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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Is this worth pursuing?

222 replies

maryclarey · 29/07/2013 00:18

I'm sorry - this is long. I'll try to be succinct. I just need some perspective.

A few months ago I started seeing someone having just ended a long term relationship. We both agreed it was casual at the beginning, meeting just for sex. I would go to his place (I was staying on a friends sofa bed at the time) and go home that night. He didn't want a relationship and neither did I. That was fine, for a while. I started to have some feelings but I kept them in check as I didn't want to get too close.

Things started to change a little, in that I started staying overnight at his invitation and we would spend time talking about our lives rather than just having sex.

Around the time I moved into my own place I decided to take a risk and ask him on a real date. He said he was comfortable with that but jokingly said he might freak out if I asked him to move in or something. I said he didn't need to worry about that at this point (for goodness sake!). We were both nervous on the date but it was lovely.

A few dates and weeks later he turned up at my place late one night telling me how much he liked being with me and how he hadn't slept with anyone else since we met. I didn't really respond much because he was a bit drunk at the time and I was a bit caught off guard and didn't know how to take it. However we kept seeing each other, having a really good time and started alternating staying at his place and mine, going on proper dates and not always having sex, just being quietly comfortable in each others company. We didn't talk about that night again.

I've met his brother who he lives with, and he's met my best friends who I live with. We have socialised with both. We haven't met any other of our groups of friends. He has told his work mates about me and I have told mine about him (our companies are linked). He's agreed to come to a work function with me, no hesitation.

We now spend practically every weekend together, it's grown to three nights a week if we are both in town. He takes me to nice places and seems proud to be seen with me. I feel the same way.

I started to feel I needed to know if we were heading somewhere. Unfortunately I decided to raise this at 4am when we had both been out drinking. I thought I asked him if he saw me as a potential girlfriend when or if that time came, he thought I was asking if he saw me as his girlfriend right now. He said no. He said he is enjoying what we have and how we are getting to know each other now and he wants to see where things go. He got quite upset, talking about how when he moves in with someone it'll be the person he wants to marry. I asked who had even mentioned moving in? He really jumped the gun but as I say, we had been drinking. Next morning we talked a little more. I cleared up the misunderstanding about my question the night before but made it clear I don't want to get hurt again, waiting around for something that might never happen (as in my last relationship). He said he understood but he wants to take things slow, by which I took to mean he felt I was rushing him. He had to leave for work then, he was concerned I was still a bit upset, gave me a hug, kissed me several times and left.

We are affectionate in public and he holds my hand and is a gentleman in general. He has passed the waitress test with flying colours and is generous and kind to all. He has a great relationship with his family. However, he has told me how he has ended relationships in the past because he realised when they started talking about moving in together that he didn't want to marry them, so he called them off. He did live with one partner and from what I gather it ended badly, which may be where his fear of commitment stems from, I don't know.

So my question is, dear mumsnetters, am I wasting my time or should I give him some time to see if it goes anywhere? I don't want to be a mug but I don't want to let something potentially good slip through my fingers.

Apologies for the epic length of this post!

TIA

OP posts:
maryclarey · 30/07/2013 18:56

Cereal you've just reminded me of something. He asked me once if I would ever go back to my ex, and another time if I was seeing anyone else. He seemed happy to hear me say no to both questions. You can see why I was starting to feel it wasn't just me with feelings!

OP posts:
AnyFucker · 30/07/2013 19:04

Have you had the "exclusivity" chat you young dating things seem to have these days ?

maryclarey · 30/07/2013 19:07

No, I think that was what I meant to do the other night when i brought "us" up but as you see, it didn't go very well!

OP posts:
AnyFucker · 30/07/2013 19:11

Do you think he might be fending you off because he is actually seeing others too ?

maryclarey · 30/07/2013 19:14

I don't believe he is, he's always available if I contact him to do something, be it short notice or long.

