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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

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Support thread for those in emotionally abusive relationships...coming of age:21

999 replies

foolonthehill · 04/05/2013 11:49

Am I being abused?

Verbal Abuse A wonderfully non-hysterical summary. If you're unsure, read the whole page and see if you're on it.
Emotional abuse from the same site as above
Emotional abuse a more heartfelt description
a check list Use this site for some concise diagnostic lists and support
Signs of Abuse & Control Useful check list
why financial abuse is domestic violenceAre you a free ride for a cocklodger, or supposed to act grateful for every penny you get for running the home?
Women's Aid: "What is Domestic Violence?" This is also, broadly, the Police definition.
20 signs you're with a controlling and/or abusive partner Exactly what it says on the tin

Books :

"Why Does He Do That?" by Lundy Bancroft - The eye-opener. Read this if you read nothing else.
"The Verbally Abusive Relationship" by Patricia Evans ? He wants power OVER you and gets angry when you prove not to be the dream woman who lives only in his head.
"The Verbally Abusive Man, Can He Change?" by Patricia Evans - Answer: Perhaps - ONLY IF he recognises HIS issues, and if you can be arsed to work through it. She gives explicit guidelines.
"Men who hate women and the women who love them" by Susan Forward. The author is a psychotherapist who realised her own marriage was abusive, so she's invested in helping you understand yourself just as much as helping you understand your abusive partner.
"The Emotionally Abusive Relationship: How to Stop Being Abused and How to Stop Abusing" by Beverley Engels - The principle is sound, if your partner isn't basically an arse, or disordered.
"Codependent No More : How to Stop Controlling Others and Start Caring for Yourself" by Melody Beattie - If you a rescuer, you're a co-dependent. It's a form of addiction! This book will help you.
But whatever you do, don't blame yourself for being Co-dependent!

Websites :

So, you're in love with a narcissist - Snarky, witty, angry, but also highly intelligent: very good for catharsis
Dr Irene's verbal abuse site - motherly advice to readers' write-ins from a caring psychotherapist; can be a pain to navigate but very validating stuff
Out of the fog - and now for the science bit! Clinical, dispassionate, and very informative website on the various forms of personality disorders and how they impact on family and intimate relationships.
Get your angries out ? You may not realise it yet, but you ARE angry. Find out in what unhealthy ways your anger is expressing itself. It has probably led you to staying in an unhealthy relationship.
Melanie Tonia Evans is a woman who turned her recovery from abuse into a business. A little bit "woo" and product placement-tastic, but does contain a lot of useful articles.
Love fraud - another site by one woman burned by an abusive marriage
You are not crazy - one woman's experience. She actually has recordings of her and her abusive partner having an argument, so you can hear what verbal abuse sounds like. A pain to navigate, but well worth it.
Baggage reclaim - Part advice column, part blog on the many forms of shitty relationships.
heart to heart a wealth of information and personal experiences drawn together in one place

what couples therapy does for abusers

If you find that he really wants to change
should I stay or should I go bonus materials this is a site containing the material for men who want to change?please don?t give him the link?print out the content for him to work through.

The Bill of Rights
bill of rights here is what you should expect as a starting point for your treatment in a relationship, as you will of course be treating others!!

OP posts:
minkembra · 10/05/2013 23:45

ducks!?!

bountyicecream · 10/05/2013 23:53

Oh butterfly that makes me feel a bit better. I could hear the words in my head but somehow couldnt say them. He threw me with the denials. I mean maybe he isn't cheating maybe he genuinely can't remember texts. But he seems to think he deserves a medal for not saying "you are too fat" the last few weeks. I want someone who loves me for me and doesn't care if I'm a few pounds heavier than when we met 10 years ago :( :( :(

Piemother · 10/05/2013 23:56

Can I join again?
Having a hard time with recovery just now. Left abusive marriage 18 months ago. Did the freedom programme. Mostly having a great time with the dc on my own.
I struggle on and off though with being so preoccupied with exh behaviour in the past toward me.
Here is an example- in the morning when I'm showering or whatever in the bathroom all I can think about is how he obstructed any kind of privacy and how self care and getting dressed in the am was really difficult for me if he was home, it's like I'm trying up process things I dunno rally.
Any thoughts?

