Dh keeps doing something I don't like in bed

[Moochicken]

Without wanting to go into too much detail, dh keeps doing something during sex which I don't like. I ask him not to and after a few minutes he does it anyway.

It doesn't happen every time but he did it again last night. He apologized after and said he won't do it again (he says this everytime) and now he can't understand why I'm still pissed off.

How seriously would you take this? If I said no and stopped sex he would listen and would never force me to do something but I still feel uncomfortable that he basically ignores my wishes.

*we

Who? Her DH?

I'm talking about the posters on this thread.

Do people really think that page after page of increasing hysteria was helpful to the OP?

I get the need to express your own issues and experiences, I really do, but under the guise of showing some one else 'the light' isn't, given how this thread went, always the most useful approach.

It's not the message, but the scale and force of it that makes people feel like they're in the wrong place.

christina that's because it is assault.

If someone took money from my purse without my consent, no matter what the POV or broader context, that would be theft.

You don't need to have a different POV or a broader context. It is assault

we crossed as I explained my typo christine

Perhaps the scale and force of it unfortunately shows just how many of us have also suffered coercion/forced sex/assault/rape. It tends to reignite one's outrage, hearing of someone else's experience.

What would you have us tell her Christina?

Just out of interest.

There's been many problems on this thread, but I feel that not colluding with someone in denying they are being sexually assaulted when that denial will just lead to continued sexual assault is not one of them.

christina, the most vocal posts were people arguing amongst themselves and denigrating her abusive husband

there was no vitriol for the OP herself

The point that OP made several times was that she came on for advice, not to be told that her subjective viewpoint was wrong.

That's not helpful to anyone.

I understand that nuance is hard on a public forum, especially when a thread is moving quickly, but OP said quite clearly that the quantity and force of the responses weren't helping her, then people carried on and she left.

her subjective viewpoint is wrong

I will not collude with that

and she asked how serious she should be taking what her husband is doing to her on a regular basis

do you think she should be taking it less seriously ?

That's exactly it. OP didn't need to be told anything in such heightened language. Perhaps a bit more time actually letting her express herself might have helped her clarify her own thoughts?

I disagree. Her subjective viewpoint is hers and hers alone to explore and consider. Telling someone their point of view is just wrong is a horribly invalidating thing to do.

We're just saying it the wrong way, we have to say it so that he knows we mean it.

I'm thinking that emphasizing it with a very sharp kick in the testicles ought to do it.

Anyway, off to bed now, so argue amongst yourself, but a shame that OP had to leave a post about not being listened to because, eh, she wasn't being listened to.

are you equally criticising every poster on this thread then, christina, because both sides of the argument have been equally vehement in their position and just as culpable in derailing the thread

or are you just attempting to pull up the ones who believe that she has been sexually assaulted by her husband ?

I agree any fucker.

dh keeps doing something during sex which I don't like. I ask him not to and after a few minutes he does it anyway.

He apologized after and said he won't do it again (he says this everytime) and now he can't understand why I'm still pissed off.

In what way does it not fit? What bit is different or missing? Facts don't alter just because another person wants them to. And while her husband may actually just not really understand the seriousness of what he's doing, because we have, as several comments indicate, a culture that almost permits men to do this to women they've had a sexual relationship with, the reality is plain: his actions are squarely and clearly under the definition of the crime. If she reported and he confirmed, he'd be a slam dunk case. So how, if an honest admission of what he's been doing would earn him a conviction, can it not be assault? Do you think a crime is dependent on the victim's opinion rather than the definition? Seriously? Because it would be horribly disturbing if it worked the other way.

I'm genuinely baffled that people can read that, and then read the very clear and simple definition of the crime (inserting anything into another's anus, without a reasonable belief that they are consenting to that insertion) and argue that it doesn't fit this situation, and his doing precisely what the statute describes doesn't matter for X Y or Z reason. Crimes aren't interpreted like that. They aren't that flexible. Certainty is pretty important, when dealing with people's liberty and future life chances.