OP posts:
maryclarey · 30/07/2013 19:16

And like I said, we spend almost every weekend together. I know thats not definitive but I don't think he is seeing others.

OP posts:
AnyFucker · 30/07/2013 19:19

In my day, it was a given that you were both "exclusive" if you had the amount of contact that you two do

and that what you had was a "bf/gf" relationship, that was monogamous

also that you should be able to talk about it

that is the jarring point here, IMO

AnyFucker · 30/07/2013 19:20

I am quite old, though Smile

AnyFucker · 30/07/2013 19:20

this was pre-texting, pre-online dating, pre-Facebook and pretty much pre-everything that seems to fuck up relationships these days

Missbopeep · 30/07/2013 19:21

Oh forget all that stuff about what each of you is called - B/f, g/f or not.

All that matters is you like each other, and the only way you can see how much CA is to back off and see if he fills the space.

maryclarey · 30/07/2013 19:25

We should, but we haven't. The cat is out of the bag though so I guess we will now. Its just what terms we are offering or are willing to accept that need to be discussed.

OP posts:
maryclarey · 30/07/2013 19:28

I am backing off for a bit first. I need time to figure out what I want. I have a full weekend planned with my friends and don't intend to contact him for a bit.

OP posts:
garlicagain · 30/07/2013 19:54

Epic post warning!
I'm not projecting here, just telling a bit of my story. XH2 and I never did date - we went from being FWBs to being sort-of-an-item over a period of years, then had the exclusivity convo, but there was a kind of absence in certain parts of the relationship. I didn't worry about it much, as wasn't necessarily seeing us as a Big Thing.

The time came, anyway, when I decided the benefits of being with (but not with) him no longer outweighed the costs. We met up and I gave him the nice little talk; he seemed to take it very calmly and I toddled off to get the Tube, almost feeling let down! He ran after me and proposed Shock

I said no at first, but he wanted to know why and asked if it would alter my answer if he rectified those matters. It would. After more thinking & talking, I said yes.

It was a big mistake. I knew it at the time, and continued to know it, but he seemed incredibly committed and I really couldn't put my finger on why I didn't feel all that comfortable with things. Now, I can tell you exactly why, and can also identify the many red flags that showed up during those early years. One of them, interestingly, was him randomly turning up in the middle of the night at my place ...

Outside my initiation into the whole world of abusive patterns and personality disorders, the main thing I have taken from the experience is that I need to be much clearer about what I want from my relationships. Not 'develop' my wishes as the relationship develops; not adapt to a partner's wishes; not go with the flow. XH proposed because he didn't want to be dumped. Not only is that pathetic, it's extremely common!! It's an absolutely terrible reason to propose! Had I believed in my own conviction - that me+him had already gone as far as it could reasonably go - I'd have walked into the station and the story would have been different.

Do you want to be married/living with a compatible partner? If you do, then start looking for one who also wants to be married/living with. It looks so simple, but we manage to complicate it any number of ways. With his rather strange conflation of moving in and marriage, your guy seems to be saying that a shared laundry basket = lifetime commitment to him. Are you comfortable with that? Especially as he's told you he doesn't want to share your laundry basket? Come to think of it, he's told you several times, hasn't he? Why is that, considering the short time you've been together(ish)? Seems to be a clear warning.

So - which do you want: a relationship lite, of no real consequence, with this guy, or a compatible life partner?

garlicagain · 30/07/2013 20:00

Perfect x-post :) :)

scrazy · 30/07/2013 20:07

garlic, great post. I know it's not my thread but something you wrote has really hit a nerve with me, the bit about acknowledging the end of the road and to let go no matter what he says. I'm there now and need to act on it.

Missbopeep · 30/07/2013 20:07

But it doesn't always work like that Garlic.

Are you saying that a woman ( or a man) should make it clear early on in a relationship that they a) want to settle down ( soon) , or b) they want to settle down with that person?

