Support for those in Emotionally Abusive relationships: 23

[CharlotteCollinsismovingon]

Am I being abused?

Verbal Abuse A wonderfully non-hysterical summary. If you're unsure, read the whole page and see if you're on it.
Emotional abuse from the same site as above
Emotional abuse a more heartfelt description
A check list Use this site for some concise diagnostic lists and support
Signs of Abuse & Control Useful check list
Why financial abuse is domestic violence Are you a free ride for a cocklodger, or supposed to act grateful for every penny you get for running the home?
Women's Aid: "What is Domestic Violence?" This is also, broadly, the Police definition.
Warning signs you?re dating a loser Exactly what it says on the tin

Books :

"Why Does He Do That?" by Lundy Bancroft - The eye-opener. Read this if you read nothing else.
"The Verbally Abusive Relationship" by Patricia Evans - He wants power OVER you and gets angry when you prove not to be the dream woman who lives only in his head.
"The Verbally Abusive Man, Can He Change?" by Patricia Evans - Answer: Perhaps - ONLY IF he recognises HIS issues, and if you can be arsed to work through it. She gives explicit guidelines.
"Men who hate women and the women who love them" by Susan Forward. The author is a psychotherapist who realised her own marriage was abusive, so she's invested in helping you understand yourself just as much as helping you understand your abusive partner.
"The Emotionally Abusive Relationship: How to Stop Being Abused and How to Stop Abusing" by Beverley Engels - The principle is sound, if your partner isn't basically an arse, or disordered.
"Codependent No More : How to Stop Controlling Others and Start Caring for Yourself" by Melody Beattie - If you a rescuer, you're a co-dependent. It's a form of addiction! This book will help you.
But whatever you do, don't blame yourself for being Co-dependent!

Websites :

So, you're in love with a narcissist - Snarky, witty, angry, but also highly intelligent: very good for catharsis
Dr Irene's verbal abuse site - motherly advice to readers' write-ins from a caring psychotherapist; can be a pain to navigate but very validating stuff
Out of the fog - and now for the science bit! Clinical, dispassionate, and very informative website on the various forms of personality disorders and how they impact on family and intimate relationships.
Get your angries out - You may not realise it yet, but you ARE angry. Find out in what unhealthy ways your anger is expressing itself. It has probably led you to staying in an unhealthy relationship.
Melanie Tonia Evans is a woman who turned her recovery from abuse into a business. A little bit "woo" and product placement-tastic, but does contain a lot of useful articles.
Love fraud - another site by one woman burned by an abusive marriage
You are not crazy - one woman's experience. She actually has recordings of her and her abusive partner having an argument, so you can hear what verbal abuse sounds like. A pain to navigate, but well worth it.
Baggage reclaim - Part advice column, part blog on the many forms of shitty relationships.
Heart to heart a wealth of information and personal experiences drawn together in one place

What couples' therapy does for abusers

If you find that he really wants to change:
Should I Stay or Should I Go bonus materials This is a site containing material for men who want to change - please don?t give him the link - print out the content for him to work through.

The Bill of Rights
What you should expect as a starting point for your treatment in a relationship, as you will of course be treating others!!

FFF vertigo is awful - so debilitating - but on the plus side I found the tablets worked very quickly. I hope they help you too.

I remember reading a book about studies on relationships and what struck the researcher was that no-one really talks about relationships either positively or negatively so it is very difficult for people to benchmark and decide whether their dp's behaviour is acceptable or not. She decided the main criteria was whether it made both of you happy.

I'm ashamed to say I have said 'all men are like that' because I thought it was true.

As for telling people in RL I find some people do try to normalise or minimise it. As an experiment, I told one of my dearest friends some of the comments that FW had been making (that I mentioned on this thread). Everyone on here thought they were negative. She just glossed over them. Also when I left the first time because FW had pushed me against a wall and threatened to punch me in the face, the people that I told in RL all minimised it. Saying 'that sort of stuff happens in arguments' [hmmm]

Although strangely enough one of the person who justified the threat of violence, gave me a solicitor's telephone number when I told her some of the negative comments FW had made to me. . .I guess everyone has different thresholds and I can't expect people to understand what my thresholds are or even to understand what my daily life is like because I minimise and go into survival mode.

However, I do think it's important to keep talking about it (as long as it doesn't demoralise us too much!). The silence and secrecy definitely helps it to flourish and go unchallenged by society.

that sort of stuff happens in arguments???
maybe between 8 yr olds. not with grown ups.

stressful.part if day done. arrived an hour late but seemed pleased so i am hoping for the kids it is all happy.
am off out to enjoy my little bit of free time...as soon as i have guzzled some cake.

