Is this normal or insensitive. Sex?

[Workwhatwork]

I'm having a really shitty time right now with various things that are going on so I'm feeling quite low anyway.

Last night I was in bed with my boyfriend and I started trying it on with him. I was sort of cuddled up to his back and I started stroking his hair and back and kissing his back a bit, then touching him down there. I was running my hands up and down and then when I wernt to touch him down there again he blocked me with his arm so I took that to mean he didn't want sex and turn over to go to sleep.

He turned to me and said I was teasing him and started touching me down there. I wanted to have sex but I couldn't get wet and him touching me was hurting.

The thing is and I don't know whether it's just me, sorry for tmi, but I seem to be able to get wet more at certain times of the months, so just after my period I can't always get wet but just before I do. Sometimes my boyfriend hurts me when touching me, if he's trying to put his finger in me he will often miss by an inch or so and try to force it into the completely wrong place, he also uses spit as lube even though we have proper lube and I don't like it. Because of all this I think I've got quite jumpy especially when I'm not wet because I'm expecting for him to hurt me.

After a while of me not getting wet he started to go in a mood saying I was teasing him and obviously didn't want it as I'm not wet. I try to explain that just because I can't get wet doesn't mean I don't want to, and that sometimes it isn't just a case of sticking his hand down there for a fiddle and expecting me to have multiple orgasms, sometimes it is but sometimes I need a bit more foreplay.

It escalated into a row and he started doing over the top impressions of me jumping and saying "ooo, ooo, ahh, ahh" like a monkey as though that's what I was doing. I was a bit jumpy but it's because it was hurting and I was expecting him to try to shove his finger in where I have a wee like he often does. But apparently this is all my fault as he isn't doing anything different.

The other massve thing is, in the past, (we have been together 5 years), I have found out he has gone behind my back.

I've found out he's been on dating sites talking to other women. He says that this was when we had split up so almost doesn't matter. We were both on Facebook and he was chatting and flirting with women from chatrooms and stuff on there. He had a few younger women on there and when I asked who they were he said that they were girls from school who were a few years below him. He sort of joked that they would never look twice at him as they're too good looking (how's that supposed to make me feel) and that he'd only added them to make him look good. I also found out he had fake email addresses to use on dating sites. This was an ongoing thing over about 2 years and there were at least 10 different women I found him chatting and flirting with all from chatrooms or dating sites. I even caught him chatting with one the night after his grans funeral.

These are the things I found out, I of course don't know what else may have happened. But that I'm aware of nothing has happened since, he's no longer on Facebook and neither am I and he no longer has a computer or laptop aside from the one we share.

But last weekend I was looking through the photos on his phone. I never look at his phone so goes to show, but I was looking for some old photos of a concert we went to. And I came across a photo of a pair of boobs. No face just a top pulled up flashing the boobs, the photo was in downloads so I can only thing it was a picture message he'd been sent.

Of course I felt sick, asked him who it was. The story he gave was that he couldn't even remember her name, it was some woman from a dating site years ago and he didn't even realise it was still in the phone. But he tried to make out it wasn't a picture message but had been synced from his old laptop.

I told him to get out, it was over. But he wouldn't go, he seems to think that because it was all part of the things he was up to in the past and I'm supposed to have forgiven him, that I should just forget about it now.

But of course I can't, I don't trust him at all.

Then we went to a family party at the weekend. There was another woman on our table, a family friend. I started to feel as though he was making a particular point to speak to her. He rarely strikes up conversation with anyone and usually sits messing around with his phone but he kept making jokes to her, telling me to look at her phone case isn't it nice. Then I remember that she sent him a Christmas card last year and my name wasn't on it even though everyone elses were sent as couples.

This is how I've ended up as a result of what he's done in the past. Even if nothing is going on I feel as though he tries to get attention from young women to get an ego boost.

Sorry it's so long I just don't know what to think anymore.

YY, Yoni, if he was interested in 'consequences', he'd have learned from OP's efforts. You can't change a sadistic sociopath.

Russetbella, have you heard of the boiled frog analogy? If you wanted to cook a live frog, you couldn't just chuck it in a pan of boiling water, because it would jump straight out, double-quick. But if you place your frog in a pan of cool water, he'll be happy to sit there. Then, ever so gently, turn on the heat. The frog will acclimatise to the warmer water - he'll carry on sitting there, his body temperature will adjust, he won't even notice he's getting hot. Until it's too late.