Because I for one would agree about being open about a) but not so open about b) if the guy was a bit unsure.

I'd bide my time- for a while- then reassess. If he still wasn't doing and say the right things, then bye bye. But not said as a ploy to extract a proposal or commitment- only if I genuinely felt the relationship was going nowhere.

lemonstartree · 30/07/2013 20:07

I think, for me , the fact that after several months of spending every weekend together and several week nights, as well as commenting on his sexual exclusivity, he will not call you his 'girlfriend' is a bit.. odd. And worrying. I agree you need to let the relationship develop and not fret too much right now about marriage/moving in together, but to suggest you are just FWB is , well insulting. ( or it would be to me)

to me he is SAYING one thing ' I don't want to move in with anyone, we are FWB, don't get serious' and DOING another - kind, nice, loving supportive and making you feel good. This is why you are confused.

My guess is he does this. Is nice, hes probably a nice man - BUT he has the 'ideal' woman he wants to marry and you don't live up to it. I suggest his 'ideal woman is unobtainable - too good for him in looks/social standing/ financial standing /youth etc etc possibly all of these. Such men will spend all their lives in serial monogamy but never commit because they don't meet the ideal woman. I know several men, in their 50's, now lamenting the chances they let slip away, but still not seeing that the GF they have now is great...

From what you have said you have everything going for you two as a couple. So why is he NOT happy ? Why does he not want to call you GIRLFRIEND ?

sorry, but I would protect my heart. And if I couldn't do that IN the relationship, id split.

maryclarey · 30/07/2013 20:08

You hit the nail on the head garlic Smile

OP posts:
Missbopeep · 30/07/2013 20:12

Garlic- are you saying he doesn't want commitment, full stop. Or are you saying he does possibly but CA is not right for him and he knows it but won't say?

I don't think it's necessarily either of those.

maryclarey · 30/07/2013 20:12

I think garlic and missbopeep are both right. Its about knowing what I want, not necessarily blurting it out as I did, but allowing it to develop or if not, letting it go.

Lemon he has said we are more than FWB. But he may well have been saying that to keep me sweet.

OP posts:
maryclarey · 30/07/2013 20:19

Cross post.

Missbopeep, do you think I simply raised it too soon then?

OP posts:
Missbopeep · 30/07/2013 20:32

Based on my own experience- now with DH almost 30 years- yes.

I posted ages back how DH was a bit like this guy though he didn't avoid calling me his g/f.

Let me give you one example.

One by one DH's close friends/colleagues got married and we were still just dating. At this point his mates would ask ( half jokingly, in front of me) when was it going to be our turn. DH just looked uncomfortable and laughed it off.

About 18 months after we had been seeing each other ( every weekend) DH bought a house. His mates asked why he wasn't taking me along to view it too ( again, in front of me) as they assumed we were an item and I'd be moving in .

Again, DH laughed it off and said things like 'Oh nothing like that.....'

We have since talked about this. DH says that when we met he wasn't even thinking about marriage ( with me or anyone.)

He saw it as a huge step and didn't want to get it wrong.

I had no idea if we'd end up together or not. I often tried to 'test him' by saying I was thinking of working overseas in some remote 3rd world country. He'd say 'If that's what you want, do it.'
He had no inkling it was a 'test'.

I've told you the rest. I got fed up, distanced myself physically and emotionally and actually met a guy I adored- though he didn't adore me back. Then DH stepped up to the plate.

It was 3 years though- not 3 months.

maryclarey · 30/07/2013 20:42

I see your point. And I feel your situation is similar to mine. Although I would say that as it suits me!

More to think about. Basically I just need to slow the hell down but keep an eye on whether I am happy or not. And get out if I'm not.

OP posts:
Missbopeep · 30/07/2013 20:46

Feel free to PM me because I don't want to write more of my autobiography!

RinseAndRepeat · 30/07/2013 21:01

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.