Update on EA

[faulkernegger]

I posted some weeks ago about DP's suspicious friendship, and even though we have talked about it (I've said I feel uncomfortable, children have noticed etc) it's still going on.
He has been attentive and loving, and when I asked if we were ok he looked me in the eye and said 'yes'. However, a few evenings ago about 11pm he took his phone into the loo. When he came out I challenged him - why on earth do you need to take your phone into the loo at 11 o'clock at night? to which he replied - I had it in my pocket on the way upstairs. Well he didn't - it had been on the bedside table. So I said - you;re not telling me the truth and I want you to think about why you're not telling the truth.
A couple of days later he took me aside and said he'd made a decision to step back from this woman, because I clearly thought that 'something' was going on. I felt so relieved.
But, having a gnawing feeling still, I did some checking on his mobile phone bill online ( about the only thing he's forgotten to change his password for) and he seems to have called her more often and for longer, since that conversation!

What do I do now? confront again and ask exactly HOW this is stepping back? or, as my sister says, back off, be sweetness and light and give him more time to end it.
I have been for an initial assessment at Relate to see of there's anything I can do about 'me' that will help the relationship, but I feel there's no point if his mind is elsewhere.
Help!

Yes, do as Fairenuff says.

Your last post said you could see him in his music room. One consequence he might feel would be if you interrupted him there to ask him, again, why he hasn't stopped the lessons.

It seems such a small consequence to me, of his atrocious behaviour; simply having his practise interrupted, but (as an ex-musician) I know he would feel it pretty hugely, when he isn't feeling anything else very much at all.

There is a very liberal American pro marriage website by Willard Harley, much admired by Americans. He thinks any marriage can be rebuilt, as does your sister.

He has only one occasion where he thinks chucking out is justified. That is where the affair is ongoing in some way. In your case it is. Really it is. Those lessons are not about money or any child's musical education.

I wish I could remember the quote but he says throw him out and tell everyone and refuse all communication. The man will be thrown into " his own private hell" and the wondrous bubble he is in will burst quickly.

Worth a shot.

Must look that up. He came in earlier and caught me doing the 'benefits' online checker. "Are you looking up what tax credits we can get?", me: "WE aren't entitled to anything". And then I clicked off that tab and underneath was an estate agents search page. I clicked that off too and said nothing. Let him stew.

Good on you!

Whilst all this is going on do you think it might be good to take some focus on you and making yourself feel better and more confident? Pamper yourself, get your hair done, maybe buy a couple of new tops or accessories, nothing expensive just a little treat to help you feel more positive. Not to impress him but solely for your benefit. The most confident person would be feeling very bruised by this whole ordeal and taking time out just for you will benefit you regardless of the outcome in your relationship.

That was perfect.

As a next step, I'd personally do the spare room thing - 'i told you my line, you crossed it' - and stop cooking and washing for him. See how long the romantic fantasy and persuading himself it's all fine lasts when he's not included in family meals and is washing his own pants.

Absolutely perfect, Faulk! I'd also do what rumpled says, and get your hair done (bit of a MN cliche but damn it works) and he might start to notice you again. Add in a bit of 'you're looking after the dc tonight, I'm off out to rebuild my social life' and he might start to realise that you are actually going through with it.

Yes, he is going to sound more than a little foolish at counselling.

'What's the problem?'
'Well, my wife wants us to separate, I'm sleeping in the spare room and doing all my own washing and cooking. We are barely speaking, she is looking into financial assistance and somewhere else to live.'
'And why is that?'
'Er, well, um, because I want to keep teaching a music lesson to a little boy'
'And why do you want to do that?'

If the counsellor doesn't think he's a cheat, she might think he is inappropriately attached to the child! I mean, what on earth can he say, other than

'I want to be close to the child's mother'
'Why?'
'Because I... er, um, ah'
'Spit it out man'
'I'm having an affair with her'

And there you have it. He will have to face up to this if you push him.

Well done Faulk - stay strong and I second the idea of focusing on yourself, it is a cliche but it does work, doing nice stuff to build up your self esteem.