minkembra · 10/05/2013 23:57

bounty you don't have to prove he is having an affair to leave him even though he is and he is lying about it, you don't have to get him to admit he is abusive, even though he is, you can just leave him because you are not happy. there is no way to win this one other than not to play. iyswim.

my ex used to say will you did this/do that/said this/ are not nice to me either. and I just replied well in that case it is twice the reason to end it. glad you agree. then he either has to admit what he just said is bollocks or agree you are better apart. and even if he says it is bollocks still leave. he does not have to agree to you leaving. it is unlikely you will get any validation of your reasons from him

do you have virgin meeja? if so coupling series 1 is on WWAW. the episode where Steve tries to split up with Jane and she says 'well I don't agree' might be worth watching so if he tries to not agree you can see how ridiculous he is being.

bountyicecream · 11/05/2013 00:04

Mink you're right. He's never going to admit to either cheating or being abusive because that would make him to be in the wrong. I suppose I did subconsciously want him to validate what I'm feeling so I know that I'm right. But deep down I know I'm right anyway.

Interestingly he never denied that he hasn't been nice to me recently. Just justified it by saying that I'm not nice to him either. I might try the double the reason to split comment

bountyicecream · 11/05/2013 00:10

Hi pie. Sorry. Been me me me tonight. I suppose you do need to process the thoughts. Can you put a positive spin on it. ie isn't it lovely having privacy now fw isn't around. Sorry I'm not much use tonight. Others who are out will be able to help more

FairyFi · 11/05/2013 00:11

lots of friends here to stave off any loneliness Bounty I know its hard what you are facing right now. Been thinking of your talk and guts to do that, don't let him bring on despondence. You did good, he did bad, and refused to give you anything. Why do we expect that they will give something? When we knw they never have, and if they ever did, it was to get something else? yeah?

big ((hugs))

anyone know how one gets Chlamydia in the eye?

butterflymeadow · 11/05/2013 00:20

bounty, weight is a way they can get to you, especially with pg changes you can't control or have to try to shift. I had several mcs pre dc2 and my weight yoyo-ed. He knew I was not happy with it, but he always commented. And then when I lost lots of weight trough bf and stress, he commented.
Secondly, Good Grief, my internal voice used to yell, I want you to leave, for a while, and before that it used to say it and it probably started by whispering it, but my actual voice took longer to find the courage.

mink yes, I did wonder if it was public persona, anything to sound reasonable, after all, i heard ersions and it took me a while to realise it would not happen. Ever. Which means, without going into details, tbat we need to negotiate on two scenarios.
Thank you. I will note this all down. Stress.

Early start with dcs tomorrow.pie only quickly but I think what you describe is a violatiion of your bodily integrity, it is dehumanising, because your clothes, your make up, your hair are part of who you are. And lacking those things puts you at a disadvantge. The things I stumble on, probably have not even touched, are the things to do with his bodily treatment of me. I do not have an answer but I think it is because of the deep and constant violation of your privacy and self. I will think on it.

minkembra · 11/05/2013 00:23

pie i think I think about it too much too but I don't know what to do about it. not much help I know.

positive spin sounds like a good idea. also is it worth reading up about ptsd? there are also cbt tricks for thingy thoughts what is the word? not persistent but unwelcome.

butterflymeadow · 11/05/2013 00:24

Last thought and then bed, bounty, ateotd, it does not matter whether he admits it or not, the relationship is broken for you. And you matter. Oft said on here but v true, you do not need permission to end it. You know you have reason, it is not working for you, that is enough.

Xx to all. I need sleep!

butterflymeadow · 11/05/2013 00:25

Intrusive thoughts.

minkembra · 11/05/2013 00:25

intrusive thoughts. maybe try to get some cbt?

FairyFi · 11/05/2013 00:25

intrusive

minkembra · 11/05/2013 00:25

thanks butterfly x post Grin

minkembra · 11/05/2013 00:29

and fi i can think of one way Blush but pretty sure it wasn't that. have you been rubbing koalas on your eye? Grin

FairyFi · 11/05/2013 00:31

i don't have it

FairyFi · 11/05/2013 00:31

koalas?

minkembra · 11/05/2013 00:36

disclaimer: rubbing koalas on your eyes is not a treatment for chlamydia!

apparently koalas are rife with it. to the point it threatens their survival.

sounds nasty though

minkembra · 11/05/2013 00:43

apparently as you might imagine you an spread it to your eyes with your hands or from towels or face cloths.

which reminds i should really go for sti check. had one done since starting to see ex but not lately and who knows what/who he got up to. maybe nothing but better safe than sorry.

