Support for those in Emotionally Abusive relationships: 23

[CharlotteCollinsismovingon]

Am I being abused?

Verbal Abuse A wonderfully non-hysterical summary. If you're unsure, read the whole page and see if you're on it.
Emotional abuse from the same site as above
Emotional abuse a more heartfelt description
A check list Use this site for some concise diagnostic lists and support
Signs of Abuse & Control Useful check list
Why financial abuse is domestic violence Are you a free ride for a cocklodger, or supposed to act grateful for every penny you get for running the home?
Women's Aid: "What is Domestic Violence?" This is also, broadly, the Police definition.
Warning signs you?re dating a loser Exactly what it says on the tin

Books :

"Why Does He Do That?" by Lundy Bancroft - The eye-opener. Read this if you read nothing else.
"The Verbally Abusive Relationship" by Patricia Evans - He wants power OVER you and gets angry when you prove not to be the dream woman who lives only in his head.
"The Verbally Abusive Man, Can He Change?" by Patricia Evans - Answer: Perhaps - ONLY IF he recognises HIS issues, and if you can be arsed to work through it. She gives explicit guidelines.
"Men who hate women and the women who love them" by Susan Forward. The author is a psychotherapist who realised her own marriage was abusive, so she's invested in helping you understand yourself just as much as helping you understand your abusive partner.
"The Emotionally Abusive Relationship: How to Stop Being Abused and How to Stop Abusing" by Beverley Engels - The principle is sound, if your partner isn't basically an arse, or disordered.
"Codependent No More : How to Stop Controlling Others and Start Caring for Yourself" by Melody Beattie - If you a rescuer, you're a co-dependent. It's a form of addiction! This book will help you.
But whatever you do, don't blame yourself for being Co-dependent!

Websites :

So, you're in love with a narcissist - Snarky, witty, angry, but also highly intelligent: very good for catharsis
Dr Irene's verbal abuse site - motherly advice to readers' write-ins from a caring psychotherapist; can be a pain to navigate but very validating stuff
Out of the fog - and now for the science bit! Clinical, dispassionate, and very informative website on the various forms of personality disorders and how they impact on family and intimate relationships.
Get your angries out - You may not realise it yet, but you ARE angry. Find out in what unhealthy ways your anger is expressing itself. It has probably led you to staying in an unhealthy relationship.
Melanie Tonia Evans is a woman who turned her recovery from abuse into a business. A little bit "woo" and product placement-tastic, but does contain a lot of useful articles.
Love fraud - another site by one woman burned by an abusive marriage
You are not crazy - one woman's experience. She actually has recordings of her and her abusive partner having an argument, so you can hear what verbal abuse sounds like. A pain to navigate, but well worth it.
Baggage reclaim - Part advice column, part blog on the many forms of shitty relationships.
Heart to heart a wealth of information and personal experiences drawn together in one place

What couples' therapy does for abusers

If you find that he really wants to change:
Should I Stay or Should I Go bonus materials This is a site containing material for men who want to change - please don?t give him the link - print out the content for him to work through.

The Bill of Rights
What you should expect as a starting point for your treatment in a relationship, as you will of course be treating others!!

Sorry I haven't had chance to read.. I hope I can catch up over the weekend.. best wishes to us all for FW free w/end (we must keep hoping!) xxx

everytime i read the dcs a fairy tale i finish with and you do know that marriage is not what you should aspire to. you should have a career and financial independence. being a wife is not an and in itself. we don't do much Disney at all...nor princess books.

i wish 'cinderella marries but maintains her own identity' were a real book and not just a comedy sketch from the 80s.

Whenever DD mentions marriage, she adds on 'but my husband will share everything equally'. She did used to say she was not going to get married. So, probably seeing me trying to balance everything as a single mum has made her shift her view to the fact that a supportive husband may be the way to go. I shall be pointing her in the direction of her aunt for advice, as DSis seems to have cracked that one. I'm certainly not trying again .

