Support for those in Emotionally Abusive Relationship: 12

[foolonthehill]

Am I being abused?

Verbal Abuse A wonderfully non-hysterical summary. If you're unsure, read the whole page and see if you're on it.
Emotional abuse from the same site as above
Emotional abuse a more heartfelt description
a check list Use this site for some concise diagnostic lists and support
Signs of Abuse & Control Useful check list
why financial abuse is domestic violenceAre you a free ride for a cocklodger, or supposed to act grateful for every penny you get for running the home?
Women's Aid: "What is Domestic Violence?" This is also, broadly, the Police definition.
20 signs you're with a controlling and/or abusive partner Exactly what it says on the tin

Books :

"Why Does He Do That?" by Lundy Bancroft - The eye-opener. Read this if you read nothing else.
"The Verbally Abusive Relationship" by Patricia Evans ? He wants power OVER you and gets angry when you prove not to be the dream woman who lives only in his head.
"The Verbally Abusive Man, Can He Change?" by Patricia Evans - Answer: Perhaps - ONLY IF he recognises HIS issues, and if you can be arsed to work through it. She gives explicit guidelines.
"Men who hate women and the women who love them" by Susan Forward. The author is a psychotherapist who realised her own marriage was abusive, so she's invested in helping you understand yourself just as much as helping you understand your abusive partner.
"The Emotionally Abusive Relationship: How to Stop Being Abused and How to Stop Abusing" by Beverley Engels - The principle is sound, if your partner isn't basically an arse, or disordered.
"Codependent No More : How to Stop Controlling Others and Start Caring for Yourself" by Melody Beattie - If you a rescuer, you're a co-dependent. It's a form of addiction! This book will help you.
But whatever you do, don't blame yourself for being Co-dependent!

Websites :

So, you're in love with a narcissist - Snarky, witty, angry, but also highly intelligent: very good for catharsis
Dr Irene's verbal abuse site - motherly advice to readers' write-ins from a caring psychotherapist; can be a pain to navigate but very validating stuff
Out of the fog - and now for the science bit! Clinical, dispassionate, and very informative website on the various forms of personality disorders and how they impact on family and intimate relationships.
Get your angries out ? You may not realise it yet, but you ARE angry. Find out in what unhealthy ways your anger is expressing itself. It has probably led you to staying in an unhealthy relationship.
Melanie Tonia Evans is a woman who turned her recovery from abuse into a business. A little bit "woo" and product placement-tastic, but does contain a lot of useful articles.
Love fraud - another site by one woman burned by an abusive marriage
You are not crazy - one woman's experience. She actually has recordings of her and her abusive partner having an argument, so you can hear what verbal abuse sounds like. A pain to navigate, but well worth it.
Baggage reclaim - Part advice column, part blog on the many forms of shitty relationships.
heart to heart a wealth of information and personal experiences drawn together in one place

what couples therapy does for abusers

If you find that he really wants to change
should I stay or should I go bonus materials this is a site containing the material for men who want to change?please don?t give him the link?print out the content for him to work through.

The Bill of Rights
bill of rights here is what you should expect as a starting point for your treatment in a relationship, as you will of course be treating others!!

Sorry I've not been able to keep in touch much lately, work, home life and now studying is wiping me out, I'm exhausted. Sounds like some of you had hard weekends - Bertie just wanting to offer an unmumsnetty hug.

My weekend was ok, a few low level things but nothing I can really report on. Last night DD slept very badly (she's poorly) so nobody got much sleep. NSDH got the hump in the end when I asked him to help (he didn't say this but I know his normal reasoning, he's in the office today whereas I'm working from home, therefore I should be the one to be disturbed at night. As always). So this morning when he gets up he starts crashing round the house, slamming doors, knocking things around (it's bin day). But if I was to complain at this, he'll just say he didn't 'mean' to do it. Sigh.

Counselling this afternoon, so cue my usual rushing around searching for somebody to look after DD. How wrong is it that I can't wait for our Relate sessions to end? I'm fed up with having to sort out childcare every week. NSDH has made some minor changes but I don't know if it's enough. And that makes me sad and guilty.

