Support thread for those in emotionally abusive relationships: 14

[foolonthehill]

Am I being abused?

Verbal Abuse A wonderfully non-hysterical summary. If you're unsure, read the whole page and see if you're on it.
Emotional abuse from the same site as above
Emotional abuse a more heartfelt description
a check list Use this site for some concise diagnostic lists and support
Signs of Abuse & Control Useful check list
why financial abuse is domestic violenceAre you a free ride for a cocklodger, or supposed to act grateful for every penny you get for running the home?
Women's Aid: "What is Domestic Violence?" This is also, broadly, the Police definition.
20 signs you're with a controlling and/or abusive partner Exactly what it says on the tin

Books :

"Why Does He Do That?" by Lundy Bancroft - The eye-opener. Read this if you read nothing else.
"The Verbally Abusive Relationship" by Patricia Evans ? He wants power OVER you and gets angry when you prove not to be the dream woman who lives only in his head.
"The Verbally Abusive Man, Can He Change?" by Patricia Evans - Answer: Perhaps - ONLY IF he recognises HIS issues, and if you can be arsed to work through it. She gives explicit guidelines.
"Men who hate women and the women who love them" by Susan Forward. The author is a psychotherapist who realised her own marriage was abusive, so she's invested in helping you understand yourself just as much as helping you understand your abusive partner.
"The Emotionally Abusive Relationship: How to Stop Being Abused and How to Stop Abusing" by Beverley Engels - The principle is sound, if your partner isn't basically an arse, or disordered.
"Codependent No More : How to Stop Controlling Others and Start Caring for Yourself" by Melody Beattie - If you a rescuer, you're a co-dependent. It's a form of addiction! This book will help you.
But whatever you do, don't blame yourself for being Co-dependent!

Websites :

So, you're in love with a narcissist - Snarky, witty, angry, but also highly intelligent: very good for catharsis
Dr Irene's verbal abuse site - motherly advice to readers' write-ins from a caring psychotherapist; can be a pain to navigate but very validating stuff
Out of the fog - and now for the science bit! Clinical, dispassionate, and very informative website on the various forms of personality disorders and how they impact on family and intimate relationships.
Get your angries out ? You may not realise it yet, but you ARE angry. Find out in what unhealthy ways your anger is expressing itself. It has probably led you to staying in an unhealthy relationship.
Melanie Tonia Evans is a woman who turned her recovery from abuse into a business. A little bit "woo" and product placement-tastic, but does contain a lot of useful articles.
Love fraud - another site by one woman burned by an abusive marriage
You are not crazy - one woman's experience. She actually has recordings of her and her abusive partner having an argument, so you can hear what verbal abuse sounds like. A pain to navigate, but well worth it.
Baggage reclaim - Part advice column, part blog on the many forms of shitty relationships.
heart to heart a wealth of information and personal experiences drawn together in one place

what couples therapy does for abusers

If you find that he really wants to change
should I stay or should I go bonus materials this is a site containing the material for men who want to change?please don?t give him the link?print out the content for him to work through.

The Bill of Rights
bill of rights here is what you should expect as a starting point for your treatment in a relationship, as you will of course be treating others!!

Even with Mr Do Nothing, it was scary standing up to him - but in my case I also knew that whatever he said, he had said worse before. I was careful not to let much slip, as I knew he would twist it.

The scariness got less and less, to be replaced with a kind of objective admiration of the way he operated...

But mine was not violent - tho I had washing basket across door at first, just in case - and DD on the premises most nights.

Oh and a friend told me that in the past she had admired ExFW for doing what he had done - given up work as I couldn't care for kids - which is a total pack of lies! She believes my account, I think

FW and I have many mutual friends, a few are much closer to me than to him, and have put up with my rants. I have decided that if people wish to remain friends with him, then it is up to them to base their friendship on their own interacts with FW. I am quite comfortable with that.

Morning all.

Fi, hope you're feeling ok this morning.

Silver - that's a good plan re mutual friends. We, luckily, do not have any - because FW doesn't actually have any friends, genuinely. When we got married, it was just family on his side (and not much of that, either). Tells you something, no?

