Support for those in Emotionally Abusive relationships: 11

[foolonthehill]

Am I being abused?

Verbal Abuse A wonderfully non-hysterical summary. If you're unsure, read the whole page and see if you're on it.
Emotional abuse from the same site as above
Emotional abuse a more heartfelt description
a check list Use this site for some concise diagnostic lists and support
Signs of Abuse & Control Useful check list
why financial abuse is domestic violenceAre you a free ride for a cocklodger, or supposed to act grateful for every penny you get for running the home?
Women's Aid: "What is Domestic Violence?" This is also, broadly, the Police definition.
20 signs you're with a controlling and/or abusive partner Exactly what it says on the tin

Books :

"Why Does He Do That?" by Lundy Bancroft - The eye-opener. Read this if you read nothing else.
"The Verbally Abusive Relationship" by Patricia Evans ? He wants power OVER you and gets angry when you prove not to be the dream woman who lives only in his head.
"The Verbally Abusive Man, Can He Change?" by Patricia Evans - Answer: Perhaps - ONLY IF he recognises HIS issues, and if you can be arsed to work through it. She gives explicit guidelines.
"Men who hate women and the women who love them" by Susan Forward. The author is a psychotherapist who realised her own marriage was abusive, so she's invested in helping you understand yourself just as much as helping you understand your abusive partner.
"The Emotionally Abusive Relationship: How to Stop Being Abused and How to Stop Abusing" by Beverley Engels - The principle is sound, if your partner isn't basically an arse, or disordered.
"Codependent No More : How to Stop Controlling Others and Start Caring for Yourself" by Melody Beattie - If you a rescuer, you're a co-dependent. It's a form of addiction! This book will help you.
But whatever you do, don't blame yourself for being Co-dependent!

Websites :

So, you're in love with a narcissist - Snarky, witty, angry, but also highly intelligent: very good for catharsis
Dr Irene's verbal abuse site - motherly advice to readers' write-ins from a caring psychotherapist; can be a pain to navigate but very validating stuff
Out of the fog - and now for the science bit! Clinical, dispassionate, and very informative website on the various forms of personality disorders and how they impact on family and intimate relationships.
Get your angries out ? You may not realise it yet, but you ARE angry. Find out in what unhealthy ways your anger is expressing itself. It has probably led you to staying in an unhealthy relationship.
Melanie Tonia Evans is a woman who turned her recovery from abuse into a business. A little bit "woo" and product placement-tastic, but does contain a lot of useful articles.
Love fraud - another site by one woman burned by an abusive marriage
You are not crazy - one woman's experience. She actually has recordings of her and her abusive partner having an argument, so you can hear what verbal abuse sounds like. A pain to navigate, but well worth it.
Baggage reclaim - Part advice column, part blog on the many forms of shitty relationships.
heart to heart a wealth of information and personal experiences drawn together in one place

what couples therapy does for abusers

If you find that he really wants to change
should I stay or should I go bonus materials this is a site containing the material for men who want to change?please don?t give him the link?print out the content for him to work through.

The Bill of Rights
bill of rights here is what you should expect as a starting point for your treatment in a relationship, as you will of course be treating others!!

It gets worse. NSDH and guy-friend had decided earlier in the week that we would do something 'special' on the last night - which involved us all going to a pub for dinner. I wasn't sure as DD doesn't react well with having her bedtimes messed with, but agreed.

So after being at the seaside down, NSDH is worried that we will miss 'the window' for finding a pub to eat in. We get home, get changed, go out again. Get to the pub NSDH and guy-friend had decided we'd go to and it was full. NSDH then threw a complete strop in front of everyone, claimed it was a perfect end to a shitty day, we might as well go home etc etc. Our friends = very embarrassed. I suggested we try a different pub on our general direction home. We get to that one, full again. NSDH throws another strop. We all agree to get fish & chips and eat at home. DD is getting cranky as it's past her bottle & bedtimes.

NSDH then starts driving like a manic towards home in the dark on country lanes. We lost our friends in their car. I told him to calm down and drive sensibly as he'd kill us all. He then turns on me and kicks off - shouting at me to 'apologise' for my behaviour in the seaside town, how 'everyone was staring' etc etc. I said I didn't care if anyone was staring and he wasn't getting an apology - tried to explain to him why his behaviour had itself been unacceptable and he just kept shouting "shut up shut up" over me.

He then started saying things like how he was "fed up with my moods" and said that "everyone thinks you've got something wrong with you" . I challenged him, asking him who exactly had said that and when, and he told me he wouldn't tell me. I told him he was talking bullshit.

