support thread for those in emotionally abusive relationships: 20

[foolonthehill]

Am I being abused?

Verbal Abuse A wonderfully non-hysterical summary. If you're unsure, read the whole page and see if you're on it.
Emotional abuse from the same site as above
Emotional abuse a more heartfelt description
a check list Use this site for some concise diagnostic lists and support
Signs of Abuse & Control Useful check list
why financial abuse is domestic violenceAre you a free ride for a cocklodger, or supposed to act grateful for every penny you get for running the home?
Women's Aid: "What is Domestic Violence?" This is also, broadly, the Police definition.
20 signs you're with a controlling and/or abusive partner Exactly what it says on the tin

Books :

"Why Does He Do That?" by Lundy Bancroft - The eye-opener. Read this if you read nothing else.
"The Verbally Abusive Relationship" by Patricia Evans ? He wants power OVER you and gets angry when you prove not to be the dream woman who lives only in his head.
"The Verbally Abusive Man, Can He Change?" by Patricia Evans - Answer: Perhaps - ONLY IF he recognises HIS issues, and if you can be arsed to work through it. She gives explicit guidelines.
"Men who hate women and the women who love them" by Susan Forward. The author is a psychotherapist who realised her own marriage was abusive, so she's invested in helping you understand yourself just as much as helping you understand your abusive partner.
"The Emotionally Abusive Relationship: How to Stop Being Abused and How to Stop Abusing" by Beverley Engels - The principle is sound, if your partner isn't basically an arse, or disordered.
"Codependent No More : How to Stop Controlling Others and Start Caring for Yourself" by Melody Beattie - If you a rescuer, you're a co-dependent. It's a form of addiction! This book will help you.
But whatever you do, don't blame yourself for being Co-dependent!

Websites :

So, you're in love with a narcissist - Snarky, witty, angry, but also highly intelligent: very good for catharsis
Dr Irene's verbal abuse site - motherly advice to readers' write-ins from a caring psychotherapist; can be a pain to navigate but very validating stuff
Out of the fog - and now for the science bit! Clinical, dispassionate, and very informative website on the various forms of personality disorders and how they impact on family and intimate relationships.
Get your angries out ? You may not realise it yet, but you ARE angry. Find out in what unhealthy ways your anger is expressing itself. It has probably led you to staying in an unhealthy relationship.
Melanie Tonia Evans is a woman who turned her recovery from abuse into a business. A little bit "woo" and product placement-tastic, but does contain a lot of useful articles.
Love fraud - another site by one woman burned by an abusive marriage
You are not crazy - one woman's experience. She actually has recordings of her and her abusive partner having an argument, so you can hear what verbal abuse sounds like. A pain to navigate, but well worth it.
Baggage reclaim - Part advice column, part blog on the many forms of shitty relationships.
heart to heart a wealth of information and personal experiences drawn together in one place

what couples therapy does for abusers

If you find that he really wants to change
should I stay or should I go bonus materials this is a site containing the material for men who want to change?please don?t give him the link?print out the content for him to work through.

The Bill of Rights
bill of rights here is what you should expect as a starting point for your treatment in a relationship, as you will of course be treating others!!

ooh! Can I join the kitchen utensils army? had big argument with nsdh this morning so could quite happily throw things at someone.

nini glad you managed a night out despite your FW's attempts to sabotage.

colin you are doing amazingly well (would wave pompoms if I wasn't currently brandishing kitchen implements )

ponygirl glad you managed a sleep and here's hoping the larger nappies make the difference

I've been feeling meh the last few days hence why I reacted to nsdh this morning. I ignore and ignore but as soon as I become ill or overly tired my FWittery-resistance falls and I respond

Having spent some time with nsdh's family over the last week has also added to the stress because I find myself wondering if I can just cut off the ones who are abusive and rude, or does that make me rude too?! My dearest and oldest RL friend thinks nsdh's family are mad and I'm entitled to cut ties. My dm thinks I'm probably in the wrong (regardless of the circumstance ) and yet I love her dearly . . .think that's possibly one of the reasons I ended up in an EA relationship.

