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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

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Relationships

Support thread for those in emotionally abusive relationships...coming of age:21

999 replies

foolonthehill · 04/05/2013 11:49

Am I being abused?

Verbal Abuse A wonderfully non-hysterical summary. If you're unsure, read the whole page and see if you're on it.
Emotional abuse from the same site as above
Emotional abuse a more heartfelt description
a check list Use this site for some concise diagnostic lists and support
Signs of Abuse & Control Useful check list
why financial abuse is domestic violenceAre you a free ride for a cocklodger, or supposed to act grateful for every penny you get for running the home?
Women's Aid: "What is Domestic Violence?" This is also, broadly, the Police definition.
20 signs you're with a controlling and/or abusive partner Exactly what it says on the tin


Books :

"Why Does He Do That?" by Lundy Bancroft - The eye-opener. Read this if you read nothing else.
"The Verbally Abusive Relationship" by Patricia Evans ? He wants power OVER you and gets angry when you prove not to be the dream woman who lives only in his head.
"The Verbally Abusive Man, Can He Change?" by Patricia Evans - Answer: Perhaps - ONLY IF he recognises HIS issues, and if you can be arsed to work through it. She gives explicit guidelines.
"Men who hate women and the women who love them" by Susan Forward. The author is a psychotherapist who realised her own marriage was abusive, so she's invested in helping you understand yourself just as much as helping you understand your abusive partner.
"The Emotionally Abusive Relationship: How to Stop Being Abused and How to Stop Abusing" by Beverley Engels - The principle is sound, if your partner isn't basically an arse, or disordered.
"Codependent No More : How to Stop Controlling Others and Start Caring for Yourself" by Melody Beattie - If you a rescuer, you're a co-dependent. It's a form of addiction! This book will help you.
But whatever you do, don't blame yourself for being Co-dependent!




Websites :

So, you're in love with a narcissist - Snarky, witty, angry, but also highly intelligent: very good for catharsis
Dr Irene's verbal abuse site - motherly advice to readers' write-ins from a caring psychotherapist; can be a pain to navigate but very validating stuff
Out of the fog - and now for the science bit! Clinical, dispassionate, and very informative website on the various forms of personality disorders and how they impact on family and intimate relationships.
Get your angries out ? You may not realise it yet, but you ARE angry. Find out in what unhealthy ways your anger is expressing itself. It has probably led you to staying in an unhealthy relationship.
Melanie Tonia Evans is a woman who turned her recovery from abuse into a business. A little bit "woo" and product placement-tastic, but does contain a lot of useful articles.
Love fraud - another site by one woman burned by an abusive marriage
You are not crazy - one woman's experience. She actually has recordings of her and her abusive partner having an argument, so you can hear what verbal abuse sounds like. A pain to navigate, but well worth it.
Baggage reclaim - Part advice column, part blog on the many forms of shitty relationships.
heart to heart a wealth of information and personal experiences drawn together in one place

what couples therapy does for abusers

If you find that he really wants to change
should I stay or should I go bonus materials this is a site containing the material for men who want to change?please don?t give him the link?print out the content for him to work through.

The Bill of Rights
bill of rights here is what you should expect as a starting point for your treatment in a relationship, as you will of course be treating others!!

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TieredConfusedMummy · 22/05/2013 09:13

Ugh just need to vent this morning, and FW has been up to his usual FWittery. On the positive side it's making me realise again that this is why I consider leaving. So onto the rant, our DD woke up a bit early this morning, she's ill and also had a bad dream I think. Anyway I went a got her, calmed her down and brought her into our bed. Well cue FW moaning and complaining he can't sleep and that he's got work in the morning. It's always all about him, how things effect him... it's sapping the life out of me, I have no real freedom, he has to now everything and everything revolves around him. All I do is worry about what he'll say, how I'll explain X, Y and Z. When I have any news I dread telling him, even if it's positive as I know he'll manage to bring me down Sad

I feel like I am a single mum anyway, but just with him to deal with and pacify on top.