The book attached to the website is called His needs, her Needs, Willard Harley. It's basically about making marriages work, but there is one chapter on affairs, and that section I mentioned. I have it somewhere so if you want me to send it to you, pm me and I will. Come to think of it, I probably have others you might find useful.

Thanks one. I have that book, and have found the relevant chapter - quite an eye opener. I hadn't looked at it before because my sister gave it to me, and her mindset is different from mine!
Today I did the washing and left DP's stuff at the bottom of the washing basket ( there is more stuffed under his chair in the bedroom, but I stopped touching that a few years ago - consequently I often see him putting in a pile of his own stuff to wash.)
Cooking - he's rarely in when the children need to eat, so family meals are pretty much just Sundays.
The more I think about it, the more I realise how 'out of sync' he has been with us/me/dc for years. Not suggesting there has been an affair all that time, just that he hasn't been so invested in the family/our relationship as I have. He's very good at doing stuff around the house and planning camping holidays etc and if anyone was stranded on a desert island he's the one person you'd want there. But emotional investment - not so much.
My brain aches.

That is called 'withdrawing from the relationship' Faulk. When I look back, my H started doing this as long ago as 2004. He had his affair in 2007 and I have instigated divorce in 2013.

It is often the one investing less that has the affair (Shirley Glass)

So we do what we can when we can do it. But I was far too passive and invested, and it took a lot of disrespect for me to get it.

Question - DP came home in a hurry the other day in order to pick up ds as arranged. He said he'd popped into the osteopath on the off chance of getting an appointment. WIBU to ring the osteopath to find out? I could pretend he'd lost his glasses or something?

Yes do it.

Your trust has been shattered, and guarding yourself against lies is you right to protect yourself.

No you would not be unreasonable. While you're at it, ask to double check his appointment so that you know if he's booked something.

He's just come in and offered to supervise ds and 2 friends while I go out. I don't necessarily want to go out, but feel I ought to, to show I appreciate his gesture!

Why the F should you appreciate his gesture! He is his son too and he bloody well should look after him.

Go out saying you have lots to organise, refuse to divulge further. Stop by the nearest estate agents and pick up some house details, then go buy something nice for yourself. Maybe some underwear in a nice bag, if he asks to see it tell him it's none of his business and he can eff off back to the spare room. Leave house details in an accessible location.

Do something nice and frivolous for you, I like getting a new book and sitting in a coffee shop with a huge slice of cake enjoying the peace.

Who looks after his son when he is having 'music lessons' with the OW?

If you don't want to go out then don't.

Fuck showing him any appreciation for his gestures.

His gestures are easy because he has nothing to do. They are meaningless because he has categorically failed to put you and your feelings over this other woman. This is a sop to make you think what a wonderful person he is.

There is nothing there to feel grateful for in the slightest.

Tell him thanks for the gesture but you'd rather he stopped the fucking music lessons and stay away from that woman instead

That would be a really great thing to say. He is hoping this will all go away. If you bring it up as often as you can, he will see that life is not going back to how it was before. Something is going to change.

Yes that chapter is an eye opener.

You know he is trying to get round you so you will make friends and drop it, don't you?

Every time there was a suspicion and a bit of a showdown between me and H he used to do that. But it didn't stop him, it was me who was brought round to his viewpoint instead. Let me tell you, afterwards he admitted at Relate that he used to quite deliberately manipulate me.

Read up on body language, lying and gestures on the net eg manipulation techniques on wiki. Then study him for a fortnight. I think you will be surprised at how many fit, off that list.

This is the can of worms they open, with their style of relating and their view of marriage as meeting their needs only.

Look up psychological manipulation - wiki, then the section on how manipulators control their victims.

Don't bother going out if you don't fancy it.

Looking after his own kid for a couple of hours isn't really much a a "gesture", is it?

Not when he's continuing to see his girlfriend every week.

And yes, definitely make that call. It isn't you who brought devious tactics into that relationship. Your reasons are to uncover harm, not cause it.