit for only 2 minutes.

Jan45 · 11/03/2014 14:47

No FolkGirl, if any man I was with did this I'd be absolutely livid, upset, disappointed, you name it and he'd have some explaining and a lot of grovelling to do but I wouldn't leave my marriage, I don't think so anyway.

You could say the same about a man who has watched porn or read a dirty mag.

Jan45 · 11/03/2014 14:48

Again FolkGirl: totally agree, it's the most distasteful thing a man can do to his woman and indeed womankind.

FolkGirl · 11/03/2014 15:00

I would say the same about a man who has watched porn or read a dirty mag.

It's why I'm increasingly thinking that I'm going to stay single!

There seem to be so many cheating, faithless bastards about, I don't really fancy my chances of finding a half decent one!

FolkGirl · 11/03/2014 15:04

And explaining and grovelling aren't going to remove the images or the memory of it.

And it isn't going to be some sort of restoratative justice to make up for treating another human being like a commodity.

That's why it would be a deal breaker for me. There's no amount of apologising that could undo it.

Jan45 · 11/03/2014 15:09

FG: I do actually agree, these men who think it's A ok to either go to a lap dancing bar, read a dirty mag or indeed watch porn are simply dirty sad gits who probably can't function in a normal healthy relationship (ie regular sex with partner).

Equally, I hate it when women come on here and justify it as if all men do this, they don't, I'm sure you will meet a decent man FG, you're hardly looking for superman, don't ever change your values and expectations, not all men are lecherus.

Jan45 · 11/03/2014 15:10

Fair enough, tbh, who knows what I would do if faced with it but we all definitely have different bars when it comes to this kind of thing.

FolkGirl · 11/03/2014 15:18

these men who think it's A ok to either go to a lap dancing bar, read a dirty mag or indeed watch porn are simply dirty sad gits who probably can't function in a normal healthy relationship

The thing is, I think that this is how it used to be, but I don't think it is necessarily the case anymore. Or there wouldn't be so many threads/women on here having had their entire lives pulled apart because they discovered the man they thought loved them was going to LDC, or watching porn in secret or messaging women online or whatever.

festered · 11/03/2014 15:26

Enrique and I share the exact same view

'Doubles' dances are normal, I know a few people have said they aren't. IME they are. ..either one girl or two girls, and two men.

I'm a dancer-I believe I'm officially classed as a sex worker. That doesn't mean I 'have sex'.

Touch policies depend on the club, but are also at the dancer's discretion in some clubs.

If it was me, I would be upset at his not telling me, upset at the way I found out, and pretty annoyed with the 'friend'. But I would talk to my DH. I wouldn't end a marriage over it. It seemed he didn't want to cause upset, and also made a mistake in confiding in somebody that wasn't trustworthy.
However he felt about it, he should have told you.

FolkGirl · 11/03/2014 15:30

I don't think his mistake was trusting confiding in someone who wasn't trustworthy, to be honest...

I think that was serendipitous for the OP, however she might feel about it at the moment.

bleedingheart · 11/03/2014 15:56

Whenever there is a thread like this I am always amazed at how many times people are told they should a certain way about this because that particular poster feels that way.

You can't really control how you feel if this happens to you. You may surprise yourself and be cool. It may crucify you.

I think its easy to say someone is jealous of the dancers rather than address the fact that it changes how you feel about the man or that not all men want to go, let alone choose to go.
I don't want to be with someone who pays another person to dance for them. It isn't empowering for anyone, except the owner of the club maybe. There's always a friend of a friend who paid off their mortgage or bought a BMW from dancing but that's not the experience of all dancers. I saw 5 minutes of Strippers with the girl sitting on the guys lap while she put her bra on and saw how very little money she was making because of her club fees etc. I honestly cannot see how it is erotic. It's faintly ridiculous to me but I guess if you want to see sex organs close up then maybe it does it for some people.

The lie would hurt the most and the humiliation from the friend but the refusal to discuss and appreciate my upset would be very hard to cope with.

Jan45 · 11/03/2014 16:03

The one I saw, she got £7 from the £10 2 min dance, rest went to the club, which was run by a woman.

One lady who was 42 had made 3 grand in one night, there's obviously places where you can make seriously good money, equally I'm sure there are dives where you make a pittance.

It's hardly sex organs close up, she's not spreading her legs and letting him look up there, not for £7 I'm sure!

I can see how it is erotic, I know of couples who have been, each to their own again, but yes, completely different story if your partner does it against your own beliefs and your belief in him.

bleedingheart · 11/03/2014 16:12

I guess I don't see how erotic it is because someone is paying for it.

Someone has a disinterested look on their face and is writhing around because you have paid them to, not because they are genuinely turned on by you or thrilled to be with you. It just seems so cold and empty to me.
Unless you get off on 'owning' someone for 2 minutes, I suppose.

FolkGirl · 11/03/2014 16:14

Well it might not seem erotic to you, bleeding, but it's clearly erotic to the men who do it, otherwise they wouldn't do it.

Just because some women can justify it as not erotic doesn't that's how the men see it.

FolkGirl · 11/03/2014 16:14

doesn't mean that's how the men see it.

FolkGirl · 11/03/2014 16:16

I don't think they get off on owning someone for 2 minutes, I think they get off on seeing and smelling a naked woman up close to them and the promise of what could happen, with being that close, if only they weren't clothed, and the touch they desire but that is forbidden...

That all sounds quite erotically charged to me actually.

FolkGirl · 11/03/2014 16:21

I think some women assume that men will experience it in the same way that they would. When I don't think they do. I wouldn't find it erotic, but then I'm not the target audience...

Jan45 · 11/03/2014 16:25

Bleeding, yes can see where you are coming from, it's all fake isn't it.

But, as FG says, for the men it's a completely different perspective.

I dunno how I would find it, possibly slightly erotic, depending if she was convincing enough but I'd still be thinking, wtaf am I doing here!