That's how abuse works.
Yelling "Watch out, Froggy!" doesn't make sense to him, he's acclimatised.
Yelling "Turn off the heat, you bastard!" doesn't work, either, because the cook knows what he's doing.

Oh I know!!

...I wish somebody could leap up & grab a saucepan and whack the cook around the head. But of course that wouldn't work either because the only ones who can make the decisions are the cook & the frog!

I do hope I sound like I m on OPs side but I also know that whatever chat happens on the boards sadly OP is the one who can change things. AND THAT'S NOT TO BLAME HER as someone earlier thought I was implying. It's to recognise that this is an abuse of power... And for things to change, well things have to change. If everyone acts the same as they always have then nothing will change.

Oh god it must be late- just read that again and I can see how people might think I'm blaming OP ARGGGHH!!!!
For example 'OP is only one who can change things' I MEAN BECAUSE SHE'S THE ONE LIVIBG WITH THIS IN RL....

Ok I m going to bed before any more damage...

:) YY, your intention did show through. Sleep well!

I thought the hurting you sexually and then making monkey noises taking the mick out of your pain was the worst thing i had read, then i see he has upset you and FILMED you crying?! Get out OP. This is an abuser, there is no doubt about that from his actions.

I think we can all feel frustrated when we read about women 'putting up with' the most awful, abusive, foul men and excusing and minimising it. But instead of getting wound up with women for enabling men to act like total dicks we should be looking at the wider picture - societal structures, gender roles, internalised messages from childhood and get angry about the situation that leads so many women to accept shitty behaviour as normal and to fear being without a relationship. That's why we still need feminism.

Sorry to hijack OP, just another voice saying how awful this is and advising not to fall for the sweet behaviour he's hoovering

I know what you meant russet :) just wanted to put another point of view forward. Only OP can change her situation, that is correct. Much as we all want to we can't go and leave for her.

God dam it!!!! With everything you've written you need to get the hell out ASAP!

However I totally sympathise with the sex issues, my dp also manages to find my wee hole every single nodding time! He also manages to cut/tear something.down there everytime too! It kills, totally understand! I told dp to stop doing it 3 months ago, we havnt had sex since (more reasons than that though)

Please leave this ass, I'm completely hypocritical here because I'm still living with mine but you actually have a way out! Please take it. Send him back to his own house.

[Thanks]

Ment to be at the end for you haha!

Indeed the OP can and should change her situation when she is ready.

But the point is, that it does not matter how long someone stays or how often they 'put up' with abuse, it never becomes something they agreed too, participated in willingly or in anyway their fault. otherwise there is a danger of the survivors thinking they have made their bed and must lie in it.

Feeling judged by others for having been in such a situation in the first place is often the reason why people don't reach out for rl support and so find it harder to leave.

It does not matter if it is the first, the fifth, or the five hundredth time that the abuser has hit/assaulted/verbally abused/emotionally tormented the survivor at no point has the survivors still being there made it not abuse or anything other than the abusers fault.

If the survivor has to leave once, twice, twenty times that is ok. every time we hope this is the time, this time it is for good. we must not give up on them or they may give up on themselves.

too often i hear people say well I cannot tell my family/friends I have left him before. they are bored of hearing it. They probably aren't they are just terrified you will have to go through more it.

It is hard to leave. it takes time.and the abuser will often do their best to change the survivors mind. it is confusing and heart breaking and difficult. but i do really believe that the backing of places like MN make it easier for people to get an outside perspective (without feeling any shame- even though the only person who should be ashamed if the abuser) to see that this really is abuse and to be there for them through the experience of extricating themselves from the situation. MN shines a light on the abuse and offers a hand up.

As someone said on another thread- leaving an abusive relationship is not an event it is a process.

OP MN is here for you during that process. I really do hope in your case it is quick and as easy as possible. you can end this. you absolutely have the right to end this no matter that he may disagree. it is your life and he has no right to try to make you live it by his rules.

Everything that everyone else said. This was my ex, I spent eight years being brainwashed that I was over sensitive, I was frigid because I didn't appreciate his style of lovemaking etc. Reader, I left him - after he bit me and when I objected, I was unreasonable.

Then, I had to call the police because he was threatening my friends and threatened to burn my house down at night. It brought all the other stuff home when I did the DV questionnaire with the police and was answering yes, yes, yes. All warning flags for a total psychopath. Don't put up with this shit, it's not necessary.

