He's just been to a nude lap dancing bar :(

[RunnyBum]

H just back from nude lap dancing bar, he has been on stag dos before and he knows I hate it. I'm gutted, he says I should forget this one "mistake" as he (allegedly) didn't has a private dance as he knows I would hate that. He claims he was just curious (inspite having been before and knowing all about it!!) Being in front of a naked woman that isnt me, for kicks just feels like cheating on some level. Oh and he wasn't on a stag tonight just out with a friend.

Found out as I Where's My Iphone'd him as he was meant to just be in our town, and I thought he'd be heading home.

We're meant to be going away on a romantic break in a few weeks, but a the minute I don't want him near me :(

How would u deal with this?

I wouldn't accept a drink off a stranger btw, that'd be very stupid because they are normally sent buy men who feel that drink buys your attention and that is one thin end of a pretty offensive abusive wedge (which begins with chatting and ends with a rape which is defended by "she didn't say no" etc). If I did accept a drink from such a man I would actively seek to drink it and NOT to speak to him because he would thoroughly deserve it for even contemplating that he could buy me in any way.

Also agree it is not common or normal to go to lapdancing clubs. If it were it would lose its titillation as a stag trip. I know one person who has ever visited one.

And I bet larry would call me a bitch or a slag or a prick tease for accepting his drink and not considering myself bought and paid for.

I know a company, of mainly men but some women, where they have TBT (Tit Bar Thursday). I kid you not.

Not sure about it losing its titillation as a stag trip. By that logic men would only go out and get shit faced vomiting drunk when they go out on a stag do.
Lapdancing clubs are doing better on our High Streets than shops. Shops are closing down all the time. Lapdancing clubs are springing up everywhere.. There's a huge market for them.

What is needed is for ALL women to know the truth about what goes on in them. I'm tired of being told I'm 'just insecure' or 'jealous of the young women' when I raise objections.
All women need to know that this is not 'harmless fun' where all that happens is that the girls do a bit of a disco dance with their breasts on show.
We also need to get rid of the 'lap dance club' euphemism because doesn't that sound more respectable than 'strip club' ? To some ears at least...

Larry's viewpoint is reminiscent of the p*unternetters when we were last invaded. They see any relationship/marriage as 'what the woman can get out of the man' - and sex being something a woman 'gives' to a man in return for gifts/marriage/a home. They essentially reduce any relationship down to a transaction.

I think anyone who holds these views - and Larry's posts on here about 'women wearing skimpy outfits to get bought dinner' and the like were particularly abhorrent - has never experienced an equal, loving relationship. After all, they think women are things to be bought - be it in a lap dancing club or a brothel.

Men don't get shit faced drunk on stag dos for titillation though, alcohol is a drug, they drink for the effects of the drug and to out do the other men on pathetic displays of manliness. Totally different thing.

Is that a first in the not reading the thread stakes; someone not even reading the op?!

great article OP

and another

this includes stats about sexual crime rising in areas where lap dancing clubs open

I have said it before, I will say it again.

Groups of men "displaying" their sexuality in front of each other in this way has it's roots in latent homosexuality and their denial surrounding that.

"Look at me, I am so hetero, I can pay a bird to suck her tits behind a curtain, watched by Security"

Yeah, you are so horny mate!"

< ahem >

gosh, kerry, haven't seen your man-pleasing ways around here for a while

I don't think it is all about latent homosexuality as I've said before but also about dissociative sex without intimacy, entitlement and viewing sexual relationships as a financial transaction, believing in the old stereotype of women not enjoying sex (and therefore men not needing to care about their enjoyment) and needing gifts in order to endure it, men having "needs" which they must have satisfied.

I think the idea of consent (legally) is misunderstood by a lot of people - it means agreement by choice. Someone may agree by choice to work in the sex industry although often those choices are influenced by other factors and even if you do choose it of your own free will, the fact you are being paid to work in the sex industry means you cannot actually really consent to sex acts. Fundamentally to enjoy porn or lapdancing or prostitution you have to ignore or not care that consent is not important in that sexual experience. Sometimes the way that is done is by pretending it is "all a bit of fun".

This is why I think porn use, especially uneducated porn use, is bad because it is often a person's first experience of sex and is entirely one sided, entirely dissociated from intimacy and shared enjoyment. If people mistakenly learn "techniques" from porn it creates bad or abusive sex, you cannot learn good sex from watching porn, good sex is about chemistry and intuition not "techniques". Porn also often plays to the competitive target culture that men are taught and leads to this ridiculous "getting your gf to do xyz" behaviour too.

Lapdancing bars are an extension of all that I think, they are about getting women to degrade themselves for men so that men can either be aroused, ignore or laugh at it.

Happy,

You are in full fantasy mode re latent homosexuality.

Do you think gorillas are displaying their latent homosexuality when they have sex in front of peers? Nope, they are demonstrating they are the ultimate silver back, the alpha male of the pack. To assume humans are, at base, so different, is to completely overstimate the pace of evolution. In addition, privacy is a relatively modern concept. People had sex in the same room as their children until a few hundred years ago [gasp...all those parental abusers!].