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betterthanever · 22/05/2013 09:35

Having children is so difficult - my ex doesn't know what he is wishing for - he would be just the same if DS woke up and it interupted anything else that he was doing/wanted to do - selfish is the word - to then take it out of you, cruel - to not be concerned about DD - uncaring and selfish. I hope your day improves.

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CharlotteCollinsismovingon · 22/05/2013 12:20

TCM - nodding along to your post!

better, that all sounds horrible - your poor suffering boy. Really feel for you having to relive it all again.

The fasting's going better today, you'll all be pleased to know; he seems to be back on track :o It might be my encouragement actually, because I keep asking him if he's fasting before feeding myself. (Very naughty!!)

I do find it very funny, though, that when I prayed about the situation the other day, a Queen song came into my head and the words that really jumped out at me: "God knows I want to break free"!!! That's another thing I won't be mentioning to FW, my message from on high!!

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NotSoNervous · 22/05/2013 13:29

Hi not sure if I should be here. Been reading through some of the posts and some things I can relate to but a lot of stuff I can't. Things with me and DP have gone from great to terrible since we had DD 7m ago. His mother console him and interfers to no end and because I do things different I'm a bad mother and all the rest. DP will do anything to please her. W argue a lot but I can't say anything, whenever I try and put my side across all I get is how I'm twisting everything so he's the bad guy and manipulating the truth, I can't take responsibility for being wrong and just apologise I have to put it on him Hmm but he's never in the wrong just me.hes moods are terrible and constant but I'm not allowed to be moody otherwise I'm giving him a shit home life. He can do things that's not acceptable for me to do and if he's does something wrong and I'm moody he expects a text saying "I love you" to solve everything and when it doesn't its me causing the arguments then. He constantly puts me down about doing housework a particular way and however it's done isn't to a high enough standard. My house is 90% of the time tidy and its not dirty but its not enough. I've tried to change for him and I have to a point but I can't change no more. I don't know really why I'm posting this,

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NotSoNervous · 22/05/2013 13:56

I think I'm just thinking more into things and making everything seem worse then it is from reading mumsnet. Sorry to bother you ladies x

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ponygirlcurtis · 22/05/2013 13:57

Alice - I got my Lundy copy delivered to my mum's house. But I didn't tell her what it was, just said I hadn't wanted FW to see it as it was about anger management (she knew I was upset at his shouting etc).

Fi - how you doing today?

Breathe - I've had periods when i've just crashed - you can only keep going for so long. Hope you feel better today.

betterthannever - that's quite a strong reaction to the book from DS, do you know what's behind that? It sounds like he's afraid, almost. If he reacted like that with the nominated person, then at least it's not just you saying that he feels like that and not being believed. I really hope the judge sees through your FW. Sad

TCM am nodding also... poor DD, and poor you.

Charlotte GrinGrin Have a bacon butty, go on!!!! I bet he's eating in secret anyway. Love your message via Queen. Play that at top volume to him while eating a big slice of cake!

Notsonervous - are you ok, doesn't see like you finished your post? Take time to read the links in the OP, it does sound like your partner is being very difficult and manipulative. If you are unhappy, you don't have to stay. There can be a better life for you.

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Funnyfishface · 22/05/2013 14:25

I got my Lundy book delivered to home but I reckon I could leave it on the coffee table and he wouldn't bat an eyelid. If it was on the ipad he would be saying 'what are you reading?' Who are you chatting to?

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Funnyfishface · 22/05/2013 14:27

Tcm I'm also nodding along

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CharlotteCollinsismovingon · 22/05/2013 14:30

Notsonervous, not so fast! :o Don't go running away from here thinking you're making a fuss about nothing; from what you've said it sounds like you totally belong here. The confusion and self-doubt are par for the course when he's telling you what you should think and say and feel and when you should forgive and forget (all of which is very controlling) and has double standards so that his behaviour is beyond reproach and yours is usually beyond the pale (according to him, that is).

But it is all insidious and subtle and the realisation that something is very wrong creeps up on you gradually. Read the links at the top, but don't worry too much if a lot doesn't apply to you. Nobody's FW does all the things on the list! Lundy Bancroft's book is a real eye-opener - that told me my FW was a FW when none of the other links convinced me; then I returned to the other links and read them with new eyes, iyswim.

