Support for those in Emotionally Abusive relationships:22

[foolonthehill]

Am I being abused?

Verbal Abuse A wonderfully non-hysterical summary. If you're unsure, read the whole page and see if you're on it.
Emotional abuse from the same site as above
Emotional abuse a more heartfelt description
a check list Use this site for some concise diagnostic lists and support
Signs of Abuse & Control Useful check list
why financial abuse is domestic violenceAre you a free ride for a cocklodger, or supposed to act grateful for every penny you get for running the home?
Women's Aid: "What is Domestic Violence?" This is also, broadly, the Police definition.
20 signs you're with a controlling and/or abusive partner Exactly what it says on the tin

Books :

"Why Does He Do That?" by Lundy Bancroft - The eye-opener. Read this if you read nothing else.
"The Verbally Abusive Relationship" by Patricia Evans ? He wants power OVER you and gets angry when you prove not to be the dream woman who lives only in his head.
"The Verbally Abusive Man, Can He Change?" by Patricia Evans - Answer: Perhaps - ONLY IF he recognises HIS issues, and if you can be arsed to work through it. She gives explicit guidelines.
"Men who hate women and the women who love them" by Susan Forward. The author is a psychotherapist who realised her own marriage was abusive, so she's invested in helping you understand yourself just as much as helping you understand your abusive partner.
"The Emotionally Abusive Relationship: How to Stop Being Abused and How to Stop Abusing" by Beverley Engels - The principle is sound, if your partner isn't basically an arse, or disordered.
"Codependent No More : How to Stop Controlling Others and Start Caring for Yourself" by Melody Beattie - If you a rescuer, you're a co-dependent. It's a form of addiction! This book will help you.
But whatever you do, don't blame yourself for being Co-dependent!

Websites :

So, you're in love with a narcissist - Snarky, witty, angry, but also highly intelligent: very good for catharsis
Dr Irene's verbal abuse site - motherly advice to readers' write-ins from a caring psychotherapist; can be a pain to navigate but very validating stuff
Out of the fog - and now for the science bit! Clinical, dispassionate, and very informative website on the various forms of personality disorders and how they impact on family and intimate relationships.
Get your angries out ? You may not realise it yet, but you ARE angry. Find out in what unhealthy ways your anger is expressing itself. It has probably led you to staying in an unhealthy relationship.
Melanie Tonia Evans is a woman who turned her recovery from abuse into a business. A little bit "woo" and product placement-tastic, but does contain a lot of useful articles.
Love fraud - another site by one woman burned by an abusive marriage
You are not crazy - one woman's experience. She actually has recordings of her and her abusive partner having an argument, so you can hear what verbal abuse sounds like. A pain to navigate, but well worth it.
Baggage reclaim - Part advice column, part blog on the many forms of shitty relationships.
heart to heart a wealth of information and personal experiences drawn together in one place

what couples therapy does for abusers

If you find that he really wants to change
should I stay or should I go bonus materials this is a site containing the material for men who want to change?please don?t give him the link?print out the content for him to work through.

The Bill of Rights
bill of rights here is what you should expect as a starting point for your treatment in a relationship, as you will of course be treating others!!

Another one joining.. I have slowly realised I'm in, at best, an unhealthy but more likely EA relationship. I've asked H to leave but he's currently unwilling to leave due to finances. I've asked him to schedule time with me so we can discuss money as we should be able to run 2 homes. I hope that I can appeal to his logic however he has never wanted to meet my needs so I doubt he will start now!

Very, we will be in a similar situation as my ds is 7. This is my 2nd marriage (ex H was an alcoholic) so I have been through this before. My dd was 5 but is now a very well adjusted and successful young adult and I reflect that had I stayed with her dad her life and educational outcomes would have been very different. Even she says that. I know I made the right decision then but sadly I think I have repeated the pattern. H is the opposite of my ex, I took the relationship so slow but realise I missed the red flags because I didn't understand controlling behaviour.

H can't understand why I want to leave the marriage - he has a great career, he goes away when he wants and treats me like an aupair (only not as respectfully and on less money). He pursues his all day hobbies when he wants. We live in the area he wants. We live in the house he wanted. His life is going great - why am I complaining..I am obviously ungrateful or mentally ill!

I've found Lundy so insightful but knowing you are in an EA relationship is scary. I realise I have been manipulated and that the 'love' is just control. It's quite terrifying and I think I'm still coming to terms with that.

Oh Alice, I am sorry to hear you are stressed, somejust notimes people just do not think.

What is it with them vacating the marital bed ( when suits them, I had to flee snoring for several years before dc birth when he decided that he did not want to disturb me as I would be disturbed with new baby. So considerate , then of course yes, I would have to keep things quiet till he woke up. The behaviour we got if he had not had enough sleep.

