Concerned about attempted silencing/derailing of issues (via hunting/mocking)

[Halfway]

I posted a thread in AIBU yesterday (perhaps foolishly), which thankfully did turn out to be very helpful, but also turned out to be extremely hurtful. And while overall, I gained a great deal of benefit/clarity/insight from it, I also spent a great deal of the day in tears and/or raging, and feeling generally crap about myself.

The post was about a friend, which led a lot of people to think I musn't be that emotionally invested, because it wasn't about me.

However, I was emotionally invested because I felt like I was watching my friend potentially walk into a very, very dangerous situation (which could end up in her hurt or even dead), and worse, I had the realisation that I could not stop her, but could only try to, and may very well fail.

In the context of that worry, these are the specific things I am complaining about:

a) sustained piss-taking/mocking (which not only humiliate/hurt me, but distracted and derailed the thread, with others jumping on board)

b) failure/refusal to stop the piss-taking/mocking when asked nicely to, and despite my making it clear that I was finding it painful

LET ME MAKE IT VERY CLEAR - I have nothing against genuine concerns, disagreements, and even disbelief of my thread, or specifics in my posts if these things are stated outright (not passive-aggressively buried in in-jokes), and if the posters simply make their position clear and report to MNHQ.

There is a valid need for this kind of watchdog activity, and I am in no way trying to stop that.

But the mocking, especially the sustained mocking by some posters, and 'ha ha' twisting of my dilemma into a funny joke conversation... well that hurt. That really hurt. And I've been seriously hurt in the past (raped, beaten to broken bones), so am no hand-wringing wallflower. It was triggering.

I think that behaviour is wrong, and I think it is going to hurt a lot more people other than me. Perhaps it is already hurting people who have severe issues of their own, and feel they cannot post because they will be laughed at.

Anyway, I'm concerned about it, deeply concerned, and still a bit disturbed myself (although much emotionally cooler).

I'm also not sure how this fits into "Relationships", so apologies if it seems weird here, but I seem to be inviting more suspicion by posting in AIBU, so here it is, and I'm grateful to anyone willing to listen.

Look, in the nicest possible way: you need to get over yourself!

It's not for you or anyone else to change MN. If HQ want to change the way things are done, fair enough.

But presumably the people who post here are adults and won't take kindly to being corrected like naughty children all the time.

Your thread was derailed. If it is sincere then that is unfortunate. But you come on a couple of days before Halloween and expect people to take it seriously?

Worse: they DID take it seriously and were left pondering the ins and outs of some sick fucker who gets his rocks off eating actual human flesh and the other sick fucker who doesn't really mind. Then YOU start on about "why is it wrong?"

Honestly. What did you think would happen?

I stated that I do not think your thread is real and my post was deleted.
You were allowed to continually talk about cannabilism which was very upsetting for a lot of people yet your comments have been allowed to stand.
Quite why the original thread has not been deleted is amazing. This is a family friendly forum and if threads like this continue I will be leaving.

This is my perspective.
Others may choose to disagree.
Mumsnet is by parents for parents.
As far as I know this poster is genuine.
As far as i know MN accepts all posters within reason.
Yes, this particular poster seems to lack boundaries and thoughts, and her possible behaviours are way off the normal Mnetter.

Does that mean she should be pushed away, or made to feel not welcome?

Obviously, at the end of the day, it is up to MNHQ. It is their site to do as they will.
But this poster seems to genuinely want to be more mainstream in life.
And, as she says,if she carries on hanging around the people she normally hangs around with,she is in potential grave danger.

Yesterday, I saw the thread,and because it was too gruesome for me, I ignored it.
Many others did not do that,and that is up to them. And indeed, the op was helped.
We Mnetters do have choices too, if subjects come up that we do not want to deal with.

If you are humiliated to desperation by MN, then don't use it.

I presume the thread will be deleted. It certainly should be.

As will this one (fred about fred, don'tcha know).

I think the locking feature is to stop "what happened to X thread" threads. Because that thread was never going to be a nice friendly conversation. How could it be?

I think you should be able to express disbelief.

I don't think you should be allowed to continually mock a real life painful issue, despite pleas to stop. I think there should be a better/faster way for MNHQ to intervene in such cases... which is why I am working through my thoughts about the issue before writing to them with something constructive.