Piemother · 11/05/2013 00:47

Thanks mink abs butterfly - just a bit if validation helps a lot. Constant violation of privacy and self sums it up well.
He used to bang on about that bring part of intimacy but I'm damn sure that intimacy is a consenting process. It sounds like such a small thing I know but I'm haunted by it every day. Of course he told me I was being ridiculous about it.

BibiBlocksberg · 11/05/2013 01:08

Just popping in to take up Lemon's excellent suggestion (from about 4 pages ago lol) to issue a much needed fresh round of tickets for all FW's on this thread to get on the train to the far side of fuck.

Calling at knobhead, wanker, manipulation and alltypesofabusington.

Terminating at fuck off some more :)

I do still keep up with all of you courageous vixen's fights but don't post much as I don't feel I 'belong' anymore. Which is both good and selfish at the same time I suppose.

Sending you all strength and good wishes from ecstatic singletown (2.5 years and counting thanks to MN)

butterflymeadow · 11/05/2013 03:30

pie, you are not being ridiculous at all. To be honest, your comments brought to mind that FW here was the same. He used to ridicule me for wanting to shower or dress in private and call me prudish. I think intimacy is a consenting process, your body does not belong to someone. There is a lot of sex/body stuff I have not dealt with, because I am still trying to sort the leaving so it may be that it is coming out nowbecause you are in a safer place.

Well, I cannot sleep and I am supposed be driving with dcs to somewhere tomorrow which they are looking forward to and we have booked. I am so frustrated at the rewriting of history. There is a lot of emotive language in the letter too. He talks about difficulties 'we' had, yet when I was so worn down I was ill, he took no responsibility. I can't put down what he said as it would be identifying. He never changed his plans if dc2 was ill, bar one time, even though we both worked. He never,ever deviated from what he wanted or needed to do. And now he is suddenly father of the year. He had no difficulties, except me deciding enough was enough. No wonder he does not agree the marriage is over.

Secondly, mink, I think you are right, I cannot negotiate based on something he might do, which has not materialised, particularly when I have heard and been promised versions of it before and they did not materialise with not the tiniest step being taken in that direction.

Okay, I am going back to bed. I am going to try the bubble thing, because one can see that he is trying to push buttons and provoke a response. My sol has been very good at paring down stuff to the key points and it might just be a case of pointing out that his view is clearly subjective and we want to stick to the issues at hand. There are a couple of things to correct as a matter of fact, which I will note, but otherwise this is just a highly expensive version of the blame game which led to me taking legal representation in the first place. And it is no less bullying.

Deep breaths. This is going to be my reality for a very long time. I cannot change it, only the way I respond. Being angry will only affect me and possibly dcs.

butterflymeadow · 11/05/2013 03:32

Driving today, I mean.

ColinCaterpillar · 11/05/2013 08:36

Morning all, wishing you a FW free weekend or that you make it through.

Unfortunately, I crumbled. It was satisfying for a bit knowing it was driving him mad being ignored, but it got too much. Big mistake Colin. I thought hoovering = being nice. He ended up being nastier and more controlling than ever via text. Told me it was all my fault and that I would never change, telling me to meet him and just to say 'yes', you need to reply THIS SECOND, remember to LISTEN. Then topped it off with a 'do not contact me again'.

Will have a proper catch up later on, I'm on my phone and fuming. FW wanker.

CharlotteCollinsismovingon · 11/05/2013 08:51

I suppose I did subconsciously want him to validate what I'm feeling so I know that I'm right.

This. Absolutely. But since it's not going to happen, when I tell him it's over, I'm not going to give reasons. Just say it's not working for me and this is my decision. It's not you it's both of us blahdeblah. It ain't what I'm thinking and it's not the whole truth, but it'll be something he understands and can't argue against. (At least, he can, but I can shut him down quicker!)