I was reading that thinking there must be an anti Lundy as well.

peg at the TV, though xh1 took his too, just not quite in such spectacular circumstances. FW asked for something back which was so bizarrely hilarious, but I would definitely out myself if I said. It is not the funniest post FW story though, there is another which I absolutely have to remember next time he starts bullying me (ie next contact, if he can hold off that long).

start welcome. The last sentences of your post are so very true, it is very scary.

peg, that gave me the giggles, the way you described FW trying to flounce with telly. Don't worry about outing yourself, I'm sure the anti-Lundy is currently making hundreds of FWs up and down the country stomp out of their houses with huge tvs on their backs. :o

Welcome, start and sorry you have to be here. His life is going great - why am I complaining.. - that is so true!

Well, I've had a lovely quiet few days and am looking forward to seeing my dcs again (although they probably won't get back until after my bedtime). Tomorrow is the next Relate sesh, where I try to convince FW that the marriage is over and I'm serious about that and I do have a right to make that decision and there isn't anything he can do about it. Not sure an hour is going to be long enough...

Welco,e start

charlotte glad you have enjoyed the last few days and good luck for tomorrow.

alice hope you're feeling a bit more chilled

I've had a nice afternoon with my family, including sister and nephew but feel all empty now they have gone. It keeps hitting me that FW has gone all over again, I'm sorry I sound like a broken record, obsessing over someone who never loved me but aaaargh.

Hi all I haven't had a chance to get on and read the posts yet but ill go back over them.

Hope everyone is okay!

DD is home from hospital and so much better thankfully just trying to get her back into our routine which isn't proving easy because she has been giving so much medicine she's been refusing to eat and doesn't like anything going near her face or mouth unless its her putting it there so I've been having lots of fun with that. DP has been quite good and not really been on at me and just left me to sort DD which is what I needed. He did go through all my draws though while I was in hospital and found some letters and stuff from a counsellor which he didn't know about so that caused abit of an upset and explanation.

Going to get some dinner and ice cream then catch up

Charlotte, 'the marriage is over, I am perfectly serious, I realise this is difficult for you but I have the right to make that decision'. Five minutes, tops. Repeat in front of the mirror. Add, 'I understand this is not what you want, but I do not have to justify my decision. You obviously remain the children's father, and it is in everyone's best intersts that we move forward constructively'. Then look to counsellor for suggestions of how to do this - this is the focus of the rest of your session. I know that sounds easier said than done, but if you are ending the marriage, from what you have said about counslleor previously, you may also need to be clear to her that her job is to help you both move forward in that case. Anything else is a waste of time and money.

notso, I am behind on posts so not sure of situation with your dd, but want to wish you both well, that you can support her free of fwittery, but at him invading your privacy like that.

:o sweetpea. And then he whines says, "But I don't understand why and I can't agree to it if I don't know why." Of course if I were to try to explain, he would say, "Oh but it's not like that, I'm sorry it came across that way but it's really not true blah blah." Worried the counsellor might feel I owe him an explanation before the constructively-moving-forward bit, too...

Reason and logic just bounce off him. Whatever I say or have said... Blink. "But I don't understand and I can't agree..." It's like three-second goldfish memory or something.

NotSo - glad you're back home and poor DD with all that medicine. at your FW looking through your drawers!

FW has just texted , is just starting four-hour homeward journey now. Already past bedtime for dcs. His thoughts are all about work he has to do when he gets back and sorry it might disturb me when they get back - nothing about the dcs, of course.

charlotte glad you've had a few days of clear-headedness. Here's hoping the DC's don't have school tomorrow!

Charlotte I would make him calm and settle the DCs and get them up and do the school run with grouchy kids

When I mentioned going through my draws it was my fault, me keeping secrets, he didn't realise he wasn't allowed and I have things to hide and he thought it was just our space but now I've hurt him

Oh good grief charlotte, they will be exhausted . It will be a short night and a long day tomorrow.

He does not have to agree to separate, he needs to accept that is your wish and your right. Even that can be a long, difficult process. But if he doesn't listen, there is no amount of reasoning you can do, it gets to the point where you just have to state facts (see previous post).

If counsellor presses for an explanation, state 'the marriage is not working for me, I would like your help in moving forward constructively'. Repeat as necessary, in words which are comfortable to you. Acknowledge her request for an explanation, 'I can see you think an explanation would be helpful, but we have discussed things so many times, I have no wish to go over old ground. I would like your help in moving forward constructively'. Repeat as necessary, again in words comfortable to you. At the end of the day, an explanation inevitably descends into blame, and it also opens the door for the issues contained in the explanation to be addressed.

notso glad D D is home. hope she feels better soon.

Charlotte glad you enjoyed your free time.

Colin I am sure it will get better but it takes time. maybe as you are young free and single you should get out there and see what if you can have some fun?

hugs to everyone else.

speaking of getting back out there I could for with some advice....but not here...maybe by the duck pond.

Charlotte sweetpeasunday is absolutely correct - He does not have to agree to separate It is your right to separate from him, and (pardon the expression) there really is fuck all that he can do about that, in the long run. And as he is not willing to listen to your explanations, I would say that it is not constructive to get into that - you do NOT need to feel backed into a corner. Just because she is a counsellor, that does not mean you are required to do everything she says.

Hi all,

sweetpea I am currently memorising your words (to Charlotte) and practising . The trouble is, his answer will either be to fly off the handle (again) or to talk my brain off, or to hit me with tears and guilt trips.

