Does this man sound abusive. I say no - my friends think YES!

[LovelyVerity]

OK, I'm asking for a friend (no really I am). My 3 best girlfriends and I have known each other for the best part of two decades - we all lived together at uni. One of us has been single for over a decade - didn't want her kids to get "uncles" - fair enough. So at Christmas she announced she was going to do "dating for fun" now youngest is at Boarding school - then 2 weeks later she met this bloke she now describes as The Real Deal. Last weekend he proposed!

I like him - I would say yes. Our other two friends think she is vulnerable and he is controlling and scary. One of them goes so far to say he will probably end up hitting her. Here's why they think that:

1. When they first met, he refused to have sex for 4 months, because he doesn't 'do' casual sex - they say weird and controlling for a bloke - I say fair enough.
2. He has professional qualifications in massage/hoslitic therapies (not sleazy) and likes to massage my friend - usually moving onto sex. I say WOO HOO - they say he likes his women passive and inert.
3. He enjoys masturbating her to orgasm.. apparently this makes him controlling and domineering.. I could live with that ;-)
4. He told her he'd like to take her somewhere special for her birthday - and then turned up on her doorstep that morning and told her they were going to Le Meurice, Paris for dinner - which meant she had to cancel brunch with us on the Sunday (which we do often anyway), as they obv stayed over night... they say... well - you get the picture.. I think it was maybe a tad presumptuous but FFS... it's new love... and it was LE MEURICE!!!
5. He says he wants to get married and try for a baby ASAP. My friends think this is pushy and pressurising and close to emotional blackmail. Friend had thought her baby days were done - but he has no children. I sort of admire him for being so up front.

What do you think? I should add, he's charming, educated, funny and solvent, and he gets on great with her children (now 18 and 15). I would say yes, but are my friends really seeing danger signs that I just can't see?

I got married to a man I had known for 10 months who wanted a baby ASAP and who whisked me away (I jokingly say kidnapped) for a weekend.

He is wonderful. It's been 4 years

How can someone who has "professional qualifications in holistic therapies" (ha!) afford to whisk someone he's only just started shagging to Paris?

Woo sure does pay...

Agree that 1 and 5 sound controlling and manipulative. and that he is Brian from Hull

Poor bloke can't win.

He sounds fine to me. He's told her about his wants for a family. If she's happy with that, then what's the problem?

So he didn't pressure her into sex. Didn't expect a shag on the first night. Was a gentlemen and waited, and this is wrong? On what planet? Isn't this what people used to do years ago. Wait a while rather than fuck in the first week?

He wants to make sure she is pleasured and that is a problem. No, the problem are the selfish arseholes that are posted about on here. Maybe the other two have selfish arseholes at home who only think about their own needs.. The only problem thought I would have is if it was always the same routine, because that would get dull very quick. Maybe he is a bit quick, iyswim, and likes to compensate for this, so the sensous massages and mastrubating her to cum. But again, maybe he just likes to pleasure his partner... These people do exist without alterior motives.

Well he did tell her he wanted to take her somewhere special and he did just that. Did he actually know about the arrangements you all had? Did he know they were set in stone?

How is letting someone know that you want to get married and have a child emotional blackmail?

How the fuck is 1 controlling?? He wanted to be sure he really liked her before having sex.

I was engaged with 8 months so I don't see them talking about marrying and having a baby after 10 months is much of a problem really.

The one which is slightly worrying is 5 and I wouldn't marry someone after knowing them for 10 months but that's just me.

The question I'd ask about the Paris gig is: does he do this kind of thing often i.e. expecting her to cancel everything for him. If the answer's yes, then I can see where they're coming from but if this kind of thing is a one off then it's jealousy talking.

I don't think waiting to have sex with someone is either weird or controlling. It's lovely in fact and tarring all men with the same brush regarding wanting them to get inside a woman's knickers on the first date is sexist and unfair. My OH wasn't like that and neither are quite a few men.

He can masturbate me to orgasm any time if we can go to Paris and Le Meurice for MY birthday!

Of course, we don't know the full story here but there sounds a lot of jealousy.

Is it just me or does everyone share the level of intimate detail about their relaionhipwith their mates ?

You lot are a cynical bunch.
Your friends sound like they are unhappy with the changes to the status quo.

