The kids winge and cry

[BurntToastSmell]

I have two very demanding young children. A toddler (2 years) and a baby (9 months). They winge all day long (I really mean: all. day. long). Aside from look after the kids on my own all day (7am till 6pm) I have to keep the house clean, make their food, make sure all the dishes are washed, make sure all the clothes are clean, take them to baby & toddler groups, AND run an online business. I'm at the end of my tether because of the constant winging all day long. My friend has suggested using an ipod and turning the volume up full so I can't hear their winging. Is this reasonable? I don't know how I would get all my chores done otherwise, but I feel terrible. I read that if you leave young children to winge/cry, you can lower their self esteem and make them more anxious (due to elevated levels of cortisol). I really hate leaving them to cry but I don't know what else I can do? I don't want to put them into daycare/nursery until they are 3.

X-posting (that happens with short posts a lot, doesn't it?)
I suspected the PND... Just didn't want to assume.
I'll say it again (imagine I'm smiling but talking a bit louder so you don't ignore me this time :) ) ... I think your children are whingy because you are unhappy.

"The research actually says that poor quality institutional childcare is damaging to young children, not that institutional childcare for under threes is automatically damaging. "

The research shows that high-quality day care can increase the cognitive skills and academic performance of children of low-income parents.

However numerous studies have shown that the quality of the vast majority of care provided by UK and US day care centres falls far short of high.

Some sources for this:

Leach
Daycare Trust
UNICEF

The book I referred to earlier talks about how middle class mothers leave their children in the company of substitutes who usually have much less education and a lower IQ than them. This is likely to be the case for me.

Also:

?Babies and toddlers do not need education and stimulation, rather, they want the security of knowing there is always an adult nearby who is familiar and responsive. Routinised group care is what they do not need? (www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/009192393X/ref=as_li_tf_tl?ie=UTF8&tag=codedev-21&linkCode=as2&camp=1634&creative=6738&creativeASIN=009192393X Oliver James).

Yes, I know, I need to work on the 'responsive' part. And that's what I'm going to focus my energy on.

I don't agree with the idea that toddlers don't need stimulation at all!

Since you seem to take Oliver James seriously, OP, have a look at this:

www.guardian.co.uk/lifeandstyle/2010/may/22/oliver-james-worker-mummy-parent

The key quote, talking about the decisions mothers take about balancing work and care of children:

Abundant evidence shows that what is most harmful to a mother's mental health is when she is wanting one arrangement and living another. A life of quiet desperation soon develops, as she constantly has to hide behind a patina of rationalisations when talking to friends and colleagues.

The real solution is going to be men starting to feel ? every bit as much as women ? that it is up to them how the baby is cared for.

MainlyMaynie - what's your setup? Are you a SAHM? What chores does your DH do?

flow4 - the £50 per week is for: the kids clothes, the kids toys, entry to baby & toddler groups/softplay, food & drinks at these venues.

"Could it be they're not sleeping until late due to lack of stimulation?"

Not sure what you mean by that? Do you have an image of them sitting in a dark room with no toys, no human contact, no other kids to play with? Or are you simply trying to wind me up?

You are so focussed on the negative aspects of childcare that you can't see the positives IN YOUR SITUATION. You need a break for your sanity. And I say that even though I agree with you. I think it is preferable for a child to be at home with it's mother. BUT not if that home environment is miserable because the mother is stressed and unhappy. You need a break.

OTheHugeManatee - I actually want to be a SAHM. I want the children to be my main focus, but the other chores are getting in the way. They are preventing me from being the best mum I can be.

Hmmm, i just read about your previously serious and now managed PND. I think it's a recipe for a disaster for someone with a delicate mental health to stay at home full time plus with less money coming in. I have suffered on and off with depression a d I know how damaging it were for me. Yes, i know you are not me but the GPs and psychologists I spoke to couldn't stress enough how important it is to have something you can do (work or a hobby) that takes your mind off children, gives you space to improve yourself.

And yes, toddlers need to be stimulated. No one says you need to do quantum physics with them but they need something to tire challenge them. A toddler is usually 'naughty' because s/he bored.

Sorry about the grammatical and spelling mistakes. On my bloody phone and knackered.

Burnt, you said the £50 was for you and the kids. All the things you list are for the kids. What about your clothes, toiletries, magazines, swimming/exercise classes, chocolate and bottles of wine, coffee with a friend... Do they come out of that 50 too?

Kids that age really don't need that many toys or clothes. What they need is lots and lots of adult input. They will be much happier with a Mummy who can sit on the floor with them for two hours playing peekaboo or making a den or banging saucepans with wooden spoons, than with a Mummy who's trying to find a moment to do some paid work so she can buy them a pretty outfit and some plastic tat toys.

No-one can run a house and a business and look after two young children without some help. So you need a housekeeper, or a business partner, or a child carer. Or you need to give up your business, which is what I would do personally.

