Support for those in Emotionally Abusive relationships:22

[foolonthehill]

Am I being abused?

Verbal Abuse A wonderfully non-hysterical summary. If you're unsure, read the whole page and see if you're on it.
Emotional abuse from the same site as above
Emotional abuse a more heartfelt description
a check list Use this site for some concise diagnostic lists and support
Signs of Abuse & Control Useful check list
why financial abuse is domestic violenceAre you a free ride for a cocklodger, or supposed to act grateful for every penny you get for running the home?
Women's Aid: "What is Domestic Violence?" This is also, broadly, the Police definition.
20 signs you're with a controlling and/or abusive partner Exactly what it says on the tin

Books :

"Why Does He Do That?" by Lundy Bancroft - The eye-opener. Read this if you read nothing else.
"The Verbally Abusive Relationship" by Patricia Evans ? He wants power OVER you and gets angry when you prove not to be the dream woman who lives only in his head.
"The Verbally Abusive Man, Can He Change?" by Patricia Evans - Answer: Perhaps - ONLY IF he recognises HIS issues, and if you can be arsed to work through it. She gives explicit guidelines.
"Men who hate women and the women who love them" by Susan Forward. The author is a psychotherapist who realised her own marriage was abusive, so she's invested in helping you understand yourself just as much as helping you understand your abusive partner.
"The Emotionally Abusive Relationship: How to Stop Being Abused and How to Stop Abusing" by Beverley Engels - The principle is sound, if your partner isn't basically an arse, or disordered.
"Codependent No More : How to Stop Controlling Others and Start Caring for Yourself" by Melody Beattie - If you a rescuer, you're a co-dependent. It's a form of addiction! This book will help you.
But whatever you do, don't blame yourself for being Co-dependent!

Websites :

So, you're in love with a narcissist - Snarky, witty, angry, but also highly intelligent: very good for catharsis
Dr Irene's verbal abuse site - motherly advice to readers' write-ins from a caring psychotherapist; can be a pain to navigate but very validating stuff
Out of the fog - and now for the science bit! Clinical, dispassionate, and very informative website on the various forms of personality disorders and how they impact on family and intimate relationships.
Get your angries out ? You may not realise it yet, but you ARE angry. Find out in what unhealthy ways your anger is expressing itself. It has probably led you to staying in an unhealthy relationship.
Melanie Tonia Evans is a woman who turned her recovery from abuse into a business. A little bit "woo" and product placement-tastic, but does contain a lot of useful articles.
Love fraud - another site by one woman burned by an abusive marriage
You are not crazy - one woman's experience. She actually has recordings of her and her abusive partner having an argument, so you can hear what verbal abuse sounds like. A pain to navigate, but well worth it.
Baggage reclaim - Part advice column, part blog on the many forms of shitty relationships.
heart to heart a wealth of information and personal experiences drawn together in one place

what couples therapy does for abusers

If you find that he really wants to change
should I stay or should I go bonus materials this is a site containing the material for men who want to change?please don?t give him the link?print out the content for him to work through.

The Bill of Rights
bill of rights here is what you should expect as a starting point for your treatment in a relationship, as you will of course be treating others!!

I've hidden that thread now. It started off feeling useful, then just got too depressing. I was comparing myself to families that in reality are probably nothing like mine, but you can't tell that from a few sentences and I was feeling judged.

Well regarding divorce, mine are divorced but it wasn't the divorce that screwed me up - it was the abusive narcissistic mother. Getting me out of that 24/7 was on reflection the biggest blessing of my life. I really think I would have ended up abusive had she been around much longer or been taking abuse in every direction with an EA partner and mother. Divorce was a damage limitation exercise and every day of my life I am thankful for it. I know I'm hardly the poster child for well adjusted, but I'm accomplished in lots of areas of my life in a way that would have been impossible without my dad's influence.

Charlotte as far as your DCs are concerned, I think the only thing you can do is give them a sense of security, tell them what you are comfortable with them knowing according to their age/level of understanding, and just keep reassuring them that while things will be different, they will be okay and that you still love them. Hopefully it will counter any nonsense our FW feeds to them about it all. (guess that means telling them your FW is a delusional psychopathic narcissist is out of the question, I suppose )

your FW, not our. lol While it does seem we all have the same one sometimes, I doubt we're really sharing them.

all for your thoughts on divorce/separation.
I can honestly say I thought splitting from x was best for the dcs. they don't have to live with the arguing and if he has someone to impress they get his version of Disney dad a.k.a k normal dad. they don't have to think because they are female they deserve to be shouted at by a twunt.