We then started arguing about us - I stupidly told him I know he hides money from me, he denied it. I forget everything that was said but by this point DD is obviously getting upset (I looked back and she was wringing her hands ). I told him to calm down as she was getting upset but he just snorted. I told him I was trying to hold things together for her sake and he just snorted even louder. I said to him "What are we doing? What's the point of this?" and he said we should split but not involve solicitors. I told him I didn't trust him so there's no-way I'd be stupid enough to do that. I told him I was fed up and unhappy and that I needed someone who would treat me properly (he punched the steering wheel when I said this). I told him to calm down and he said "Well, why say THAT to me?" He said "I expect you'll tell the counsellor all this" (I'm seeing the Relate counsellor Monday) and I said I would.

It calmed down then and we both reassured DD as we'd got back to the cottage. He then went into 'Disney Dad' mode, gave her a bottle and took her to bed. Our friends arrived back home shortly after but looked very uncomfortable. They shot off early this morning.

What makes me really sad is that I don't think this couple will want to go away with us again (I don't blame them) so my pool of friends gets ever smaller. Our other close couple went away with us on that disastrous holiday last autumn and havn't suggested doing it again.

Any thoughts welcome. I feel shattered into a thousand pieces. I always get post-holiday blues, which is ridiculous in this situation but I do feel down tonight by simply being home. I have no-one to talk to. Tomorrow it's just us at home and I don't know what to do with my day so I can get away from NSDH. The next few weekends are plan-free which bothers me. I'm so so so tired I could curl up and die.

Apologies again for the long posts. I'm trying to use my posts here as a form of diary so I hope you ladies don't mind.

At least the cat was pleased to see me when we got home.

Oh, and icing on the cake. Our friends were planning on saving on cooking when they got home tonight by getting a takeaway (NSDH wouldn't permit us to have one when we were away) so I said to him "Ooh let's have takeaway too tonight!". He agreed. When we got home he went to watch the footy, so I put DD to bed, and waited for him to get back before ordering. He eventually gets home and says he's 'not hungry'. I asked him why he didn't say so earlier as I've been sat around waiting for him so I can eat - and ended up doing myself a pizza in the oven.

Even something as small as this tells me the following:

1. he hates spending money on anything non-essential and will avoid it
2. the possibility of me being hungry and waiting around for him doesn't even occur to him

God.

Oh nini it sounds just awful. I'm so sorry. I think holidays the worst...maybe it's because we're forced to spend time with them

Do you have anywhere you can go tomorrow to have a bit of a break from him?

nini that all sounds dreadful, you poor love. Small compensation I know, but it's lovely that the cat was pleased to see you - animals can be such a comfort when humans are being foul and inexplicable. I am sure that once you get out of the EA jungle, your friends will come flooding back, they probably can't bear to see you bullied and belittled .

It's awful spending time cooped up when things are so crap between you. The tightness rings a bell with me too, everything is about money, even though I now have a permanent job AND all along I have paid my share of stuff with part time work. Today was horrible for us with FW shouting and bullying dcs, then when I tried to deflect by getting him to go to sport (so he could piss off and leave us ALONE) he started throwing totally inconsistent wobblies. I finally escaped with dcs and we went shopping, feeling high on life, just because we were out of the glowering Presence of the FW from hell - sorry, he's not all bad but he was a complete shit this morning. Sunday to get through - we will go out of doors all day.

Nini I know what you mean about needing plans to carry you through weekend. Bloody shame we don't all live in the same town - mind you, we'd probably all be having some kind of ritualistic voodooing of FWs going on, so maybe safest not, eh .

OK tomorrow I'm going to take kids for walk and then swimming, then I'm going to clean house with kids helping for pocket money (new job tomorrow, FW carefully sticking to manfully doing garden so he doesn't end up having to help me in house now I'm working.....) But prefer without him anyway as he's way too bossy, he will stand and watch me doing stuff (like sweeping the floor, hardly rocket science) and make incredulous comments about "why are you doing it like that".

Sorry, long post from me too, I am VERY fed up today. Very up and down - high one moment because I sense freedom, low the next because it's bloody hard work being ground under someone's heel.

BTW I know what you mean about the utter lack of consideration, too, ie your dinner going awol, ditto at this end.