Colin you are probably right about the power but every time I feel like that he seems to manage to get someone/anyone to power over me.
Butterfly you sound like I feel and I don't actually have to face FW tomorrow. Hope contact goes ok.
Minimising it, I just try to minimise the time I think about it but the barrage of correspondence I have had this last three weeks it just unimaginable. Court even phoned my sol this week - all ok really that bit but just more time to sort and think about it. Looks like it is heading to a final hearing, cross examination the lot...how much fun with that be.. preping and not wanting to let DS and everyone who has supported me down. I will know more next week, clock ticking down to that so need to switch off the thoughts for a bit really and just pick the files back up the night before.
Fairy I can see you folk in hand.. you look great
I have tried to control anger feelings by not letting him reduce me to his level, it turned quickly into anxiety - can't decide which is worse I guess the emotion has to come out some way.. I would like another please body/soul/mind.. whatever controls this.

healthier to feel the anger, and then vent it (I throw cushions to floor, or bits of paper as hard as I can! very pathetic but usually works out the anger. unfortunately its all 3 ! I've put in for complete overhaul ...

Hmm, I hadn't thought of anxiety as anger turned inwards. I never, I mean, never used to be anxious before. But then I didn't often feel angry either. I am trying to remember with my mum who has behaved appallingly at various points how I felt. Churned up, but more the incessant going over things in your head. Not this anxious feeling which seems to start of its own accord like clockwork at a certain time of the week! See I think the anxiety is now fear of confrontation and another fear I am not even going to type. Rationally I don't think I believe the latter will happen but it is there.

better that all sounds hugely stressful. The only good thing is that it will soon be over with hopefully the outcome you want.

I really want one of those brightly coloured whisks, not sure what they are made of.

Certainly, my depression was anger turned inwards.

Wishing everyone who has FWittery to deal with over the weekend strength and groundedness. Hope to catch up a bit better soon.

That's a really interesting way of looking at it, Silvery, the idea that depression in our situation of FWittery can be anger turned inwards. I also don't 'do' anger, butterfly, I don't know what to do with it so makes sense I would turn it inwards instead of expressing it in a healthy way.

Not been on tonight (a conscious effort to lie on the sofa and chill out rather than sit at the table on my computer), but just wanted to send you all good vibes for the weekend, lots of strength and support. Will be thinking of you all. xx

Hello all,

Just got in from great night out with friends

I love the kitchen implement army Mine's a potato peeler (left hand) and rolling pin (right) and a rose between my teeth! Ooo Arrrrr

Depression = anger turned inwards makes perfect sense. And us not being comfortable with feeling/showing/acting on outrage does too. I guess that's what the fws latched onto But now we're the kitchen Implement Army the fws are running for the hills (and far away hopefully!)

Well, if I ever got annoyed and contradicted or argued, he would accuse me of being aggressive. No, I just don't agree!

Oh, you know, it is true, I mentally feel much better generally, until the anxiety alarm starts around 24-48 hours before contact.

breathe glad you had a good night out, and pony a good night in.

Oh yes, butterfly - when I disagreed with him, I was being 'argumentative'. And he did accuse me of being abusive a couple of times too, which was so laughable but still managed to hurt.

Glad you had a good night, Breathe. We're not so much Dumbledore's Army, more Delia's Army! (Plus, I really did buy a whisk yesterday...)

Well. DS2 was fantastic last night and didn't wake at all. Unfortunately, I was awake for over an hour in the middle of the night due to some banging and shouting in the downstairs lobby of the flat.

I was quite scared, and worried - it was obviously a girl trying to get into one of the ground floor flats, banging and shouting (and sometimes crying). I wanted to go and see, go and help, but was scared. And with two kids in the flat (and just me), I thought I should be sensible and not potentially open myself up to trouble - I didn't know if she was drunk, angry, or what. So instead I lay there with my heart pounding for ages, not able to get back to sleep even after the banging had stopped. But I was worried that it was a DV situation - I see them everywhere now, I suspect every ordinary-looking man, wonder if they are being abusive to their wives. I caught a glimpse of a man in the flat opposite and could've sworn he had his hands round his wife's throat. But I blinked and looked back, and the blind had been pulled down. Now I find myself watching that window (like James Stewart in Rear Window) to see if I can see anything to back up my feeling.