it is hard for them. but him bring he was hard for them. watching him storm out of the house leaving me either crying or furious or both and them not knowing when or if he would be back.
and it us not like they got left with the worlds best parent. i try but i get grumpy and frustrate and tired and exasperated. but unlike FW I try to apologise when I am wrong and I tell them I love them often and I show them it is not just words by being there and will just have to hope that is enough. when they grow up i hope they will realise I am not perfect but I tried.

and we are a little team.

when he is shit to them I remind them it is not their fault. obvious to us but easy to forget from their perspective they assume they must have done something wrong.
I am pretty sure my dcs are going to have lots of horrible disturbing memories- the shouting, him pushing me, the flounce outs, him taking the telly will probably be writ large in there, him leaving them crying on the doorstep, him saying he never wanted them, me crying. more me crying. me being a bad tempted cow. me shouting at him.

but I try to make sure there are as many good ones (and not all visiting stately homes although we do). they do say i am too busy though

bounty - late nights with dcs are very normal for FW (so nice not to have had to be part of it myself this time!) - rules are for other people, routines likewise...

when he is shit to them I remind them it is not their fault. obvious to us but easy to forget from their perspective they assume they must have done something wrong. Will remember this.

charlotte that's funny (ironic rather than ha ha) - another FW bingo moment, as bedtime in our house when H is around constantly feels like a wrestling match between Fw and me. He is always trying to delay bedtime (I think in the hope that late night = lie in the next morning ) so always trying to hype DD up and say things like 'you don't want to go to bed yet do you'. Whereas I'm always trying to get her into bed, partly as I can see she is tired but also because it is me that has to do bedtime so I can't really relax in the evening until after bedtime.

Talking of bed, it's time for me to head off. Night all x

Colin, see when my mum was not there, my dad just went on a bender, while she was emotionally abusive and narcisstic. A brilliant team. I have no idea what it would have been like had they divorced, the tendency is to think better, but equally it could have been being shuttled between controlling, narcisstic mum and alcoholic dad with them carrying on their feuding for years - my mum never buries a grudge.

Point is, you either do your best regardless of marital status, or you don't.

heg, tired, grumpy, frustrated, exasperated, these are all human emotions, your dcs will have them too. It is how you deal with them. One thing I realised in counselling is that I can't do negative emotions, so I do whatever I can to make them go away (people pleasing), whereas they are part of life, they are there to tell us something, we need to listen to them.

I also think splitting was best for dcs, possibly not dsd but she was only there in holidays, so her experience of our family was different than dds.

charlotte yy to being described as weak and feeble and therefore somehow causing his abuse. I had sort of accepted that too on some level, till I read your words and had a bingo moment. But actually you?re right ? it was no good standing up for myself because the screaming abuse escalated and got frightening. I was meant to stand up to an apparently out of control man with a conviction for ABH (during pub fight, years ago) who was looming menacingly over me and screaming at me so loudly I was deafened, ashamed, embarrassed, frightened, horrified for kids etc etc. Argh FW!

Also, my fw lies on and on about how he thinks I?m destroying the family and the dcs? lives. Not his abuse that drove me away, no.

Sweetpea I am from a highly dysfunctional and damaging two parent family too and the brief periods when they would live apart were far happier, saner and more liveable. There was a little room for the children then, but unfortunately they always got back together, though were never really together. I too cannot bear the Stately Homes thread ? it?s too terrifying, the amount of stuff that would come up. But my counselling is helping a lot.

Night night all, strength and peace to all of us

breathe, thank you for sharing your experience, as you are genuinely in a position to comment on the divorced/together issue. Most of it, I find too painful, the worst is, it is still going on, hence the NC. However, the funny thing is, recognition that my upbringing was abusive, and that the way my mum behaved was controlling and EA, was what led to the lightbulb moment with FW.

FWIW, I also got the destroying the family stuff, it has moved on to other personal attacks now. I am at the notion it was somehow your fault for not standing up to him, there is no sense of responsibility there, is there?

Night, night too btw

hurrrah!
all the talk of greasy bloaters made me want to get the book from whence that expression comes.
it is "How Tom beat Captain Najork and his hired sportsmen"
it is all about a boy who lives with his Aunt Fidget Wonkham Strong (which is what my dm used to call dsis as she was a master of fichering and fidgeting).
Aunt Fidget Wonkham strong frequently says 'very well, eat your cabbage and potato sog' or 'eat your greasy bloaters'
so my dm used to refer to any of her cooking fails as greasy bloaters and cabbage and potato sog. (and insist we ate them whilst laughing behind her hand)

and now that is how I refer to FWs. an unappetising fail that was not what you wanted at all.

am so looking forward to reading book to the girls. it is great. all about tom foolery (like they don't do enough of that (thanks pony btw for your wise comment several threads ago about the daft and infuriating things they get up to probably being some of their best memories. makes me see the funny side))

the book has brought back brilliant memories of my childhood and dms rather off the wall sense of humour.

dm also gave me sage advice last night when I was on the topic of it is all right for him off with his new woman as if nothing ever happened but you wouldn't want to be him he is a miserable sod which ever way you look at it true mum very true.

but you wouldn't want to be him he is a miserable sod

Greasy bloaters still makes me laugh *heg. I might have to get hold of that book too!

