support thread for those in emotionally abusive relationships: 20

[foolonthehill]

Am I being abused?

Verbal Abuse A wonderfully non-hysterical summary. If you're unsure, read the whole page and see if you're on it.
Emotional abuse from the same site as above
Emotional abuse a more heartfelt description
a check list Use this site for some concise diagnostic lists and support
Signs of Abuse & Control Useful check list
why financial abuse is domestic violenceAre you a free ride for a cocklodger, or supposed to act grateful for every penny you get for running the home?
Women's Aid: "What is Domestic Violence?" This is also, broadly, the Police definition.
20 signs you're with a controlling and/or abusive partner Exactly what it says on the tin

Books :

"Why Does He Do That?" by Lundy Bancroft - The eye-opener. Read this if you read nothing else.
"The Verbally Abusive Relationship" by Patricia Evans ? He wants power OVER you and gets angry when you prove not to be the dream woman who lives only in his head.
"The Verbally Abusive Man, Can He Change?" by Patricia Evans - Answer: Perhaps - ONLY IF he recognises HIS issues, and if you can be arsed to work through it. She gives explicit guidelines.
"Men who hate women and the women who love them" by Susan Forward. The author is a psychotherapist who realised her own marriage was abusive, so she's invested in helping you understand yourself just as much as helping you understand your abusive partner.
"The Emotionally Abusive Relationship: How to Stop Being Abused and How to Stop Abusing" by Beverley Engels - The principle is sound, if your partner isn't basically an arse, or disordered.
"Codependent No More : How to Stop Controlling Others and Start Caring for Yourself" by Melody Beattie - If you a rescuer, you're a co-dependent. It's a form of addiction! This book will help you.
But whatever you do, don't blame yourself for being Co-dependent!

Websites :

So, you're in love with a narcissist - Snarky, witty, angry, but also highly intelligent: very good for catharsis
Dr Irene's verbal abuse site - motherly advice to readers' write-ins from a caring psychotherapist; can be a pain to navigate but very validating stuff
Out of the fog - and now for the science bit! Clinical, dispassionate, and very informative website on the various forms of personality disorders and how they impact on family and intimate relationships.
Get your angries out ? You may not realise it yet, but you ARE angry. Find out in what unhealthy ways your anger is expressing itself. It has probably led you to staying in an unhealthy relationship.
Melanie Tonia Evans is a woman who turned her recovery from abuse into a business. A little bit "woo" and product placement-tastic, but does contain a lot of useful articles.
Love fraud - another site by one woman burned by an abusive marriage
You are not crazy - one woman's experience. She actually has recordings of her and her abusive partner having an argument, so you can hear what verbal abuse sounds like. A pain to navigate, but well worth it.
Baggage reclaim - Part advice column, part blog on the many forms of shitty relationships.
heart to heart a wealth of information and personal experiences drawn together in one place

what couples therapy does for abusers

If you find that he really wants to change
should I stay or should I go bonus materials this is a site containing the material for men who want to change?please don?t give him the link?print out the content for him to work through.

The Bill of Rights
bill of rights here is what you should expect as a starting point for your treatment in a relationship, as you will of course be treating others!!

Sounds to me that he wants you to hear all that, probably say to yourself that he hasn't and therefore can't ACTUALLY be an abuser I'd say Charlotte. Unless he did any of those things? I think it's more mind games to fog your mind and claw his way back in.

I just had a look at the Respect website Charlotte. Can't link as on phone, but if you look at the briefing papers, one of the ones towards the bottom is a guide to who is doing what to whom. It is downloadable as a pdf. The first few pages are quite clear about the range of things which constitute abuse beyond physical violence and there is also a page on the difference between controlling and unkind behaviour. It is not the fullest document, but enough there to suggest a wider definition of abuse than those reported comments suggest.

But it does raise an interesting question. EA can be quite subtle, and doesn't have obvious physical signs, so what questions would you ask over the phone? Especially if the perpetrator is so entitled, they just see their behavior as normal. The one feeling scared and anxious is the victim, not them.