The OP doesn't see what he is doing as assault. Probably, nor does he. But the definition is a legal and not a personal one. It doesn't alter with their opinions. It's a set of circumstances which fits this situation exactly, precisely, completely. That isn't something you can just hand-wave away, because it isn't down to the individual to decide if they personally feel in their waters whether something is criminal. It's down to the statute. The point is that she has no intention of making a complaint, but that doesn't stop the action itself being criminal. It just... is.

Even the one you did point out has the words "during sex" in brackets which kind of makes your comparison you draw ridiculous.

It doesn't matter if it is during sex or not.
Unwanted grabbing, poking and penetration is still not on.

The point was that anything done out of the ordinary should require previous consent, not doing whatever and the person having to say no.

Say, even touching breasts, should be done slowly enough for the woman to be able to say no before it happens or allow it or encourage it.
The same goes for a blow job. There is a leading up to it and the man can choose to stop it well before it reaches the actual bj stage.

Can't argue with that.

I meant perfectstorm's post...

I can't believe how we seem to have to explain on here what is acceptable behaviour.

Do people really not know this?

Shocking.

Christina whether the OP wants to make this a big deal is absolutely her choice. Nobody is telling her she must take this to the police, and I've read very few even telling her to LTB. It is her life and she should, absolutely, have total autonomy and control over it. But MN is widely read. Sorry, but I think it's rather important not to minimise, act the apologist or dismiss it when a clear case of a sexual crime is being described. Because someone else might read this who is actually wondering how reasonable they are to feel like this stuff matters. The answer is: it does. It matters. It is not okay.

A friend stayed last week who works in the US for a pro-choice organisation, and she often gives talks to young college women about the importance of sharing stories, and how abortion being a secret allows assaults on choice. The example she gives is how she was at a party when she first went to uni, and a guy she actually planned to hook up with started getting nasty and aggressive, and so she changed her mind and tried to stop it and leave. And he wouldn't let her. And she realised that the only way to get out of there was to be "that girl", shrieking and yelling RAPE and causing a huge drama in which her having willingly gone into his room would be held against her and meant she became a pariah, or to just let him do it so she could go. A couple of weeks later she still felt terrible and was talking it over with a friend, and saying she felt awful and couldn't work out why she wasn't over it yet, and her friend said diffidently, "You know, it sounds kind of like you were... raped." Until that moment, she'd never thought of it as rape. She'd originally intended to get together with him, she chose not to create a huge scene when he refused to stop, and so on. And now, over a decade later, whenever she tells that story at an event, afterwards at least one girl and probably several will approach her and say it happened to them. Recently, one was sobbing as she'd never named it to herself before, either.

Naming this stuff for what it is matters. Voicing the reality of what most sexual abuse is matters. And IMO several of the comments below indicate precisely why.

My exH wasn't that respectful either.

It really wore me out to keep saying no to unwanted advances and grabbing, and trying to pressure me into doing things I didn't want to.

It can be a grey area, and that is why these topics tend to lead into discussions, which can be off putting for the OPs.

But, Moochicken, you should take it very seriously.
I'm sure you are able to deal with this, but remember that we often feel that we can deal with such things and only end up being dragged down further and further, because abusers don't take a no for an answer.

I haven't told OP what she should do, not even a teensy ikkle LTB. I have argued with other posters who are telling her that she should suck up being sexually assaulted by her husband and pointed out that even if she thinks she hasn't, she actually has.

It is interesting how some threads go.

There have been a few cases where the OP is being abused, initially refuses to acknowledge it, but digging deeper down it's even worse than it sounded initially.

There have been other cases where posters say it's normal, because it happens to them, only to realise that they are being abused as well.

Sometimes people need a shock to re-evaluate what they are going through.

I agree with other pp that just because the person living it doesn't see it as abuse/rape it doesn't mean that it isn't just that.