I am feeling ok this morning - no, I feel better than that. I had the bed to myself for the first time in many nights, so I slept well, and DS2 only woke once (I think), and then he slept in till 8.30am!!!! And so did I, so it was a bit of a scramble to get him ready for FW coming at 9.30am...
And seeing FW was fine, we were both very normal and civil to each other, he offered to buy me a new phone (he has been using my new phone for the last year). I declined, because that doesn't sit well with me, but maybe I should've said yes please! And he dropped off another 7 enormous bags of my stuff.
And despite the fact that I still feel a bit conflicted about him going through my stuff to pack it up, I've decided to let him. He did jack shit towards helping me pack up my house when we moved. He kept refusing to pack stuff, like my spare tupperware and various photo frames and ornaments, saying he 'wasn't having all this clutter in his house' (ie, the house we were buying together), so in the end I asked him to stop. But he was rubbish at packing up his own house, so I did most of that for him.
So, crack on, I say, saves me doing it all. Now, I'm off to open the large tube of mini-Rolos I found in one of the bags - from last year's Christmas, but chocolate is chocolate!

I've just been reading a thread where the OP is just coming to terms with EA, and now she's discovered there's an OW. It's "just" flirtation, but even an emotional affair is a dealbreaker for her, it seems, so she's at a turning point. I'm really impressed by that, because 18 months ago I discovered texts on H's phone which he dismissed as "just flirtation" and I accepted it. Had a few strops about it every few months or so for a while, otherwise nothing. Which probably said to him that it was ok, I wasn't going to make a big deal of it. He was her boss and when she left, she caused chaos for the organisation. Because I was scared, or because I was a normal, feeling, humane person seeing my h stressed and upset, I didn't point out to him at the time that he deserved everything his organisation (and some personal attacks, I think) got for his treatment of her.

Of course, I couldn't make a big fuss of the flirtation, because "that's just how he is". Before we were married, he regularly upset me (but wouldn't believe it) by flirting with a teenage friend of ours and her mother. This mother was one person who said how suited we were to each other and pressured the marriage question from early days. As an older woman, she had a good deal of influence with me. Of course, she probably didn't realise that H never treated me with the affection that he showed them while he was at their house.

As you can see, I'm having one of those days of unwelcome clarity, and I'm alternating between metaphorical headbashing at my own stupidity and renewed disbelief at what an utter arse he is (can't really berate myself for having higher expectations of people's goodness than he turned out to have, can I? iyswim).

Last few hours of freedom. He's back late afternoon...

oh Charlotte. im thinking of you. just think, you are not going to have to put up with this much longer. i found the last few weeks to before i left quite hard... everytime things went ok i totally second guessed myself thinking we could work it out. always remember the actual facts, what has went on, the notes youve mentally been keeping and in here too. you know what has lead you to this thinking despite how things go. and then there was the times when i thought that is IT im leaving RIGHT now - when things happened - you saw it square in the face - and you are in a much stronger position to see it for what it is now, but its so hard when you are living in it. i will be thinking of you. you seem to deal with things so much more rationally than i do though.

im really finding things rough at the minute. i really don't know what to do. he is meant to be coming into my house, a few hours on christmas morning, so neither of us has to be away from dd on christmas day. how is this going to work? im terrified! after the way he swears at me i just want to cut him off completely except give contact as and when needed, but if i do that then i have to forego a christmas day in the future. which i wil also find unbearable. do you think the best thing for me to do is put the arguments behind me, and for special occasions such as christmas day, make that special effort with him and try to make it work, and for the rest of the time have all the boundaries in place. its so confusing. how can i be all happy and cheerful and joyful to someone who is telling me im sick one minute, to F myself, and who i am really strugging not to hate. im trying to constantly forgive and its hard. i think thats what ill have to do for dds sake. please help! and ive lost my house phone - i wanted a chat with WA about legal advice, and can't afford to ring from my mobile. local offices aren't answering. its one of those days.

Maybe I deal with things rationally because I've buried my emotions so well? I've been in this for 13 years, gradually shutting down, maybe?

Sorry about the phone problems, on top of everything else! I think you would be well within your rights to change the arrangements for Christmas Day, since he cannot (or will not) control his mouth. He could take her for a couple of hours on the day? Will there be anyone else with you who can see him to hand over so you don't have to?

Thinking well into the future, if you "lose" a Christmas Day with her, you just celebrate on Boxing Day. (Plenty of people in the world do, anyway!) And what a lucky dd then - two Christmas Days!

well you are going to get your life back misscharlotte you are going to be restored double - thats 26 years of joy coming to you.

i just don't think i could face not having christmas day with dd...i know im not being helpful. mum has offered now to come up for those couple of hours on christmas morning so i don't have to be on my own with him, so that is something at least. feel bad for her though, but she said she doesn't mind. then we will go to her house.