It just makes me think of that song "50 ways to leave your lover"

You Just slip out the back, Jack
Make a new plan, Stan
You don't need to be coy, Roy
Just listen to me
Hop on the bus, Gus
You don't need to discuss much
Just drop off the key, Lee
And get yourself free

Thanks peg. I'm a bit hormonal so feeling worse than usual. I've registered online which has been a confidence boost and is a hobby I guess but I don't think it's for me. I'm finding I'm hypersensitive to people. If I don't reply soon enough, some men send more messages - I block them, as that's a bit close to FW. One guy saw The Handmaids Tale was my favourite book and said 'he'd like to reenact some of the scenes from it as he has fantasies about it'. FW found that book arousing so I blocked him. Hopefully I'll get out and about this week with dates and with my friends because at the moment, I'm unable to see a way forward. I imagine fw all happy while I'm sad and alone (exept when I'm with my sister, I am ok then). I feel,inclined to wait for FW to make a return.

Hurry up AF...

sweetpea, that is excellent advice. Thank you! I have said to him more than once that we talked things through plenty just a few weeks ago and there's no point saying more now - but I may well have lost my nerve if the counsellor destabilised me again!

Yes, I know, they don't give up. I am a few months out, so getting a bit more detached, slowly, and this last weekend, stuck to my guns, repeatedly in different words (quite reasonable, agreed by both sols) and he went the whole range of polite, to manipulative, to quietly threatening, to hostile, to name-calling, because i did not do what he wanted. It does not stop. There are just much, much bigger breaks between it, which are good for finding oneself again.

I am finding I need to be careful re EH and make sure the boundaries are pretty clear, as there seems to be a blurring of them. I don't want it to be a "married but living separate" vibe there. I think it's a bit of a personal space issue IMO. I'm still feeling raw and need the insulation in place if that makes sense.

Charlotte I left nearly 8 months ago and was asked to come back just last week. It will take the Decree Absolute for him to finally give up, I think.

Alice that is my problem. I end up spending time at FW's house as the kids are never ready. Today he was at a car boot sale with ds, who had stayed overnight. He hadn't told me they were going, so I went to meet them as I wanted to look for something for me. We ended up having a late breakfast all together and to the outsider, we probably just looked like an ordinary family. I think I am trying to keep things amicable for the kids. He keeps telling me it won't be like this once we are divorced, but is the main instigator of situations like this.

I am not comfortable leaving dcs with EH, and he agreed to my condition that all visitation be supervised (EA/PA history), which means I'm there the whole visit - just a few hours. But like you, keeping things amicable for the dcs.

I think that as he has not told family/friends the real reason we split, they may think I'm being rather controlling keeping visitation supervised, but if I out him to them, it will get truly ugly, and I want to avoid that route, as the dcs end up suffering then.

Could you have the visits supervised by someone else Alice? Contact centre, or your family?

Hi all, hugs all round. We made it to the end of the week .

Thank you for the thoughtful advice on when and how to tell DS. I've decided to wait, and also I guess I must give P the opportunity to be there, so I can't do it yet. I'm still worrying a lot about it, I keep going over and over in my head what I might say, and doing this makes me want to cry. But, I've remembered something mentioned upthread about it possibly being helpful to process these painful thoughts, so I'm hoping that maybe by practising it in my head I might stand a chance of telling DS without getting upset myself (which I think is really important, but almost impossible).

I'm confused and angry with P- we agreed prior to DS & I coming away that I would let DS take the lead regarding phoning P. I've casually asked him each day if he wanted to call Daddy, he's said yes once (so we called him), but DS has said a few times that he thought maybe Daddy might call him. So I texted P today and tried to explain that I thought DS would appreciate a call. I had no reply, he didn't call. I know I should disengage but I've sent a further text saying I'm disappointed that he hadn't responded to my text- fair enough there may be a good reason why he couldn't call, but he could have responded. I'm getting nagging doubts about whether he's going to step up to the mark- never in my darkest moments did I think P would let his son down. I'm so outing myself IRL by giving specifics like this, but I am finding bro g part of this thread so comforting that I can't help it.

Right, rant over.

alice sorry to hear you are dealing with 'extra shit' when you already have so much on your plate .

Welcome start, I'm sorry you have found yourself in such a tricky situation. Thank you for your kind reassurance about DS, it was lovely to read. This is a great supportive place, I hope it helps you a little to be here.

Colin you don't sound like a broken record at all. It must be incredibly hard to get your head around, no wonder it is so hard to process. I'm not wise enough to suggest how you can move forwards, but plenty of ladies here are, so keep posting.

Sorry that your nice days of rest have ended with DC being brought home so late charlotte. I really hope tomorrows' session goes well, I would hope that your councellor should help you navigate through this in a way that works for you. Sweetpeasunday's advice sounds excellent.

notso glad DD is home. I'm shocked that your H has rifled through your drawers, how typical that he has now tried to blame you for him treading all over obvious entirely reasonable boundaries.

Sorry if I've missed anyone. Hugs to you all.