The sun in shining here, am going to get out and about with DS1 this afternoon. Hope you all have a good day, there had better be no FWitting, or they are in for the whisking of their lives, I can tell you!

pony Maybe put the non emergency number of the police in your phone? Though I don't know if it is helpful or not for police to be called. The only similar situation I have been in was when there was an altercation outside a hotel room I was in between a man and a woman in the middle of the night. I was really worried that she was in danger but fortunately one of the male guests in another room shouted out the window for him to leave her alone and that he ha called the police. It is a horrible feeling when you do not know what to do.

I got Mr Nice again but without going into details, Mr Nice who is ignoring solicitor's request on certain matters, or at least gving the impression of doing so.
A new type of nonsense to deal with. Why can life not be simple?

It's funny, butterfly, but I only thought of calling the police afterwards, when I'd woken up this morning and was thinking about it! ,slaps head with palm of hand> I think it brought a lot of my own fear stuff back, from when I was in bad situations with FW and scared, I just wanted to hide and for it all to be over, would do anything, say anything just for it to be over. Calling the police just never came to my mind! I guess the fact that my instinct last night was to smooth things over and just for it all to stop (whatever the problem was) speaks volumes about me and what I automatically do in these kind of situations.

It's funny how Mr Nice is still really Mr Nasty (but just with a smarter jacket on, and he somehow thinks he's being so different). Hope he's just bluffing you. Ignore, ignore, ignore. Let him do whatever it is he thinks he's doing, deal with him through your solicitor only.

I understand your response pony, there are situations where I would react in the same way. Chances are it won't happen again, but if you have the number then you have an option to call, which makes you feel safer too. Hope you are okay this morning.
Enjoy the sunshine. I am supposed to be using the time to clean the house but haven't got beyond Costa and got home yet.

Oh and Mr Nice is definitely a strategy.

Thanks butterfly - I feel fine, was a little nervous going past that flat this morning, but more surprised at my own scared reaction. I think if it did happen again (no reason to imagine it will, it's the first time in nearly 9 months it's happened), I'll be a bit more prepared and would call 101 I think.

Being in Costa in no bad thing either better than cleaning! And if you can see right through his Mr Nice act, then at least that takes some of his power away - he relies on you being taken in by it. Enjoy your day, I've got a bit of cleaning to do first too

oh yes him butterfly Mr Nice stonewaller notsonice

I'm not surprised you didn't consider calling the police Pony although you knew it was someone else, I completely get the way the loud shouting and banging made you feel. It makes most ladies feel like that I think, but we have another altogether shocking layer over the top that can make it very difficult for us to do anything except cope with our overwhelming fears and keeping us and our dc safe. You never know now tho, having travelled that experienceyou will probably feel differently another time.

I remember when I lived in another city, I was woken one night by similar, there was a terrible din and really loud banging, girl shouting.

My flat mate and I went to investigate [the next morning!] the door was off its hinges! and the girl was out cold inside (blind drunk). She'd been out with the cast of corrie and got completely blasted on champagne cocktails and couldn't find her key, so kicked the door in!!!!!!

[horrendous name dropper]

Holy Moly Fi! I don't think I could kick a door in when sober, much less when stumbling blind drunk!

I know! I looked at her, and looked at the door, and just dumbfounded! - p'raps she was sporting a crow-bar in her h/bag!

Just a quick visit to say hello. I will have to catch up on reading until this evening while H is at work, but just wanted to check in.

We're in a holding pattern right now. H has actually made an effort over the last few days, but then was not brilliant this morning. At least it wasn't hugely over the top like it normally is, but still aggravating. I will admit it's the first time I've seen him manage a couple days though.

Ah Pony I so understand the fear and consequent freezing- not in the least bit surprising given our experiences. Hopefully it was 'just' (IYSWIM) a drunken argument rather than dv - the noise I mean. Dv tends to be quiet and hidden IME though I'm sure there are loads of versions sadly

I snorted at the Corrie cohort's drunken rampage

Saw my counsellor- SO helpful because at the mo I'm getting heavy guilt trips from fw- that I'm the one destroying kids' childhoods and affecting the rest of their lives. FFS. Maybe he should consider that HIS actions led us here. But my inherent sense of guilt makes me feel wobbly.