Enjoy your free time mink
Winnie My ex must think physical threats are not a good thing, as he has chosen to say he didn't do them in his court statement!

mind you i am guilty too. a previous x's dad is EA and i never said anything to him.
i heard from someone else that another friend had hit his gf. I said nothing.
a friend of FW was accused of assault by his wife. I still spoke to him. because i knew him and not her.
to his wife's credit she kicked him out got an order to keep him out and divorced him.

I don't know what I would do now.

thank you all.

Sorry about vertigo but is at least a limited thing. FWs seem to stay FWs whatever.

To fill in the gaps:
My children have had skype and phone contact since 7th Jan 2012...3 months after our split due to the EA and threatening behaviour that this "lovely" middle class, well spoken, artistic father doled out to his DC and me.

Despite threats and promises he has never pursued contact actively, no contact orders etc.

3 Weeks ago he had "secret" discussions with DC about his birthday which will be soon. Inviting them and telling them they were to wait until he wrote to me...which finally happened this week (usual imperious attitude). I never said yes, I never said no. Behind the scenes I asked DC what they would like and 2 out of 4 wanted to go. I started to look for some appropriate "chaperones" but all who i find acceptable were unavailable except possibly DSiL (STBX's brothers wife who left her EA, VA relationship last year......now there's a story!!) who was bravely ready to enter the lion's den on the DC behalf if her plans allowed. Must say if I hadn't seen my children for that long I wouldn't think that an essentially grown up drinks, jazz and nibbles party would be the best place to re-establish contact but hey ho!

So was uncomfortable but considering all possibilities. Was then "doorstepped" by FW's parents who rail-roaded me into an arrangement where they picked up DC for the party. cue call to solicitor who said "WHAT????" stop that's wrong".

So today have had to tell DC can't go, tell their grandparents they are not going and was going to tell FW but his parents got there first!! Needless to say most parties have had much to say for themselves about me.

TBC

fool it is all so complicated and stressful for you. o think you can take comfort from the fact that this is on legal advice and just keep repeating that.
but how do the dcs feel about it?

and grrr at FW for ambushing you like this. typical lack of consideration for his dcs disguised as being a father keen to see his kids. i can just picture all the wringing of hands and woe is me she won't let me see them.

...continued:

sorry an epic...need to get it out!!!

now of course I know that it shouldn't matter what people think of me...just that I do the right thing. But sadly as a lifelong people pleaser it does make me unhappy. Also I am right fed up with saying no. and i do think that it is about time we sorted contact properly with supervision etc.

The funny thing is that people seem to think that keeping them to myself is selfish (!!!!) yup that's right 24/7 looking after them , no maintenance, FT work, no respite no evenings...yup that would be the easy route.

thanks for listening to me rant....off to beat up some pillows.

onwards and upwards. love to all

Hi Mink

DC1,2,3 seem ok (surprisingly....tho 2 were unsure about going) DC4 (who was 4 when he left) is threatening to "go anyway", leave home, live with daddy...but in between times she is ok...such is the child's ability to flip in and out of feelings. She does not understand and she is lucky she didn't get the bad stuff the others suffered from.

fool that is very sneaky of him.... Making arrangements behind your back. I hope it all settles down soon.

I have just read the last few posts about what to say .

It is such a vicious circle... Our parents have a dysfunctional relationship, so we don't have any model of boundaries, so when our relationships are dysfunctional or abusive, we don't label it for what it is at the start and get out. Then our children grown up with poor expectations.

I remember a friend of my mums telling me at age 15 that he worried what kind of relationships I would have as an adult, because of the dysfunctionality of my parents relationship. Needless to say, my dad couldn't believe it when I told him I was moving out, and my mum is still trying to give me helpful suggestions about how to repair our relationship.
There is no way I can label the behaviour for what it is, but the kids.... Well at least they are going to grow up knowing that you don't need a man around the house! And I am going to make sure they read some of the relationship stuff on this thread when they are old enough.

Although, like for me, it will probably fall on deaf ears. What is the norm is what is modelled, not what is read about.

And that's just trying to talk about it with nearest and dearest!

Wider circle of friends?

But like winnie says... If we keep it secret, there will never be a wider questioning of the culture which allows and promotes abusive relationships.

fool, take legal advice on this. If dcs are resident with you, set out a contact schedule, anything which deviates from that to be put in writing through sol. And then do not get involved in discussions. Contact with grandparents to be on his time, they should not come to your house. This is the right thing as everyone knows where they stand, including dcs, and can plan accordingly.