1- do you know anything about his past? Maybe he's been hurt by rushing into a relationship. Woman can behave badly too. Waiting to consummate a relationship is not a bad thing.
4 - sounds lovely!t was a one off. It was her birthday!
5- sounds like he is being honest with her. Has she actually said she doesn't want another child now she has a partner? Does she feel pressurised? Is it marry me and give me a baby now or I'll never see you again?

I presume he is not a masseuse in his day job. You can have qualifications that are not directly linked to your career. I know several people with massage qualifications that do other jobs.

OP, even if you come to agree with your other friends be very wary of saying any of this to her. She will not agree with you and it will cause a rift that can not be mended.

Good God some of you see 'Red Flags' everytime you open your eyes - do you live at the beach or something?

He sounds lovely - on the surface. Clearly we haven't met him though & you and your friends have. 2 v 2. 2 of you are wrong - which 2?

Has she cancelled meeting up with you loads?

Do you still see her as much as you would expect to (given she's just met someone new & we all have busy lives)?

Has she changed the way she dresses/speaks/drinks/anything else?

There's nothing about points 1-5 that swing it one way or another.

However it's all about context. If he's an abusive weirdo then any of them could become creepy, if he's not then none of them are. Perhaps it's not because of these points that your friends suspect him, but because of gut feeling & other details you haven't mentioned?

onthebottom twat radar

OK, 1 sounds controlling to me because of the wording 'he refused to have sex' - yet he still wanted an (adult, sexual) relationship with her. To me that sounds odd - if you meet someone who you want to give pleasure to, have babies with, whisk off to Paris - why wouldn't you want to have sex with them unless it's related to control?

But then, maybe that's me... agree with what Twinkelstein said - there must be some missing information.

As an adult, being in love and not having sex for 4 months sounds odd

I don't believe that you are not posting about yourself, sorry

When you say he wanted to wait for sex do you mean no sexual contact at all or just penetrative sex?

FFS - maybe he didn't want to have sex until he was sure that he wanted to give pleasure to her, have babies with her and whisk her off to Paris.

Maybe sex for him is a really big deal that he only does with someone he thinks he can truly commit to.

Maybe he had the clap and needed to get rid of it before shagging her?

Sorry, I'll get me coat.

OK, I'm going to be piled on here but while reading this thread I had a sudden thought based on reading other Relationship threads here as well as newspapers / magazines.

This is just speculation but some of the behaviours seem familiar to those of a financial hustler - the slow but creeping build to 'trust', the seeming profligacy / lavishing of treats and reference to his 'solvency' (seems odd), the sudden pressure to make the relationship a financially dependent one. I'm guessing having raised 2 teenage kids alone and being able to pay boarding fees makes your friend pretty financially independent.

Like I say, I am probably wrong though.

basil gets coat and comes with.

She hasn't been with him long enough to think about babies and marriage, but otherwise he sounds amazing!?

Some men really, really get off on seeing their partner get off. (They are great men to sleep with)

And in terms of spontaneous travel you don't know the backstory, he may have planned it for ages and told her last minute because he wanted to surprise her and why the hell not?

And controlling and caring are two entirely different things and ne'er the twain shall meet. He sounds considerate.

Not having sex for four months though, sounds like he either has some very deep seated beliefs about sex being spiritual (which can be dull long term) or he was still shagging someone else or waiting for the all clear from the clap clinic

< wraps scarf round neck and joins basil and cjel >

I'm guessing as she has kids who are 18 and 15 minimum late 30's so perhaps, if he's the same age, he just thinks "let's do it!".

I don't think 10 months is that short a time to know you love someone.
Has he/she told each other they love each other yet? I'd be worried if he was talking marriage/babies without mentioning love.

The massage thing sounds divine to me though....perhaps her friends are jealous or cautious due to their own relationships and are putting their emotions onto your friend?

You're a long time dead - I think she should go for it.

What does he do for a living is my first question. And, how old is he?

She is clearly well off with dc at boarding school. Is he a cock lodger?

A pre nup is in order to protect the dc, so he gets nada whatever happens, even if they live happily ever after. Then she/ you will see the real him.

4 months! Unlikely, but maybe. My bf before dh took me to Paris for our first night:) and I think it was a month before we went.

He's not for me but yeah sounds nice.