Catch you guys later.

yes Nini RESPECT for you! this is what he is not showing by banging around, etc. You've been up all night and are exhausted and have a heavy day on yourself. We would creep around out of respect for someone having had a bad night, especially just because up earlier than everyone else. yep, I'M UP EVERYBODY, turn all the lights on, bang around in the wardrobe, up/down stairs, banging bahtroom door leave door open when showing flushing loo etc. all uncaring consideration for those around, and makes life very difficult for those around. I did fight against all these things, and changes did come, but all the rows on the way there r justing exhausting. bring it up at counselling. You are caring for small people who need you and you must be supported in your efforts! Its not rocket science, why does it have to seem like it is????

PLEASE don't be sad and guilty :( you are unhappy and sleep deprived get the help you deserve! :)

is it not 'mumsnetty' to give hugs :(

(((hugs)))

Yay, go hilde! That sounds great to me - coolly talking through boundaries (again) while pointing out that the future could go either way. Sounds perfect to me.

Why did I ever say to NSDH that there is a problem? I know that in a marriage one has to talk about these things and without that there's no resolution, but he just doesn't get it and I can't explain it without throwing accusations I can't substantiate (I think you're abusive, I think you think you're superior to me, I think you're constantly disappointed in me). Because it's all so slippery and open to reinterpretation and he denies everything. And takes everything as an attack - eg he overheard me complaining about his alarm yesterday (woke me up when it went off three times (he slept through it) after I'd had a relatively bad night), so he slept on the sofa last night.

So I'm not sure if it's just that I'm not cut out for a relationship, since I don't want to talk through the problems. The conversations tie me up in knots every time.

you don't want to engage in conversation about the issues because it is pointless...he only uses them to get back to what he wants to say and does not hear you at all.

this is why reklationship counselling doe not work in these rel probs either.

so true fool its hard to accept, but no, does not hear and willl only use any conversation as a foothold to say his own piece. Disappointing to hear that relationship counselling doesnt work for this, its a different thing altogether. :(

Argh! He is such a FW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Yes, but your DD is an absolute treasure! May she live long and prosper and never ever meet a FW!

hilde it's horrible that he's doing that with your DD. i would be furious despite the fact that she appears to be dealing with it remarkably well Are you ok?

(I did spot the names but it didn't occur to be that you might be outing yourself...I just thought "what lovely names Hilde DC have!" )

I thought that too bertie! Lovely names. And DD1 (sure iher name's lovely too!) has the measure of him. Sad that she has to have, but good that she does.

hilde, he's a complete FW, and it certainly puts his 'putting on a good show of being nice and making an effort' with you into a different perspective. It does seem that it's all for show at the moment. He's talking the talk but not walking the walk - in fact, he's being textbook 'unchanged' (as per Lundy's list), talking about your non-existent issues etc. Given what he's done to you... how very, very dare he.
I know it's early days, but.... FW!!!! [shouts with megaphone]

Nini, how'd counselling go today?

I'm not sure how I am. I've been feeling a bit... funny today. I miss NSDH. I really miss him. I'm having such fun at the moment with the DSs, I'm much more present with them because my head is less tied up with constant FWittery, but I still miss him. I miss him at night especially. (Had a slightly saucy dream about Liam Neeson/NSDH last night hasn't helped either ) I'll be seeing him on Wednesday (when he has the kids for the evening), I'm going to have to be keeping more of a distance than usual or I genuinely fear I may just throw myself at him!! He's ordered the Beverley Engel book, hope he's reading it right now.

Hilde at your fw's twisting of minds. at your smart dd!

It's so interesting (in a sad way) to see the pattern book these fws come from - it does really help with the detaching and viewing objectively.

Viewed house today but too much money for not very nice place. Seeing another tomorrow - furnished which makes things easier.

PS thought your letter was excellent Hilde.

Pony, how did you manage the actual mechanics of leaving - did you move into a furnished place and take bare minimum, then come back later for more stuff? Thanks for advice, I feel very woolly headed at the moment.

Ah pony sorry to hear you're missing him - it's all so bloody confusing, isn't it. Liam Neeson, hmm, quite tasty

Counselling was better than last week. We tried to talk about our financial inbalance, and I think I was left feeling a lot happier than he was (which is a given as currently the setup is massively in his favour). Although he did get the hump that he didn't get his 'me' time - he took DD to the Dad's group and I was poorly on sunday (suffer from arthritis). So he's still selfish as always. Small progress, but progress nonetheless. Feeling like I'm coming down with something so I'm already in bed.