Sorry, I do not know your backstory, and I do not mean to sound oversimplistic, but there is no need for you to feel bad expecting your ex to take basic responsibilities for his dcs, and to treat you with a level of courtesy. You certainly do not need to feel bad for not capitulating to doorstep ambushing. Your response was correct.

fool you are in a just impossible situation. What a week for you. I can't cope with contact issues for one never mind 4 wonderful DC who have already been through it. It so tough dealing with all the emotions of so many people and then you sit exhausted with it all. Without you fool what an earth would happen. I think you are right use this as a stepping stone so firm up proper contact that you think is safe and that may be no contact, just whatever you think it safe and best for DC.
Bump I tried out in my head the using how it made you feel advice from fool it really works.... please try it. Made me cry a bit too but that was ok. Words that were relevant to me were.. it started with confusion (left wondering how that had ended in an argument) and then shock (he was using shock tactics to get a reaction), I felt criticised and scrutinsed (all kinds of issues here), I felt scared he was...... my nerves bean to be on edge all the time, I could not relax etc.

Oh fool that's truly shit - for you and the kids. He should not be making arrangements with the DCs behind your back, and he knows this, which is why he did it behind your back! And then getting his parents to railroad you. What does the solicitor say about re-establishing contact? Surely that should be something discussed between the two of you, starting with something brief and easy at first, if it's to happen at all. (Basically, everything sweetpea says!) He's a FW, and still trying to manipulate you and the DCs to suit himself. Happy pillow-punching, give them a good pummelling.

bump I tend to say something like 'he wasn't the man I thought he was, and he could be really awful to me sometimes'. I also have mentioned about being scared to a couple of people. You do what feels right for you, and how people react is up to them - but you'll know the ones you don't want to discuss it further with quite quickly, I think.

sorry .. very sorry to hear all this Fool

frankly.. what a FW!

mmm... regards being the one to make the right decisions for our DC... sometimes being an adult stinks.. but, it remains the way to go.

Sending you some stalwartness (?) [I have had a couple of or 3] for sticking right by those guns.

Awesome as ever. and the FWs.. well.. just as could be predicted I guess

hang on in there hun.. take this all the way xxx

i'm already sick of all the crap thats gonna come in years to come

blurghhh blurrggh blurgghhh!

FWs... Or what about in a year, when the injunction runs out.. oooo that'll be fun (I feel sick even saying that word).

Will try to catch up with all in the morning, as been making rh most of the sun so out all day today.

btw... back to FFs... are we all agreed that Mick Jagger is FW? - altho defo not my FF!!!! FW likes fucking fancies himself chronic as MJ dancer- and I assume as the FW fancies the arse off him, he must be big big fuck off FW, right?

loves xxx

wrt telling people... to some I say... its so true that you never know what goes on behind closed doors!

mj i think so.
also mick huffnel. i think.

was watching max branning ('stenders ) manhole his wife throw bin bags about and shout about the state of the place...and thinking they do portray emotionally abusive men on tv but don't make the leap of actually having someone say that is abuse. it is not boys being boys it is not romantic it is ugly and should not be tolerated.

well said Mink

These things are just watched... I would love love love to see police turn up at the square and take Max Branning out for his DV towards her.. and then him have injunction against him... would it shock the world? HELLO??

ooo.. did you mean Mick Hucknall Bernard??? I think so yes... and ... leaning towards a yes on that one.. altho, as far FF status, that would be defo no!

quite.

www.upworthy.com/a-ted-talk-that-might-turn-every-man-who-watches-it-into-a-feminist-its-pretty-fantastic-7?g=2

have you seen this? talks about the "bystander" approach where it's not the abuser/victim who is given responsibility for ending DV (Nigella anyone?) but each and every person i asked to stand up and be a leader and stop abusive attitudes.

Fi you are very funny! So agree about Mick Jagger thought that for years

it is not boys being boys, it is not romantic, it is ugly and should not be tolerated. spot on Mink.

fool so sorry that you are having such a time of it. Thinking about you

Fool also thinking about you. Hugs. It must be very difficult for you with four dc.

Hope you are ok xx

have seen that Ted. he is brilliant. I wish there were a way to get these things more coverage.
they should put that on the telly at Christmas instead of the queens speech.

i was going to catch up with the girls at the bingo tonight but it turns out the old bingo hall has closed so I am going to try out a new one.

Need to finish Lundy today too as it is overdue at the library and has been reserved. sad that Lundy is so much in demand. they only have one copy for the whole city. i am half tempted to donate some. may look into it.