Or he could have heard what he wanted to hear, if that makes sense!

match I have felt sad at every positive step that should have made me happy. I think it's because it makes leaving even more real. It means that the fantasy that it might be ok in the end is forever gone. But I've found each time I've lived with each step (last one for me was going PT) that within a few weeks I have gradually found peace with each step. Good luck

dilllie that's great news. I'm so pleased your DD has taken it well. That must make things so much easier. Bring on the princess beds :)

colin - keep going. Agree with others. So typical FW to now be ranting that you are not doing as he said!

charlotte I still love my H too. If he promised to change and I actually believed him then I'd have him back in a heartbeat. the problem is i don't really believe that he will change and I know deep down that if I do have him back I'll just end up in this situation another x number of months down the line. So I think, keep your eyes open and your guard up a little bit. It needs to be a sustained improvement to actually mean anything.

butterfly I agree. My FW would never ever think he is an abuser. Although his comments would shock the average person to him he is being normal and reasonable and helpful. i.e telling me I look fat and ugly in an outfit is actually a helpful thing as he is stopping me from going out looking so bad. A big problem with EA is that it is so vague and each individual comment/event in isolation probably isn't abusive but the cumulation of months and years of these comments is. And it's how the comments/events make the victim feel that is the biggest issue.

Dillie am so pleased for you. He sounds like he was a FW about it quelle surprise, but thank goodness he wasn't when you told your DD.

Charlotte - him lying to you about ringing Respect and about the questions he was asked is EA right there. And yes, I think he has lied about ringing them. And even if not, what he's saying is: you are making a mountain out of a molehill, even an abuse charity thinks so.

Why not ring Respect for yourself? I emailed them initially, just telling them what had happened in our relationship and said I'd left and did they think he could change. A lovely person emailed back a very sensitive and understanding email (although basically saying - it's unlikely he'll change). I also rang their hotline at one point too. They were extremely helpful. What have you got to lose by contacting them yourself? My Fw has never been arrseted, has never technically hit me, has never had the police called out to him.

Yes, I agree with the just being back at square one however many months down the line. I have probably said this before but it was far easier to see it when he started on dd, but still that probably took too long.
Dillie all the best with the move and starting anew. I hope the fwittery keeps to a minimum.

Match sadness is normal I think for the dreams which have gone. No-one sets out to get divorced.

And there is the whole thing of thinking you have found your life partner and being wrong. I mean, I was very wrong. And sorry off to a tangent about me again, I kind of also realise I am going to be single for a very long time because I can't be that wrong again for my own mental wellbeing and because dcs only have one childhood. So there is the sadness that it wasn't different. Though I increasingly can't see how it could have been, all things considered.

Urgh. I am very tired tonight so will probably make little sense if I don't get my chores done and go to bed.

Sorry, the bit about being back at square one was for bounty

Agree re calling Respect yourself charlotte and with pony's assessment of the comments. Has he offered any suggestions for change? Achievable believable ones with measurable outcomes?

pleased to hear your news Match, sorry its bringing sadnesses for the loss of your relationship, but its good to grieve it, and get it behind you? Those hopes and dreams you now have to let go of....

The FW has done lots of lying about stuff like that Charlotte if thats helps, so from my experiences with him, I wouldn't believe anything; it does just happen to all sound extremely unlikely too! As a FWs view is to tell you he was asked only the things he didn't do couldn't get away with

I found this, it seemed pertinent to some of the posts recently about separating and the bonding that might have happened. So regardless of love, dah de dah... the bonding is something that happens with years together, with love-making, with dealing with stresses together!!! so the last one especiall in our situations, trying to continually overcome catastrophic stresses, this:

Second. the survivor can come to find that it can be almost impossible to relate to anyone, even family or old friends, except superficially. There is a biological craving for intensity that no normal relationship will satisfy. This provides a feeling of being totally alone, and totally empty. At first, only going back to the primary aggressor can overcome it. It would be normal in this state to believe that something is horribly wrong with leaving (even if it seems equally true that something is horribly wrong with staying. If it can be understood that abstinence from unnatural intensity will eventually restore normal relating capacity, the period of distress can be better endured.

being specifically about the difficulty in separating that bond, due to the constant high intensity living on eggshells/explosions that normal life has an unreal sense and what do normal people do, etc.
Its from the original Abuse and Relationships site I linked to, I think some pages back.

apparently, getting over normal relationship, one month for each year, abusive one, go NC then get support! or whichever way around you can get it! but it seems highly recommended to keep writing, to yourself [diary] or to others, liek here .

to all... now off to bed, oh been dreaming of this all day.. to lie down xxx

I can't believe how normal they think they are.