No FW-free weekend here, it is just a question of to what extent.

your DD sounds like a smart cookie

I've found myself wondering something. Does it make sense that I find myself constantly feeling angry with H? Nobody on his side (family/friends) knows why we split (mostly EA, starting PA), so he's of course telling everyone just that it's amicable/friendly, implying that we just drifted apart IYSWIM. So nobody knows what a shit he was to us, and so I have to be polite and friendly in order to keep peace in front of the DCs, his family, school people, etc. And all the while I just want to tell them like it really was, but then I'd just be accused (by him) of trying to turn everyone against him. I guess it comes down to "he can be an utter ass, and he gets no consequences at all - gets exactly what he wants even" and I have to witness it all - people are all friendly and chat to him still, and if they knew some of the shit he pulled, they'd be shocked. I'm not saying it very well, but it just grates on my nerves on a daily basis. I am going to sort counselling, I think, to get me past this, as I don't want it to be something I dwell on.

I am still having to remind him at visits about his behaviour, if it continues I am going to have to quite abruptly ask him to leave (which I think he knows will upset the DCs) and he will kick off unbelievably as well.

I get so angry because he has no responsibility, waxes on during visits about his evenings out or the things he has been doing - and I don't want to know. I'm not jealous, really, as I'm happy, but it's like he's quite happy to have traded in his family for a life of freedom from responsibility. It's insulting and I just don't want to hear about it. Is that so unreasonable?

sorry, obviously my night for a rant.

Hey Alice I know that .. what IS it all about.. I would get called up for not straightaway jumping to the kitchen and making a cuppa when FW came home, and also blamed for all the noise (him yelling at me again)... and yes, they KNOW what he's like, but thats ok.

... but if I don't jump up and make a cuppa, how godawful is that! TGIF

Alice I understand that anger completely. You are entitled to feel it. Hold onto it for when you have to ask him to leave next time he can't keep hold of his anger in front of the DCs. (or starts going on about how grat his life now is, selfish twat)

I think it's the frustration that he plays the part that he wasn't abusive with everyone, so he's getting to where he believes it. So in his mind, he was just fine, thank you very much. Which means it's my fault. sigh

Alice totally understand that - I think it is because EA is VERY difficult to describe. If I was asked - `you say your ex was abusive - what did he do?' I would find it difficult to sum up without going into long descriptive monologs, especially the earlier stuff - when it was more overt it ended. And yes you are right, they mainly do it in private to you only and future partners so people don't get it.

Alice, I think that's normal. I suspect that my FW told everyone that I was 'mad' and so now his side of the family think I am bonkers. V frustrating, but... if they all believe that (which they must do, since none of them have been in touch) then that's up to them. Detach....

I spoke to a friend today, she had asked what had happened (as she had just heard we split). When I told her some of the things, she was saying "oh, men... they're all like that." Um. No. They're actually not. That dismissive comment that makes me feel like I'm overreacting, when I know I'm not.

pony my ex is still saying that but my Mum gave me a great bit of advice when I was being bullied at school FW are little boy bullies with more wrinkles some people's opinion's don't count', I really didn't understand then what lies adults will tell and how I would always need to remember that. My neighbour was so desperate for the she crazy' lies my ex told him to be true because he is his mysoginist buddy he wrote a statement making stuff up. The abuser loves his allies...especially ones to loyal.

alice we need to find some ways of explaining it I think - I am not saying your friend was right to say what she said but I can sometimes understand what they mean. I can't do it in one or two lines apart from the physical threats which were at the end and to be honest the other stuff was more damaging esp. the manipulative things.

I have found it best to let go of explaining it to others in RL. But it's a bit different for me as I don't have to have contact as kids are grown. We do share many friends, though, so there is a sort of overlap. My only regret is that I don't know how things stand between my {DBIL, DSIL & fam} and me, they are lovely people.

So glad to hear you all discussing this what to SAY to people it's something that I have SUCH a problem with... and as a consequence I probably should have left him many years ago but when I try to talk to anyone else about it, it all sounds so trivial that I end up brushing it all under the carpet, I would (in a way) like to have a 'Nigella' moment with photographers present just so everyone else could see what he's REALLY like!