You (and your DM) are right - I tried to articulate that a while ago, but that's just it. FW is a miserable sod whichever way you look at it. Having the job of his dreams didn't make him happy. Having a wife who loved him and his daughters, and a lovely step-son, didn't make him happy. Having a nice house and a nice life didn't make him happy. Nothing ever will.

Hi all - I still haven't managed to read the whole thread, but I just wanted to add my experience of telling ds4 about our breakup for verygently. We too had a period of time living together when first of all exp was trying to persuade me to leave him and the kids, and then when he was looking for somewhere to live once he realised I wasn't going anywhere without them. We decided not to tell ds (dd too young to understand) until he knew where he was going and we had a house to show ds around. We made it as fun as possible, like a new adventure, and told him together, telling him how much we loved him, but that we had just decided to live in separate houses.

He has, of course, has his ups and downs, but has coped really well. verygently I am in work at the moment so can't post loads, but PM me if you want to hear any more about how we told him and what has happened with him since.

Hope everyone is ok, I have had a shitty weekend, I will probably come on and rant about it soon .

It is so great to read about others experiencing similar to me after separating, I don't feel as lonely and unhinged now . Thanks!

FW is a miserable sod whichever way you look at it. Having the job of his dreams didn't make him happy. Having a wife who loved him and his daughters, and a lovely step-son, didn't make him happy. Having a nice house and a nice life didn't make him happy. Nothing ever will.

And that is it.

Good day today. Here's hoping for another one tomorrow.

I was almost missing the greasy bloater today. just because I know he had a nice 'family' day out and I can just about remember when I met him and he actually used to put on a front.

but then I remembered all the times he just assumed I would organise everything while he sat on his arse and sulked if we weren't ready. still a bit sad he could not have just kept on making an effort.

was totally prepared to wait to meet someone but this set me back a bit and made me think a) i would really like a nice hug right now b) men who wanted to go out with me were few and far between when I was young skinny single and childless. chances are even slimmer now. add to that the fact that he never has them overnight and it looks bleak.

but I need to stop reacting to him. have spent half the day mentally telling him why he is a fuck up.
waste of a day.

it is NOT FAIR though. not FAIR.

It's not, heg. It's really not fair. I have spent whole days/weekends having conversations in my head with FW. It never makes me feel better, just more frustrated that I can't have these conversations with him and change the course of history/tell him what I think of him.

I am sending you a big hug over the ether - totally not the same, I know (I miss man-hugs too).

hi babyseal don't worry too much about catching up on the thread, you'll pick up people's stories, or bits of them. I'm a bit out of touch with it atm, but I no longer need the thread, as have been free for nearly a year now. Am out of touch for good reason, as am being Hopeful Example that It is Never Too Late to find a Nice Bloke (am 60). Was happy on my own, however he is a lovely addition to my life.

if you need further examples check out the happy 2nd relationship thread. I needed cheering up

and yay for your New man silvery

I have a lot of ahem pent up energy going to waste

thank you for the hug pony.
someday maybe we can be virtual dating buddies

anyway enough moaning on heg. Jesus it is only a week since you were last on a date and decided it was not for you!!!

how is everyone else?

drinks in the vixens later after exam revision.

I think I am weird, I don't miss man hugs, probably because FW used to back me into a corner and hold me there, to give me a hug whether I wanted it or not.

silver, glad things are going well for you

heg, I kind of see it a bit like a tide, where waves ebb and flow, but gradually the shore empties, it is almost imperceptible. By which I mean, you are healing, but there are setbacks. Mine are usually around contact weekend, when my brain empties, my anxiety takes over and I feel like I am right back there. But I am not. I wish I knew how not to react, too, I now have signs all over my house and office telling myself not to engage. Hoping it seeps in before next contact w/e.

On the dating front, look at it this way, were the family days really worth everything else? I am sure there is a great guy out there where you can have nice days out minus the fuckwittery in general. In the meantime, you are still getting over the not great guy, so go easy on yourself.