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foolonthehill · 22/05/2013 14:36

Notsonervous Hi. from reading your post I think you are in the right place. this is a place for you to write and explore your relationship and what is going on. we are not all the same but there are similarities...just because one person's trouble looks like this and yours looks like that does not mean you can't find encouragement and support here.

And readin your post :your DP seems to have issues with your freedom, his responsibility for himself and CONTROL/ENTITLEMENT...you are definitely in the right place to explore these things.

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AliceDoesntLiveHereAnymore · 22/05/2013 14:52

I will speak to my friend. H will definitely be angry if he sees that book.

He has been angry literally all day. He has reacted angrily to literally everything that's happened today.

On a more panicked note, I told the paed about him smacking our son a few months ago and leaving a handprint. Paed took details and seemed to listen a bit more this time. I'm still going to make an appointment for myself to see the GP though and get some counselling arranged. I need it. I hope I haven't just brought SS down on my head. I was very clear with her that H was not ever left alone with them. Ever.

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NotSoNervous · 22/05/2013 14:52

Thank you ladies Smile you make me teary being kind. I will read through the links again. I'm worried I'm looking to much into things but things have been getting slowly and slowly worse. I don't think he means to EA though, could this just be something that will settle down? I don't know. There has been a lot of other stuff to but some of it I think is just normal

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AliceDoesntLiveHereAnymore · 22/05/2013 14:58

I keep thinking that H can't possibly mean to EA, but then again, he's not trying very hard NOT to IYSWIM. We all have days where we are feeling grouchy but that doesn't mean you take it out on everyone else.

And the number of times I hear "so what you're saying is...." followed by a completely twisted and practically unrecognisable statement that is absolutely not what I've said. Hmm

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AliceDoesntLiveHereAnymore · 22/05/2013 15:04

I did notice last night I got a text from a friend (about meeting for coffee soon) and H sat and watched me for a few minutes. Then finally said "do you mind if I ask who that was?" And I said "does it matter? It's not important." He waited a few more minutes and said "well, I just want to know in case it affects me or something, you know." Hmm So I said "no, it doesn't affect you." And didn't say anything else. You could tell it was eating at him for ages. He was not happy. How did we reach this point? I've never seen him check my phone and tbh I don't actually think he would, but I could tell this was really making him frustrated.

I've asked him before when he got a text (while we were talking or doing something) "is it anything urgent?" so that if he has to answer it right away, I'll obviously wait for him to do so. But who it's from and what it's about? Not really fussed. It's not the school regarding the children and they don't text, they ring - and they ring me. It's not MIL ill or something, as she doesn't text. So I really don't care who it is.

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AliceDoesntLiveHereAnymore · 22/05/2013 18:20

Pardon me while I screeeeeeeeeeeeeeeaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaammmmmmmmmmmmmm!!! Off to wander a path... a less travelled one.

grrrrrrrrrrrrrr

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TheSilveryPussycat · 22/05/2013 18:39

You OK Alice?

I don't think mine knew what he was doing, really. His letters to my sol had an undercurrent of snide vitriol, which my sol could see as well as me so not just my paranoia! but he seemed genuinely bemused when in a v late conversation, after we had divorced and settled, but before he'd gone, I said his letters had been a bit nasty.

He is also delusional about my mh and our joint financial history, I know because I did the marital accounts for the settlement fight! and the mh, though not due to him at the start, all those years ago, was perpetuated by our relationship long after I had actually recovered from childhood stuff etc. and got a bit more undelying confidence.

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Funnyfishface · 22/05/2013 18:39

Notsonervous - I completely understand. When you write it down and read it back it becomes real. When we are in we don't see it as abuse. My husband is moody, sulky, controlling, etc etc. he throws things, swears, and nothing is good enough.
We are here to support each other. And although its horrible that others are going through the same shit as we are it's also comforting that it isn't in our heads.