Charlotte, am thinking of you today. I think it's going to be hard for to readjust to him being back, with all the thinking and decision-making you have been doing recently. It could be quite bumpy for you. Take it easy on yourself.

jangle, here's my advice, for what it's worth. Have Christmas Day with DD yourself. If he wants to have her for a couple of hours, he picks her up and takes her to his place (having someone there for pick-up/drop-off is a good idea). Please do not continue having him in your house, or you are giving him leave to keep on treating you badly (because even when he does, you still let him back in). Draw your line. If you don't it's going to make you ill.
But I'm afraid that being without your DD on Christmas day probably will happen at some point. It's horrible to think about, but try not to make decisions like letting him into your home on Christmas Day thinking it will somehow prevent it from happening in the future. You need to think of this year, of DD's needs first, and yours second. Your husband's needs don't come into it.
I think you need to say to him that as a result of how he is behaving towards you, you don't want him in the house Christmas Day. Do that for yourself.

thank pony. im thinking about everything...its all so hard. i do not want him in the house on christmas. but i can't bear to be without dd. i know what you are saying is right. i am mulling it all over. thanks so much for support

well I think I can post an encouragement to all on here!!!!! yay! take heart..

It was VERY tough today, and had been having bad dreams, etc, in expectation of.. but (and get this!!!) - NO SHAKING.... ATALL!

Keep going girls... everything changes, nothing stays the same (latest mantra - off to ohmmmmmm.....) - big smiles.

jangles would you mum be happy for you to leave them whilst you go out and visit a friend, or have a relaxing walk, just do something else so you don't have to see him?

I know jangle, it feels impossibly hard sometimes. You feel ripped in two by the thought of being away from them.

I do speak from some experience in this, in that I've been separated from DS1's dad for 5.5years, so this year will be my third Christmas without him. I wont lie, the first year was harder than I can say. (It was made worse by other factors though - I couldn't go back to Scotland for Christmas, as my ex was working boxing day so therefore was bringing him back to me. So I had to stay where I was. I could have gone to my ex's parents' house for the day, where DS1 would have been - I was invited (and still got on well with them all) but felt it would have made things harder for me, so I spent Christmas Day with my friend at her parents' house - they were just fab, but I felt very emotional and just wanted the day to be over. But it does get easier to deal with, I promise. If they can't be with you on the big day, you find other ways of making the time that they are with you as special as possible.

Having said all that, it was the thought of being away from DS2 that kept me in my awful abusive relationship beyond the point when I should have left, I couldn't talk about that aspect of leaving without crying. But in the end staying was making me ill and that was making me a worse mummy, so I had to go. It's kind of the same - you'll be miserable all day if he is there, and sick with worry in the run up. You don't have to do that to yourself. You and your DC deserve to enjoy the day.

Am cheering for you Fi! [waves Christmassy tinsel)
That's my mantra too - all this will pass. It doesn't stay the same. Sometimes, it doesn't get better for a while, it just gets different, but it does pass.
Well done!

DS2 came back to me after lunch, and has more or less slept since then. So I got fired into the 7 enormous bin bags. I am now reunited with all of my expensive Dermatologica skincare stuff, yay! Plus, slightly less yay, he has also returned all our wedding cards, and my wedding keepsakes box. Plus a couple of wedding gifts (he obviously thinks they are mine from before we moved in). Bit sad going through all that, remembering how happy I was in our relationship once upon a time. Found a couple of notes he wrote, going on about how wonderful I am and how we were meant to be together. Nope! And the wooden jewellery box he made for my Christmas last year - it's beautiful, and thoughtful, but things were horrendous last Christmas with his unrelenting verbal abuse of me (and I was so vulnerable, constantly breastfeeding a 4-week old baby). When I mentioned that recently, how awful it was, all he could remember was that he'd made me a lovely box, so how could I possibly claim that he was being awful to me when he was making me lovely things? I think that says it all.