Men buy women's time and, increasingly, women buy men's time and sexual favours. It may not be as overt as in a lapdancing bars but plenty of relationships are still based on powerful man/attractive woman and, again increasingly powerful woman/younger good looking man. Why on earth do any of you think Madonna's personal trainer wanted to date Madonna or vice versa. She was using her fame and money to buy his body. Maybe not explicitly but she was definitely not into him for his conversations about nuclear physics and he was definitely not into her for her 50 year old body (being about 20 years younger).

Some relationships are entirely equal and based on love and respect and some are based on trade offs of power/money vs physical beauty. You may all argue that version one is fairer and nicer (and it is) but that does not mean version two will not continue happening or that there is anything intrinsically immoral (and certainly not illegal) about it.

So Larry,

Gorillas showing bravado and parents having sex in the same room as their children, in the same paragraph as one coherent idea? What?

Parents, out of necessity, had sex in the same room as their kids.

Your posts say so much about you Larry and not really much else.

No-one has said version two doesn't happen. What people are saying is that is immoral and abusive of women...

Posie,

They both concern male behaviour and I guess concern something that most on this board dismiss: evo psych. Behaviour evolves over time and is driven by the endocrine system, which is ultimately evolved to further oue genes. As we become more human, we modify this behaviour with societal norms and laws but to pretend behaviours which are ultimately very ape like are somehow abnormal is to misunderstand who we are. So, to deduce that men hunting for sex in packs represents latent homsexuality is completely wrong.

"Evo psych" is not an accepted field. Also most people misunderstand the complexities of the things they are talking about. Homo sapiens had an evolutionary advantage over Neanderthals based on co-operative parenting, without condoms and modern medicine STIs would have been a natural check on promiscuity too. This idea that men "hunt in packs" to rape women in order to ensure their genes are passed on is total bollocks. Ever noticed that make orgasm makes a man go to sleep? That it normally incapacitates the man leaving the woman free to have sex with someone else why is promiscuity and exclusively make thing? Just another way you use pseudo science to justify your bullshit IMO.

Lapdancing clubs are not about sex in the exact same way rape is not about sex.

Stupid autocorrect! Doesn't like the word "male"

Offred,

Who said rape? "Hunt in packs" means lads go out together to chat up women, hoping to end in consensual sex. What do you make of premiership footballers attitudes towards sex. I actually find their behaviour abhorrent, before you think I am justifying it, but the way they hunt in packs when they clearly have very high testosterone (apparently winning increases testosterone exponentially (source: Between the Hour of the Dog and the Wolf) is indicative of the way the endocrine system influences male behaviour.

You are misunderstanding the complexities. There is a drive towards monogamy and co-operation based on exactly what you say. There is also a drive to propagate one's genes outside a single relationship (for both sexes). It was harder for women to do it, though, as the cost of neglecting their own children was higher. STIs have always been around although the more obvious ones were self limiting (no one would sleep with someone with syphilitic sores) and the less obvious ones (chlamydia for example) has very little effect on men. I might have felt sleepy after an orgasm but never incapacitated. Methinks you exaggerate somewhat there.

Autocorrect and you have something in common then :).

By the way, I find what you and many other posters say to be quite interesting. It is a shame you have to colour it with your attitude to who you perceive me to be and make pointless ad hominem attacks.

It is far more interesting to debate with someone who disagrees with you than someone who agrees. I feel that most here prefer to have their preconceptions about men and male behaviour reinforced by others rather than challenged, especially by males who tend to get called trolls unless they totally endorse what the majority are saying. Surely males have some insight into male behaviour and its motivations? And please don't get into the "decent males" don't think certain ways. You really don't know in the same way as I cannot really imagine how a female thinks despite having many in depth conversations with women. A man can never entirely empathise with a woman and vice versa.

offred or at least I think it is offred, is bang on. These men think of nice women or women they love totally different to themselves and other sex workers. Women endure sex in exchange for material things or to please their men. Or even if they do enjoy sex there are certain things they would not ask them to do. You. Only have to read sites like grunternet to prove this. Many posts where the men say I see prostititutes because I couldn't ask my wife to do that.

Then men totally see themselves as entitled to sex and after all they have much higher sex drives don't they which must be satisfied. Women can live without it. What a load of old bollocks.

Larry, I have had sex in the same room as my children when they were babies. Occassionally. Its not quite the same as a gorilla(different species) mating in front of his peers. For instance, I would not ever let a man give me oral sex, on stage, in a strip club, in front of my mates.

Are you for real?

FGS will you please stop telling me what I think! You may think you are having a debate with me but you haven't actually read or understood anything I've said an the way you smugly try to speak for me makes me think you aren't even interested in anything other than talking to yourself.

Do you understand the word hunt and how it relates to rape?

Do you really understand the word consent or just think you do?

Men are incapacitated sexually larry, that's what I was talking about, sleepy and sexually incapacitated...