I'm doing quite well tonight. I haven't texted - he's asked to meet tomorrow (he will want something) but I can't as I have meetings. I have replied that I can't. I still think this is an achievement as it was curt but polite, didn't involve any swear words, no begging and has meant a peaceful evening free from abusive texts (which would have happened if I hadn't answered).

Have spent all evening on the phone to friends and not raised the subject of FW and my Internet food shop arrived so, happy days. I hope I can keep this positivity up. I can't believe how knackered I feel though. Drained and headachey.

Best wishes to all x

Oh that is brilliant Colin. One day at a time

Fairyfi, thank you for that post about the intensity. That's helped me understand my feelings a bit more. I think this is spot on, the drama of it all, the bond. FW and I have previously cast ourselves as some great love. It's not. I think all these so called notorious couples we hold up as examples of love stories - Romeo and Juliet, Taylor and Burton types are abusive or dysfunctional. I need some boring low key functional role models. None in my family though!

colin - keep talking to your friends and not to your FW. Keeping busy is good. The drained feeling will get better.

fi it makes sense about finding normal relationships lacking in intensity after life with a FW and living at such high stress levels. But I'm sure we can achieve it.

Also makes sense about the month per year rule being for getting over normal relationships not abusive ones. Otherwise that would make me supposedly ready to date again in a year. And that is never going to happen. It seems about a million years too soon.

ooh I'd not noticed the

Yes, I would be ready to date again in the summer which is not going to happen. I can't see it ever happening, which is okay. I have lots to be getting on with.

from me too.

Wow, Fi, I really need to read that site properly. What you've quoted there about the intensity really resonates. That would make a lot of sense for the difficulty I am having in adjusting to 'normal' life now, everything just feels 'blaaaaaaaah'.

If it's one year for every month, looking at it that we didn't 'properly' break up till December last year - I would have been ready for dating back in March!!!!

Although, maybe that explains my weird horny dreams. I am obviously ready!!!! not

Ooh just about to read through and catch up when I spotted the - that's so sweet! I had to give him a whirl... Right back to reading tee hee

I had to miss fp because of work tonight. Found myself feeling very flat and down, I feel as though I've let myself down, though it was unavoidable

Dillie brilliant news! And I'm so glad he kept his fwittery low level.

High intensity / famously doomed couples - yyyy. I think all the centuries of ballads, tragedies, and mills and boon type stories have really stuffed women. But also growing up with high drama sets the pattern (in my case anyway!).

I thought the was a horse with his tongue stuck out when I first saw it, forgot it was St George's day!

Colin hey well done, you are doing amazingly well

charlotte I am also glad you are having some happiness and agree with others re keeping your ears and eyes open at the same time. Good luck with FP.

Pony ha ha re the weird dreams - anyone in particular not SC I hope

- and I can too

Breathe - SC, arf! That made me laugh. No, not SC. Although, lots of family/friends have now seen me & 'new' eyebrows, and they know the SC comment story, and not one of them has told me I look nice, and more important, not like SC. So, it's official - I obviously do look like SC and everyone's too embarrassed to tell me!

Sorry you are feeling flat and down after missing FP. Sending you many, many hugs. I know you know you haven't let yourself down, but am telling you it again anyway.

Thank you pony

Oh, and I am very sure you DON'T look like SC

Fi how're you feeling?

I hope it's not one year for every month or I'd never get there. Even at 1 month per year,that would be well into 2015.

But perhaps I should be counting from May 2009 when I first looked into divorce before bottling it and giving it one last long go

silver, I am not sure many people would get there if it was one year per month, that would put me at 72 years. Which is what I feel like but unfortunately I don't think I have that many years on this planet left.

Though functioning drunk ex did say he would marry me in his next life, so maybe that would be a way around it. Just add another life on. Though joking aside, I do think I have missed the boat for happily ever after courtship, buy a house, settle down and be happy coupledom.

I did read the one month for every year thing and it makes sense that it would be different for abusive relationships. Am definitely going to read that website properly.