You're trapped in that situation of trying to do lots of things and feel that you're not doing any of them properly. So you have to give something up.

Drink - can you give me examples of activities I can do in the home which will tire/challenge the kids? I've got some finger paints right here. I could put down a wipe-clean mat and those? Baby and toddler could both have a go?

But as I have the kids on my own for 11 hours straight, I need more ideas

Burnt, the £50 a week sounds like quite a lot for just clothes, toys and entertainment.

Could you possibly buy the children less and use £20 towards a cleaner? Or save that for a dishwasher? From gumtree/ preloved, you could afford one from just a month's savings.

Wish you all the best!

Baking is always a good one DS is nearly 3 and last week helped me make a Christmas cake and loves making little fairy cakes and things which can then be decorated.

BurntToast - your kids are unhappy because you are. I know that's blunt but it's patently obvious from your posts. You are trying to do too much and you and your kids are suffering. The washing and the tidying and your business aren't going to complain if you don't attend to them but if you don't, the evidence is right there in front of you (business not done, dirty plates and piles of laundry). But that kind of stuff is really not important. What is important is the emotional well-being of you and your kids and that's what's going on the back burner with your current set up.

I don't care what your research says. You are considering wearing an ipod so that you can't hear your children. That is Not Normal. Please, please get some help. If your toddler went to a nursery 2 mornings a week I think you'd get your sanity back.

Obviously you would have to ask your DH to pay for that because there's no way you could do that on £50. Is money an issue or is he just tight?

flow4 - yes my things have to come out of that £50 per week (it's really £200 per month so some months it has to stretch further). Somehow I'm always struggling to make it last. I always thought it was because I love buying things, and I love to see my kids faces when I surprise them with a toy of their favourite character.

I'm mostly a SAHM, but do freelance work when DS is asleep. DH and I do bicker about chores, but we share pretty well really. I tend to do the washing and drying, he folds the clothes. I fill the dishwasher, he empties it. I cook the tea, he washes the pans. He takes DS out at the weekend and I am out one evening a week at a language class. We don't have particularly high cleaning standards, we used to have a cleaner before we had DS. We co-sleep and I breastfeed, so deal with nights, but DS isn't really awake at night. I think it's a reasonable balance.

"Kids that age really don't need that many toys or clothes. What they need is lots and lots of adult input. They will be much happier with a Mummy who can sit on the floor with them for two hours playing peekaboo or making a den or banging saucepans with wooden spoons, than with a Mummy who's trying to find a moment to do some paid work so she can buy them a pretty outfit and some plastic tat toys."

• Very true, and logically I know this. But there is huge pressure at the Baby & Toddler groups, where each child's outfit is scrutinised (I'm not joking). It makes me feel very uncomfortable, so I always make sure my kids pass the test, so to speak.

Activities, hmmm. Music, mine loves music and dancing. We have a couple of CDs from ELC and the do the job. Dancing in front of the mirror. Baby should enjoy it too.

Doing laundry. Your toddler should be able to put items of clothing in the washing machine (I'd sort the clothes first before directing him to the right pile ).

At the nursery they do messy play. Actually at home we do waterplay too in the bathroom sink. Well, sge just stands a d washes her hands for 20 minutes or moves stuff from bathtub to the sink.

Tbh I mostly go outside.

Perhaps some of these suggestions might work...

www.micheleborba.com/blog/2012/07/02/michele-borba-new-trend-micromanaged-kids-cant-stand-boredom-helping-kids-learn-to-entertain-themselves/

How much does your DH have to spend on himself?

Surprisingly, making sure everyone has clean clothing is the largest, most time-consuming chore. Here's the steps:

1. Load the washing machine.
2. When washed, take clothes from washing machine and hang on two clothes horses (we have a tumble drier but DH says it's too expensive to run; he deals with the bills not me, so he knows).
3. When the clothes have (eventually) dried, sort them into piles (mine, his, DDs, DSs).
4. Put the clothes away in everyone's correct place.

Activities- entertaining the big one in a way that's fun for the little one to watch is key
Painting, crayons, stickers, wall stickers, chalks on the pavement, hand and foot printing, splashing in puddles, water play, pretend cooking with dried pasta and spuds etc, water beads, music CDs, making cakes, hanging washing out dragging it through mud
Is your business something that can be put on ice for a while or will a lot of hard work vanish if you stop it now?
I feel like you a lot of the time. I WANT to be be a SAHM, a good one- I was great as a full time working mum but feel like I'm always flying by the seat of my pants at this lark.....

Drink - dancing in front of the mirror! Nice one! I have a large mirror I could remove from the wall and put side-ways at the kids level. Will do that tomorrow :)

MainlyMaynie - I don't know how much he spends on himself. He's not really into buying material things (clothes, etc), but he does like his beer.

Use the bloody drier. Is your DH's salary very low? I thought you were both just stuck in small child tiredness, but I am losing any sympathy for him. With babies you need to be using the drier.