Will try and catch up with all tomorrow, struggling to focus as am so tired and NSDH has just got in bed next to me.

hey trying - when I went, I went to my parents' house and took just essentials, but I still took a fair amount of stuff - two car-loads maybe (my car and my mum's car), although I guess having a young baby that needed bouncy chairs, sterilisers, baby gyms, etc, took up most room. I took all my documents (although cant lay my hands on my marriage cert at the mo, but sure I took it...). I took clothes for myself, clothes for DSs, minimum toiletries, a few toys for DS1, and anything else of vague use/importance that I felt I needed. (eg MP3 player was a necessity!!!) Over the months, I've picked up bits and pieces as and when I've needed them, but that's only because I've been able to do that fairly easily. When I moved into the flat I had three car loads, so not that much extra on top of what I originally took (and most of that was the cot & highchair which were later additions). The reason I say that, is that I've found it strangely satisfying to know how little stuff we've actually needed in order to get by. Over five months later, there's not much that I'm desperately in need of from the house.

Furnished would obviously be much easier for you to move into quickly and smoothly with minimum fuss, but there are fewer properties doing that I think. Are you going through letting agents or looking for a private let (eg Gumtree).

Sorry, rambling on... Feel free to ask more, am more than happy to do anything that will help you out in some way.

Glad counselling went better Nini, and hope you're feeling better tomorrow (and hope that NSDH stays on his side of the bed !).

Never really thought of Liam Neeson in that way before. I do now though!!!!

H has read some emails between my and my parents (who he hates - they are poison at the root of all our problems according to him). We were discussing a present for DDs upcoming birthday. DH had basically suggested something not quite what they offered to buy and twice the cost. I'd said that they should choose what they like as it's their gift but if they get the more expensive option then we'll pay half of it. Had also written on one email 'you know what he's like'. Got home to H clearly in a grump. Once DD was in bed said to me 'interesting exchange between you and your parents' and is now acting all hurt and self righteous.

I'm so annoyed as usually I'm so careful not to say/write anything disparaging about DH and especially to my parents and now he thinks I do it all the time.

Plus he's in the wrong for reading my emails.

hilde, it won't end but it will get better, I promise

...and I don't mean just a little bit better, I mean a whole heap better...even with tiredness, even with you doing all the boundary making, even though he may well stay the absolute twat that he is.

My very own FW managed to destroy all the remains of my love in the first 3 months of our separation....I felt I had quite literally paid for a one way ticket to hell....and taken my DCs with me. Now he is still a FW and exhibits his fwittery but I am made of teflon...it all just slides off...you will get there too.

Store up the good days in your mind, when you feel the world is collapsing around you take them out and look at them and know there are more to come and they will become more frequent and better.

big hugs (even if we are on MN and it's not allowed!!!!)

Kim: yes he is wrong...enough said.

Hi guys,

Hildebrand your email was brilliant. At least you have managed to separate that's massive.
Interesting about the counselling nini. D and I have been to relate TWICE and it didn't go very well either time as an impasse was reached where he did not agree with counsellor and they were too dim witted about ea to pull him up.
I also get completely tied up in knots and spaghetti brained and gas lighted... I have been doing my reading and feel empowered by it!
Basically I have spent, following another bad night with ds2, whole day childcare. Took them to indoor play with mum then wanted to go home but dh insisted we meet at park after work as they need outdoor time. Ds1 was so tired and not interested anyhow. Then home, gave them baths, fed etc. he goes off to Kung fu lesson and I have friend over. Ds1 not in bed till TEN at which point I am treated to a lecture about how uk disciplined he is because of me. I said well its better than rough housing. Maybe he does what you say because he is afraid of u. He told me kids will be slapping me in the face if I don't wise up.
I was a bit short with ds1 today myself, had to physically pck him up a few times but he's just pushing the boundaries. I always feel guilty when I get cross I'm just sooooo tired. My back hurts, I wanted to do twen min of yoga so I don't feel quite so fat!
But ladies marital relations have resumed and I'm not sure how I feel. Part of me wanted to, another part wanted the baby to wake up. He said aftere maybe that will relax you! Apparently I am very aggressive? Maybe I am. I don't know anymore. I feel like I've lost perspective. Will no doubt post later in night, see you then anyone who's up with dcs. X