Argh, lost a post...

Breathe, really glad your counselling was helpful. I think the guilt-trips are inevitable - it's all he has left, he wants to hurt you and he knows how. He knows that you have some inherent guilt in this area. So all he has to do is make a few choice comments and you'll do the rest! It's a very easy way for him.

Alice, glad you've had some respite for a few days (although, unfortunately, that's all it'll be). They can seem to sense it, sniff it, when there's a seachange, and they change tactics/finally put in the effort that you've been begging for all this time.

I saw FW tonight, and am a bit grrrrr at myself. He was all lovely and nice and chatty again, which throws me off balance and makes me gabble as if we're friends ffs. So I said things and talked about things I had no intention of talking to him about - telling him I was thinking about nursery for DS2, etc. nothing major, but am still a bit grrr that all it takes is a wee bit of niceness and I'm an open book again.
Well seeing his girlfriend wasn't there though, I normally get the 15-sec treatment when she is!!

But on a happier note, had a lovely afternoon taking DS1 to the park.

For me I have to rehearse what i "would do if" so that I can actually act and not be frozen solid...

pony that is a kind of normal, natural reactiom though, isn't it? To have a chat with the other parent about plans and concerns. It is only because of the long shadow of fuckwittery that you feel wary of giving too much of yourself away. It was all nicey-nicey here too and reflecting on it, I feel like I am being played, like if he is nice then I am too scared to challenge him because I don't want confrontation, intimidation and harrassment again. We have had two weeks of peace, but really nothing is resolved and in actuality, he is trying to chip away at one boundary I have established and apparently ignoring everything else. So the niceness is a veneer and I so far am taking the easy option of not calling him on it because I don't want the sickening anxiety. Sigh. The dynamic is not different, it is just more at a distance and less of it. Double sigh. Though the boundary chipping did not work. Not comfortable with giving more details on here.

breathe glad the counselling went well. I got the breaking apart a family stufff to but I don't really feel guilty. I could not have gone on and my response was that it was more important to me to e a good mother.

Alice respite is good but hopefully you will be spared too much aggravation in the next few days.

Oh well, exhausted again. I keep havimg these great ideas of what I will do in the evenings and right now, I just want to sleep.

fool frozen solid is a good way of describing it but I tend to then take refuge in pleasantries because of the desire to avoid confrontation. Argh need to work on assertiveness without being scared. Got the Dickson book, btw, so there is hope!

Checking in with my final update as my situation reached its conclusion today and thought I would update

On Friday FW asked if we could go for a drink. I agrees . He then says he's running an hour late. I say I'm not waiting and let's leave it. He tells me I'm a stubborn bitch. I decide I do want a drink so go to my favourite bar and order one. He rings and asks where I am and when I tell him he goes ape and comes in. He tells me I must leave. That it's behaviour like this that's why he's not sure. He says can we go elsewhere to talk, so we do. He tells me that he wants to talk properly on Sunday or Monday and that if I hadn't gone for that drink, he'd have proposed. He insists on walking me to the station so he can be sure I haven't gone out. Says its weird but it is because he loves me. Texts to say he loves me, how attractive and strong I am. Says we haven't broken up.

I think nothing. Confused. Then this morning I decide to go to yoga and then feeling all energised, decide to have a gym session. Here is the decision that changed my life,...I stop off to get a takeaway coffee. This means that when I walk past the pub on my way home, who do I see in the window but FW with a woman. I clock him and he comes out to explain she's just a friend. The fish wife in me goes to get her version - he introduces me as his ex and that we broke up a month ago!! She says 'just leave it, love' I say I'm sure you're lovely but you should know it costs a lot to keep him and rattled off the list. I leave. A couple of nasty calls after - I text lots and he says I've ruined his chance of happiness and that she left. He says he's going to his mums ( lie). His phone is off now and I know he's shagging this woman. I feel blue.

A mutual friend says he tried it on with her and he told her he has four women on the go. Considering I've been gaslit about this and been demonised for lack of trust, I'm really effed off about it.

So that's the end.