Mrs Mink, that was an excellent post, so much more eloquent than I could've managed. OP, I hope you take heed of what Mrs Mink is saying because she's got it spot on: none of this is your fault, no matter how long it's gone on, and it's not your fault if you don't have the strength to leave right now, but I hope you do. MN is here for you.

i third MrsMinkBernardLundy's post. so well put.

OP my post was mostly a general response to the post thread about women who stay.

In your case you sound resolute. i believe you can do this (on Monday) and I don't want to overplay the difficulty so that you become dispirited. you can do this and MN is here to support you. and I hope he will go easily and you can get on with a happy life.

But and I hope you do succeed, if at first you don't succeed. try again.don't beat yourself up. try again. and don't hide away (from MN or RL support) try again. if you are tempted to take him back. try again.

Think of an abuser as like an unflushable turd. keep flushing. they will go

But I really hope for you, the first time will be the last time.
Good luck Godspeed and remember we are here to help. now and afterwards.

All great messages-thanks Yoni & Garlicbaguette too for getting me .

Hope these are giving the OP strength to make the right decisions for her...All the best

i've read this and another post about staying with someone abusive.

I was with an emotionally abusive man for about 2 years when I was 29. we both didn't want to break up as we were near 30 and thought we should be settled down. This was with a man who although he never hit me he emotionally belittled me and said things like "if you break up with me I'll come round to your house/work and not leave you alone" etc.

I can't believe OP has been with this peach for 5 years. All I can say from my experience and my brother's (with ex wife for many years, evil woman) that you put up with and deny a lot of stuff. But the OP has seen it in black and white here. She knows she has her own place and he has his. TBH from her posts re another ex-SO it looks like she is sort of used to being treated badly. I hope OP can get out.

I'm just catching up on replies. Thank you for the offers of support I will be ok.

I just get so frustrated because This situation is worse than the OP realises it is. I have posted myself on relationship threads before and you get a load of replies about how awful your DP is and how disrespectful...etc and you think 'we'll I haven't told the full story and they don't know him and I've probably painted the situation in an overly bad light.' But actually, as time goes on and you look back, the responses were pretty accurate. I fear that the OP is thinking: 'yes. Given the picture I've painted, of course they are saying leave, but they weren't there and they don't know him and I did provoke him and he did try to apologise' so isn't completely listening. That's just how I feel and I want to do something to help!

I was reading this, although I know it's daft, this is a little how I feel. Like people are only going to see the bad, when there is good too.

However I was also reading this thread about the type of abuser 'The water torturer', which was linked on another recent thread on here I have the Lundy Bancroft book but have not read it however after seeing that I felt compelled to loook in my book and I feel as thought the description fits my boyfriend perfectly.

But then I think I am just reading into something that's not there. It's as though he constantly does things that when I tell to other people or such as on here. They are horrified, but when it's just the two of us I end up being the irrational one. It's so difficult to explain, but I'm more likely to yell or cry, and he tells me constantly how reasonable he is, and how he understands that I'm emotional. this is after I've just found a picture of another womans books on his phone. Yet he's the reasonable one. Even what happened on Friday night was my fault. He had logic behind throwing the airer. Even filming me crying was because I'd been so horrible in bringing up the other stuff.

But looking at the description of the water torturer, it does accurately desribe our relationship, if I was to explain things that have happened in the past.

I haven't told him it's over. It seemed impossible, he was so nice for the rest of the weekend. Well no, he was very nice on Saturday. Sunday he was mostly distant and grumpy until the evening then nice again, but nothing unusual.

He did also do something else last night which I'd have usually taken no notice of, but because of this thread I wondered whether it was more disgusting.

Every night I have my routine of brushing my teeth and if I don't have a bath I wash in the sink. Most nights my boyfriend follows me into the bathroom and hangs around waiting to brush his teeth, a couple of things, I don't like him standing around while I'm having a wee, I just want to wee in peace, he also has a habit of using my toothbrush which I don't like but he won't bring his own over. I then gave him a new head (electric toothbrush) so that he is just using the base but his own brush. This now seems to have got lost so he is back to using mine. He also has a habit of sitting behind me on the bath and grabbing my bum even standing behind me and dry humping me while I'm brushing my teeth. It irritates me and I've asked him to give me my 5 minutes to get washed/use the toilet.