My plan for this evening is a couple of glasses of wine and the Christmas wrapping. I'm determined to 'do' Christmas, if it kills me!!!

aw thanks Pony

Noting your wonderful grim determination to be festive [fwhistleblowing]

that must be hard going through the stuff pony. last year i was also bfing dd and things were a nightmare. u do feel so much more vulnerable when taking care of a baby in that way and under such circumstances. it did bring much comfort though. u'll have a better christmas this year without al the stress i hope.

im not coping very well this weekend at all. im looking foward to monday when i can make a few phone calls and get stuff off my chest and find stuff out about mediation etc... im just not ina good place at the minute.

and Jangles no need to have 'him' [the perpetrator] in your home. maybe he could visit DD at your mums, whilst you are back at home and ensure that he's gone in time for you to arrive for your xmas at your mums with DD, or any other member of your family (this was suggested to me by the police recently because of my situation). WA have said that no ex should have any right of entry to your home its just not appropriate, but an abusive one! (Get out the cab!).

Glad to hear you are reunited with your personal things again Pony, shame about the sad associations. Yeah, not nice to see it all again and have the replay, cathartic tho? toasting you with your with mine, cheers and waving that christmassy tinsel right back at you, yay! Whilst smelling the yummy smells of cooking christmas puds wafting from the kitchen.

((hugs)) to all.. Fi x

I really hope that things can go smoothly Charlotte. Soon these spells of peace and happiness won't come to an end!

just spoke to mum. she also suggested what you suggested princess. after talking with her what i think is the best plan is this...
i tell him i do notthink its a good idea for him to come to the house for christmas now. i tell him would he like to take dd from 9.30 to 12.30 on christmas day, (he can either take her to 'our' church or bring her home to his family). i will go down to my mums church for their morning service and go back to her house, and he will meet my mum at 12.30 to handover dd. how does that sound? im so nervous sorting all this out.

another friend phoned me today. ... said she got a sense that id had a bad week. im so glad ive made new, good friends since i separated. they do care about me (feel all emotional now)

hope ur ok Charlotte xo

i just got a text off dh to say his mum and dad are bringing dd home tonight as he isn't able to.
im freaking out a bit. they are full on. i have had a rubbish day and they are the last people i want to have to make small talk with.... i hope they just want to drop her off and go.

Jangle try not to panic about imminent drop off. Focus on your DD, talk to her before they can speak and then take her in and say goodnight. Prepare what you will say and stick to it if talking to them worries you. You can and probably should ignore whatever they say. (ooo getting practiced at this myself; it does give you a sense of getting some control back of yourself and what you expect yourself to do in these circumstances). Never mind politenesses, as in feeling you 'have' to answer them or be drawn into conversations. Just say something is cooking, thank you, bye. that sort of thing. They do not really want to have a conversation only be nasty/abusive if they are anything like FW. So try to avoid the need to make small talk, they don't sound like your friends! anything you say will only be used against you anyway as will saying nothing, but i prefer the latter!

Maybe best to just state pickup/drop-off times, including h/over to mum plan, he will see from that its not at your home (providing you feel your DD will be safe alone with him, if not, then supervised by a member of your family - not his). Your lovely mum - aw. While you feel so nervous stay away from it as much as you can and focus on DD needs only; disregard responses, just stick to a reasonable contact arrangement, and take all the help you can get! and remember to breeeeeeethe .. he! he!

Fi

thankyou FI i ran to the shop there in a panic to get nice biscuits for them so im waiting here lol. incase they ended up coming in for a cuppa.... i may feel obliged to ask them to come in! they CAN be lovely - but his mum is where he gets his behaviour from, she doesn't hold anything back. she is all nicey nicey with me though, but i reckon as soon as she realises that we are not getting back together she will turn out to be my worst enemy. i am just going to speak to dd, ask how it goes, ask them how the day went, and hopefully they will not act like they are expecting an invite...cos i know i won't be strong enough to say no!! wish i was as strong as you guys. breathing is a start! :)

You are strong, jan. Hey, you got out, didn't you? That certainly took strength, especially when you were so worn down by everything. Hope the handover went well.

im actually still waiting....!

ooooo..... breeeeeethe we here rooting for you.. hold strong

and no time for nice biscuits as he has to get to bed now its so very late!! :)

Evening ladies....sorry about neglecting...quick catch up....

Jangle Hope the handover went well and good plan re Christmas day. Hope your FW wasn't sending his parents to check their point of view on things and hope you were ok. If in doubt just smile and wave, smile and wave!

Pony Glad you are getting all your bits and bobs back, hope you are ok with it all emotionally, must be hard, especially with the wedding bits but stay strong.