Echobitch I will probably get over it, and will be quicker to get over it next time. That doesn't mean it didn't already hurt terribly and that I shouldn't try to do something about it.

I was grateful for all the constructive feedback, harsh or not, about what I should actually do regarding my friend. I actioned every bit of that constructive feedback.

I think the sustained mocking was abhorrent, and there should be a way for people to flag it to MNHQ in a better/faster way before it becomes extremely distressing.

I lurked on the original thread OP, was thinking of posting but thought I'd get a flaming.

But really felt for you with the mocking, and am surprised that adults can not stop themselves from bullying and adding hurtful mocking comments when you asked so politely.

One thing I have learnt from Mumsnet, is do not post on AIBU, even if you mean it tongue on cheek! I posted a very innocent, jokey thread in AIBU, and was [hshock] at some replies! And, I take everything to heart too.

Halfway I posted on your thread and the de-railing was pointless, I don't understand why posters who were offended/disgusted didn't just report & hide the thread?

Because the thread is still there & you haven't been deleted it tells me that I was right to respond to you as a genuine poster who needs help/advice.

Would agree that AIBU is not the place for the subject matter, tends to be mostly people with black/white answers.

Relationships is probably more appropriate.

I did feel there was a bit of (and still is ) 'you can't talk about that HERE!' attitude and it doesn't make sense, individual posters don't 'own' mumsnet & have no right to dictate.

I would advise not giving so much of yourself in your posts, yes, you felt hurt & wanted to explain why, but definitely be a bit more self-protective. The goaders/mockers are really not worth it. And, not sure who said up thread, but would agree it was partly a 'making sense of something extreme' response for some.

Don't give up, just maybe be more careful about what you reveeal.

Maybe you should explain to your counsellor about your trouble understanding the boundaries of human behaviour and what is considered socially acceptable. Ask them to help you with it. I wouldn't advise that anyone - particularly anyone who is emotionally vunerable - use the internet to determine what is 'normal'.

Whooooosualsuspect I will not be told to 'go away and don't talk about your problems then'.

Thats what you're saying to me.

I am not complaining about any of the harsh legitimate feedback. I've been told I come across naive and lacking perspective. Ok, I think I probably do/am. I don't mind that.

I do mind the sustained piss-taking, the jokes, the 'ha ha this is funny', when it isn't funny at all and is extremely painful, and I have asked people to stop repeatedly.

I can't stop those people, but I can suggest MNHQ does something about it. And I'm going to after I work through my thought processes with the benefit of feedback here.

And, I do have to go now for a bit (real life stuff to deal with). I will be back.

Why would you use a site that upset you so much though?

MN will not change to suit you.

The only people who were silenced were those who were mocking or derailing (I don't know what they were doing because they have all been deleted.)

You had ample opportunity to discuss and explore the issue, but everyone told you the same thing. What more did you want to hear?

And I'm fascinated to know just how you think MNHQ could change anything.

I think you are being rather ridiculous, actually. You must have realised that the nature of the post would lead to people suspecting you were trolling, and you must have realised that posting in AIBU would not guarantee you a safe ride.

In fact, I would go as far to say that you are the one goading now ...

But would you have posted that thread in Step-parenting? In Only Joking? In Telly Addicts? Course not - you'd have had some bonkers responses.

It shouldn't have been in AIBU - as a Mner you prolly would have known that? - and you're complaining about an AIBU response. It's not 'go away and don't talk about your problems' (though MN don't have a duty of care to publish 'em you know, it's not a right), it's 'ask about issues in the right place and in the right way and you won't get the same response'.

Context is everything - had you put that OP in Food, EVERY response you got would have been joking or disgusted. EVERYONE would have assumed pisstake/troll.

That's what you don't appear to acknowledge, you say you do but I really don't think you understand.

.... and, you cannot define what is and isn't funny!

You said you wanted to think like most people. Most people wouldn't believe the thread. I didn't. But I gave you the benefit of the doubt and answered as though I did. Most people would either be horrified or think it wasn't true. And would think an internet forum isn't an ideal place to discuss the rights and wrongs of cannibalism. So there's no point in wanting to think like most people and then be annoyed about what most people say.