Last night I was doing my teeth and he decided to sit on the toilet right next to the sink and try for a poo. I find this disgusting, I'm brushing my teeth and I smell the gross poo smell, he thought it was hilarious, I don't want him to poo in front of me, wee I can handle but not poo. I told him to get out of the bathroom and leave me in peace. He said he wasn't having poo just a wee and farting. I feel really horrible saying it all but I just find it all gross. I know we've been together a long time and everyone has to fart/use the toilet. I'm not one of these who leaves the room to fart or won't poo with anyone in the house. But just basic manners when someones brushing their teeth, pooing alone with the door closed? Is that too much to ask?

What worries me a lot is that even after Friday night and him sitting there laughing at me filming crying, which he denies by the way he said he was just pretending to film me. After him threatening me with a clothes horse. I'm not as horrified as I clearly should be. I'm not even that angry, I'm tired of feeling angry so perhaps I am suppressing it, I don't feel an urgent need to get him out of my life. I should, I know I should but I feel too tired to even end it

You don't need to tell him that it's over you just need to pack his stuff up and change the locks.

That's sounds like a vile weekend not him being nice.

I was going to end it Friday night and Saturday morning I was definitely going to end it, but my anger has just gone.

I think I know that he is emotionally abusing me, I think that he has been for years, there's more to it than I've said here. But I think the problem that I've got no is I feel hopeless.

I've got no motivation to end it, people talk about a happier life and meeting someone who is not abusive, but I don't see it.

I might have started to get quite depressed and don't really see a way out. Not because it's practically difficult, but because the same old is easier than facing up to reality.

Can anyone understand that?

No your instinct is right, that is disgusting and disrespectful. Weeing, people have different preferences/rules about it, but pooing in the same room as somebody else trying to brush their teeth/shave/have a bath etc is horrible.

My ex used to do the exact same thing right down to a T though! If you hadn't been together so long I would suspect he was the same bloke!

You don't feel horrified because he has trickled this into being so gradually that you are probably unable to feel shocked by it, because it's only slightly worse than the last level which you've come to see as normal. (It's also how he justifies it to himself - he probably isn't aware that he's getting worse, it's just that as each new "thing" becomes more normal he has to do something more shocking to "make you see".) The problem is that even if it were to escalate (ie, he was to hit you) you will probably carry on feeling that it is no big deal. There is no clear line between emotional, verbal and physical abuse and sadly for every woman who says "I would leave if he ever hit me" they hardly ever do :(

Sometimes you have to fake it until you make it, or split up with him over the disgusting poo habits or being bad in bed instead if you can't bring yourself to break up with him over this incident. It really doesn't matter - as long as you don't have to deal with him any more.

I know with my ex I never managed to split up with him after any argument or incident which frightened me - it's sort of like when it happens they manage to twist it around so you don't feel justified in leaving, and then afterwards when you realise how bad it was and vaguely consider it, it doesn't actually happen because by the time you get to the point you can act your brain has gone back to trying to rationalise/normalise it and also you think "Well it will look stupid to go now, I should have gone at the time, it was days ago" (and this increases the longer it is) - the resolve to leave weakens and weakens. In the end I didn't leave over XP's violent outbursts or his drinking or the time he drove around for hours in the dark and terrified me, it was one time when I was ill and he moaned about having to look after his own son while I was puking. Sometimes it's just easier to pick something smaller, the straw that breaks the camel's back, rather than it having to be tied to some big dramatic emotional event.

Tbh no,I have too much self respect to let a man shit in front of me when I've asked him not to and pick his bum in my bath, film me crying and make fun of me.

I have been in an abusive relationship and I got out pretty damn fast as I had no ties to him, no kids.

What do you like about him? Why do you not think you are worth more than this?

You ARE worth more then this, you ARE worth more than this, you ARE worth more than this

No, I don't understand this. You sound miserable, bullied, assaulted, injured, unhappy and without hope and excitement for the future. And all you have to do is lock him out of the house and text him it's over.

Yes. Better the devil you know, the unknown is scary etc. But please, please push through that - being alone is not scary, think about him going away for the weekend, isn't that a relief? Not having to deal with his horrible stuff, not being bugged for sex etc? You could have that all the time. It's so much easier as you don't have children, too - you could totally start again.

I think you are just scared.