Fi and Silver and all other ladies that have escaped and give great advice on here - You speak wise words and keep us other ladies still trapped going when we feel like giving up - there is light at the end of the tunnel! I thank you!

Lecreic Sorry to hear about DD2, typical bloody FW behaviour. They always sink so low using the DC in their stupid mind games. Stay strong and I really hope you are having a good night out tonight!

Charlotte Thinking of you as your FW arrives home, arrrggghhhh! Hope it goes ok, be careful as he may indicate a change in you and realise that you are stronger and more detached than when he left. This is when they can be most dangerous when they feel like they are loosing control. Ohhh and congrats about the landlord being cool about the house - yayyy!!!

Sorry if I have missed anyone else xx

In other news, this has been one shit week, feel like I am in such a black hole FW has been his usual FW whilst in the house and then doing his usual staying out until 3am trick - I mean what normal partner doesn't come home from work and stays out until 3am on a wednesday and thursday night? It just feels like he is punishing me and rubbing salt into the wounds everytime he does it you know. I can't even sleep properly until he comes in as there have been times where he has not locked the door and just fell asleep - epic.

So apart from that usual FW stuff, things went from bad to worse, my MIL kindly offered and had both DC for me overnight last night so I "could go out and enjoy myself" Well it turns out 1. I don't actually have any money to go out and 2. FW has done such a great job of isolating me in his home town that I don't actually have anyone to go out with billy no mates or what! So my DC free evening was spent wandering around asda and having a chinese takeaway for one. What a saddo. FW arrives home at 1am not even realising that DS had gone to MILs too (normally only DD goes) and Ive then had to pretend to my MIL that I did go out with a friend for dinner - double saddo liar!

Sooooo this morning I was suppose to have my viewing on the only house that is willing to accept me under my circumstances and they cancelled last night as the last tenant hasn't returned the keys yet (were suppose to be returned on tuesday) they said they will ring me to rearrange when they get the keys back or change the locks - i really just don't know if they are trying to fob me off. I was then suppose to have a valuation done on my current home this avo but DC were back and trashed the place so we look like we had been burgled so i've reschedule that now until tuesday morning. DBro was over today too to visit, he had promised to help me out financially in the new year but dropped a bombshell that he can't now as had other stuff he had to pay for aka his social life. This is the same DBro that I have bailed out of the shit so many times over the last 20 years and now when it comes to me needing help for once in my life he selfishly fobs me off - i don;t even care, but hate being lied to. I am just so pied off with my whole family TBH. I have DBro making false promises, DMum nagging in my ear whether I am making the right decision or not breaking up the family making me feel like crap (she stayed with EA dad) and then ex-EA dad who thinks he is james bond so really can't see him disclosing any of his super secret personal information to the letting agents anyway to be my guarantor.

Drained.....and to make matters worse, ive made a right royal ARSE of myself with an old flame from many many years ago....

He had been in contact with me off and on on facebook over the last year or so and then he just started ignoring me (think i got a bit full on tbh) so stupidly i have sent him many a (ignored) message. Then again had a moment of weakness last night and sent him another 'happy christmas' message - again ignored The thing is my phone tells me when someone has read my message, the time and everything so i know that he is ignoring me and not just not seen or read the message. I'm sooooo stupid, he really is a lovely lovely man but he probably just thinks I am a nutcase stalker now. I will not be sending him any more messages she says yet again no really i must not. I guess I can take comfort in the fact that hes not blocked me YET!!! I don't even want to start something with this guy but wouldn't say no to a quick roll around I think I just liked the nice compliments he gave me and the attention and remembering how nice it used to be spending time with him all those years ago......it has been that long since a man was nice to me, am just used to being put down, emotionally and physically now and its hard

So drained.....mortified.....tired....crippled from sofa sleeping.....spotty from stress.....wrinkles and frown lines developing fast......fatter from takeaways and mince pies blow out....and not even put up the christmas tree etc yet as waiting for FW to go into the loft to get stuff out.....and my kidneys are hurting lately too (have history of severe kidney infections etc) but I'm too embarrassed to go back to the doctors after my last visit where I had a meltdown and was let out the back door. All in all a shit week!!

Thinking of you all ladies......you truly do keep me from disappearing forever down this black hole I'm trapped in. On a more happier note, Gary Barlow is coming on next on Michael Bubles show on ITV - yum!