Tonight my husband is ranting and raving. Mainly about the fact our 18 year old son has been out shopping today instead of collecting his car from the garage. So we collected the car and the whole way there h is swearing and saying how everyone takes the piss out if him. Used the c word.
I replied 'don't you get fed up of sulking and complaining'
His reply. It's ok for you. You take the fucking piss 2. I'm working my bollocks off blah blah blah.

He has now gone out and rang to apologise. So that's ok then!! Angry

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AliceDoesntLiveHereAnymore · 22/05/2013 18:43

Silvery - yes and no. I've vented separately to avoid outage.

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foolonthehill · 22/05/2013 18:50

my husband is not intentionally EA./..he learned it at his mother's knee, he is so selfish and entitled that it does not occur to him that someone else might matter, or think he is wrong, any element of standing up to him he interprets as ME controlling HIM...even now 18 months after separation when he has done the perp course, the anger management course and the longest individual counselling ...but he can still say "well if I'd known there would be consequences i WOULDN'T HAVE BEHAVED LIKE THAT" the same way he behaves now.

So they don;t have to intend to be like it...they just are like it...that is enough

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NotSoNervous · 22/05/2013 19:17

Silvery, I don't think he does know he's doing it or the things he says and does could be seen as it but thinks its just the way it is and that's it so tough.

Funnyfish it does seem more real when its wrote down and if I think about it as I'm reading what someone else has wrote I would be thinking EA. it feels like I'm being really extreme though saying that.

Foolonthehill you are right it is more then enough that just because they don't intended to be like that but they still are.

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foolonthehill · 22/05/2013 19:37

the truth is that it is not up to us to work out how they became like this, why they continue like this or whether there is a way to fix them...because it is their job. you may have spent many years trying to fix things and make it right...it doesn't work because it never will...they have to fix themselves and the truth is, mostly, they don't

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TieredConfusedMummy · 22/05/2013 19:44

Just wanted to add that I too don't think H is intentionally EA to me, but there are times when I have to wonder why he's done/said something. There have been times when it has felt like he has been deliberately toying with me and been trying to wind me up. When I do finally snap he will sit there with a grin on his face, like he's achieved what he wanted.

Tonight he has come home and tried to tell me I will be playing Game X on the computer tonight. I said no, as I have to revise for my exam, and suddenly I'm being in a mood with him, and he was only trying to be nice etc etc. He misses me, wants to spend time with me, and it's all about him, not what I need. Oh and how he was this morning is of course completely forgotten. No apology, no mention of it, nothing. Yet if I brought it up I'd then get 'your still in a mood about that?'.

I'm also so sick of him doing nothing to help me out. He's 30, and acts like a child. We went round his parents a while ago and he was told to serve his own desert (rare round there, they baby him), and he was asking his mum how to do it, he'd never done it before etc. I know it sounds petty, but he's worse than that at home. I want to be with an equal, not someone how acts like a giant child.

I am always battling with myself though, thinking that it may all be in my mind, and that maybe it's not as bad as I feel and that I should just put up with it Sad

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ColinCaterpillar · 22/05/2013 19:53

I think mine is intentionally abusive. Anything to upset me/get a reaction. Today has been the worst in a while, which considering he isn't with me and doesn't want me is quite something.

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foolonthehill · 22/05/2013 19:56

!! Colin !! I suspect you are right, and the total control freaks are obviously intentional

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CharlotteCollinsismovingon · 22/05/2013 20:03

Mine is unintentionally abusive, I'd say - it's just him. I got a long email from him today and felt a bit sorry for him, while thinking of what ?AF says about thinking of us like dogs (you care for it, want the best for it, but in the end it's just a dog, it doesn't sit up at the table with you etc). You can see FW thinking, "I always thought I knew what to do with my dog wife before, but suddenly she's not behaving the way she should. Wish she'd do as she's told."

He's quite pathetic, really. So blown over by my unexpected announcement (so it came two months after the last one and lots of long conversations about longstanding problems, so what? he thought we were really happy now), he's been asking, "Did I stay in bed too long on Saturday? Is that it? Did I say something critical?" Like I would end a marriage for that! Is he really so thick??

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