The reason people post disbelief and resort to derailing is that mnhq take a very long time to respond to reports.

The thread was going for hours with sensible advice, with the op ignoring the advice and releasing more and more extreme tit-bits of information which any sensible person would realise were absolutely so far from acceptable that they wouldn't even be asking.

It was only after a number of hours of this that people started expressing disbelief - especially as the op appeared to be completely ignoring any sensible advice and only responding to the more extreme replies.

I'm baffled by you actually.

You've come here to drum up support for when you tell off MNHQ for how they do things?

When people sensibly suggest that if you don't like how MN rolls you don't post here, you get all hysterical about how you won't be told to go away with your problems.

Are you single-handedly trying to save the cyber world or something? Because I don't think that's going to happen. Perhaps invest more time in watching to see whether your friend has some parts missing over the next few months. (and that's me being flippant NOT 'bullying')

And I'll add (though I will probably be deleted), it is the classic sign of a troll to ignore all the sensible, thoughtful, supportive advice and only react angrily and aggressively to those who disagree or disbelieve.

This is then often followed by cries of bullying, followed by posts alleging that the op is emotionally unable to cope with the thread/has mh issues/suffers from PND etc, in order to get posters on the thread fighting with each other.

I have seen it so many times before - in the end the thread gets deleted.

It may not have been a deliberately trolling thread, but it certainly followed the normal pattern that troll threads follow.

"AIBU is a harsh gladiatorial arena. You're effectively asking to be mocked on that board... It's sport."

MN explicitly state that AIBU is not a fight club. Anyone claiming it is, really is trying to change the nature of MN. Bald honesty and disagreement are one thing: gladatorial sport is quite another.

Nobody owes me anything. They do have the power to mock me to desperation despite my pleas not to, and I think MNHQ should do something about that.

No, only you have the power to let people get to you like that.

I think there is a flowery quote from Eleanor Roosevelt on that very topic.

As an example of changing your perspective, you could ask yourself if the expressions of disbelief should lead you to a conclusion different from the one you have drawn (the conclusion that MN is a horrible place where you have been silenced). You could look at the opinions and quickly learn (as you say you want to) how the majority of people think and how they view cannibalism. When people express disbelief so forcefully and persistently it means they have never in their lives come across anything so bizarre -- ergo you are in a minority where your idea of what may be normal goes.

i posted on the previous post, and expressed my shock at the nastiness that was coming from a small percentage of respondents.
However, I think that beginning this post is moving the emphasis away from the real problem (your friend's abusive relationship) and onto you and your reactions to things. I can understand you feeling that you have to defend yourself when nasy comments are directed at you, but that now needs taking up with MNHQ, not by starting another thread to resurrect the issue.
You will have the same names from yesterday popping up on here in a moment, and the whole thing will start up again.
perhaps you should remove yourself for a while from the site and guide your friend towards the much-needed help she requires. I think you have become too involved in the whole mumsnet thing at the moment.

"MN explicitly state that AIBU is not a fight club. Anyone claiming it is, really is trying to change the nature of MN."

Unlike the OP I'm not trying to change the nature of anything. I'm just calling as a I find....

Ok... My God.

I have quickly re-skimmed this thread.

I've noticed some things I genuinely didn't realise.

a) The extreme level of upset a lot of people felt from simply viewing the thread

b) That you really genuinely don't seem to believe me and didn't, and weren't just kicking me for the hell of it

sigh Ok. I definitely should have picked up on those things sooner.

Yes, I can get a bit too self-absorbed, and wrapped up in my own pain, and fail to see the pain of others.

I can only promise I will be far, far more careful about putting up appropriate warnings next time, and thinking more carefully about where on the site I post.

I'm honestly very sorry I didn't get that earlier. Its now sinking in.

I'm sorry this is painful for some of you. I really am seeking help. I will only ever be able to think in more healthy ways if I spend time with people who do. It is helping me, it really is... and I'm genuinely sorry it seems to effect you so much.

Surely the only thing that matters in this is that you and your friend are happy, safe and well? I followed the thread all day yesterday and people were genuinely trying to help. Please try and take away the bits you found helpful and disregard the more negative things. Because when all said and done they are just words on a screen and they only have the power to hurt you if you let them