I remember when DS was really young, a few months, we had a big fight before leaving for a dinner party he was so awful (I know in retrospect it was controlling behaviour but at the time it was just all...my... fault) and he was shouting at me for not looking good, not being a good mother etc we went with me still seething and I tried to talk about it at the dinner to 'out' him a bit as our friends knew me well-- and I ended up sounding like a bitter b*tch, I was ashamed of myself sounding so vindictive when he was sitting there looking totally innocent. Gah! I'm so glad to have all of you here to rant to, it is a bit scary that you almost seem more real to me these days than my real-life people!

Sometimes it helps to say what the consequences were rather than the actions...eg he behaved in such a way that I felt worthless/ugly/crazy/inadequate and i tried everything I could think of but it was just getting worse and worse...the DCs felt nervous/anxious/socially timid etc. and were having trouble at school/home.....

It is much harder for people to dismiss the results as these are YOUR experiences, than to dismiss actions as "normal" or "just men". Takes much less time too. Also after leaving and sorting life you can regale them with how much better/stronger/saner/happier you all are. And they will see this for themselves too.

They can't argue or dismiss, we don't sound vindictive and bitter because we are talking about ourselves.

BTW good to see you all looking strong and knowledgeable in all your different situations.

Spare a thought for the foolish family:lots of nasties coming my way and hard for DCs to deal with, and me too.

fool, many good wishes and strength to you.

and dcs of course too.

thank you

fool echoing sweetpeas words and hoping the strength comes. No wonder your advice is so good, you have to find every possible solution to far too many problems, it is not right. I don't want you to have to go through any more. You are so kind you protect your DC AND you pass on what you have learned to others. That makes you a very special person to many, many people.

fool sorry I forgot to add that, that is very good advice about expressing how it made you feel. I will try that in my head if there is any room as full of FW's words
Thats you have summed it up so well regarding the `nigela' moment. They are not so stupid as to do that, which is when I get really scared as I know how much they get away with and will again.
Sleep well lovely people - it will not always be like this for us.

good advice fool.
hope everything is ok.

my mum also does the all men are like that. your dad doesn't listen/never does the DIY/is lazy/selfish etc. and i say it is hardly the same. when was the last time he called you a useless cunt or a fucking idiot?
(my dad is as far as i know, ok.)

i think she is starting to get it now.

i find most people i know have no trouble imagining he is a bit of a wrong 'un because they have seen over the years how difficult it has been for me to get out etc. i mean i could go out but they knew i had to ask and sometimes cancel last minute and if i was out with the kids i was usually on my own.

and i just tell them the kind of things he said to me and they are of the mind they wouldn't be for putting up with it either.

on the one hand i don't think i should be ashamed or that i should keep his nasty little secret...on the other if he finds out i hate to think what Will happen

i think that the fact that people are shamed into silence makes it easier for it to continue in society as a whole. but i can totally understand why anyone would not want to talk about it and be judged for it and risk the consequence.

but when there is an actual incident involving the kids, i tell his family. so he knows if he behaves badly it will get known about.

Alice - I think we have all experienced that. And you are right it does make you question yourself.

But.....

We all know that when you are IN the situation and you know how your fw has spoken to you - you do know that it is NOT acceptable.

My brother asked me about our counselling session and I said I didn't think that my h had painted a true picture. He replied ' well unless he is going to call you a lazy bitch, say what have you been doing all day, c**t' etc he isn't being truthful.
And although I laughed. He is right.
No one knows what goes on behind closed doors.

I had a really bad day yesterday. Thought it was the anxiety taking over again but turns out I have vertigo. Went to docs today after experiencing dizzy, sickness, sweating and migraine. Ahhhhh something else to worry about. More tablets to take

Hugs to everyone tonight x

fool that's a great way of putting it, in terms of your own feelings/experiences. Sorry to hear things that nasties are on the way for you and the kids. What better said. - is there anything any of us can do to help? We are always here if you to vent.

FFF - hope you are feeling better today.

You are right Mink, there is no reason for us to feel shame. But i know I do, a bit, for lots of reasons. But working on it.

FFF oh no, not vertigo - I am always blaming anxiety and it ends up something else - which in some ways is a good thing as there is no tablet to ward of Fwitery yet sadly. Your brother sounds great.
mink I agree about the silence making it easier for it to continue in society - it is the silence from the neutrals who `don't want to take sides' rather than from us that causes the problem. Then there are FW's allies who he has managed to get away from us so they only hear one side.