[choc] xxx

Just finally saying hello. I've been living in an EA for 20 years. He never acknowledges a word I say. Is an argumentative, obstructive arse. Rewrites history constantly. Has trained our teenage daughter to be VERY verbally abusive. When she does this, he tells her not to be rude to me, but always says that I should apologise for what I did to 'set her off'. Ultimately, he encourages her. I had half an hour of extreme verbal abuse from her today. Took my other DD out for the afternoon. Got hideous abusive texts from DD1. Came back to them playing happy families. Told DD1 to go to her room. He tells me he knew as soon as I started shouting at DD1 earlier (I didn't) that she would get upset with me. He tells me I am having a breakdown and do not know what I have said and done to cause the situation. I told him to give me his full support or get out of the house for the night, as I will never allow her to speak to me in that way. Anyway, for the first time ever, succeeded in kicking him out for the night. DD1 tells me 'You should learn not to over-react so much. I only called you an arsehole and threatened to kill myself'. There was much much more than that....Glad to be alone now. Girls are asleep. Dreading tomorrow. He will be back and full of self-pity and rage. He needs to go. I can't stand being so undermined. So glad this thread is here.

Wow kitty that sounds awful. Yes, this thread's a life line. Well done for getting him out of house though - you do have inner strength. It's awful that he's trained DD1 to be abusive. And of course, it's always our fault, isn't it - we're going mad, we're menopausal, we're hormonal, never, ever down to the FWs' bullying, intimidation and obstruction of course! Strength and to you.

Thanks trying :) and yes, you're spot on. It's all of those things. Sorry that you also know too much about this behaviour. Thanks for good wishes. Means a lot x

Unfortunately the couple we went away with (and most of our friends) are his rather than mine so i wont see them at all if we split.

No idea what to do today. Wish i had family or friends i could visit nearby. I hate weekends.

Nini that sounds horrible, I really feel for you. I hate that feeling of being embarrassed because of how nsdh is behaving, it's awful.

I agree, this thread is an absolute lifeline, I don;t know how I coped before finding it. I felt like I was going crazy! I was so confused, in a fog in regards to our relationship. Now it's starting to clear.

This weekend has been ok, we went out to softplay and to have a meal yesterday. Today I've actually gotten some space. However I am going out for an hour this afternoon, I mentioned to nsdh that I'd actually be 2 hours as I've now got to drive to our nearest town to get tampons, and he's somehow made me feel very guilty for not having a 'stock pile' though if I bought a load he'd have a go as to the money...I hate this, though at least it hardens me to leaving him.

Hi Kitty
Nini that is a horrible holiday, I'm so sorry.

It's been a quiet weekend in my house.
I've been thinking about our counselling on Tuesday.
Day to day I can cope with almost everything and maintain a jolly front but when I stop and think about it all and what I am going to say to the counsellor I am so sad and angry.
I swing between tearful and fuming.
I looked at the EA links (in the op) yesterday and started to make a list of all the things he does/has done and it makes very sobering reading (if you'll excuse the pun).
God he is a total shit and I am angry too that I have been a mug.

Arrrgh I must vent!

I sent STBXH an email this morning confirming who's doing the school run this week (we both work full time so it's split between us and friends who I've asked to help out). My email was to the point but quite jolly...just a "let's get it down in writing so we both know whats happening" sort of message. I want to start as we mean to carry on now DS has started school and STBXH is moving out soon I hope. STBXH has a habit of "forgetting" things...even if they're written in his diary...so confirmation is absolutely necessary as far as I'm concerned.

There followed a series of emails back from him (he's working today) about me filling up his inbox (!), making unnecessary confirmations, being too clinical about it....

Then a series of phone calls from him. He doesn't understand why child care needs to be confirmed!

I pointed out that when he leaves and we divorce we will need to make formal arrangements about child care that we both adhere to. He just doesn't seem to get it. he thinks I'm just going to work round him like I have in the past and he'll get to see DS when it suits him. But he's so bloody fickle and often expects me to wait around for him.

For example:
He made a big fuss about wanting to spend time with DS today. I had arranged a play date this morning (how dare I!) but said I'd be back by 12. He then said he had to work -go to the gym-- but would be back by 3 to spend time with "his boy". Back by 3 eh? I'm still waiting....

I lurk on here a bit and have to say bertie when my EA (I didnt realise it until several months post split) xh left he wanted an arrangement whereby he would ring when he was free to have the DC and provided that fitted in with me then that would be fine.

I told him one night a week and every other weekend and see a solicitor if you dont like it. He used to call it my nasty little regime . It was the first time I had stood up to him in years but I knew the DC needed routine etc.

I am almost 3 years on from him leaving and forget what it was like until reading it.

Good luck and strength to all of you I hope you find a way out, I was lucky my NSDH left us.

Hello everyone. Have been lurking for months and I'd like to come out now! This thread is amazing, like we're all married/with men from the same family. I am part way through the Lundy Bancroft book, and have asked for a separation following 6 months' escalation of verbal abuse, physical abuse, lying, accusations and shitty behaviour towards the children. He blames it all on his upbringing and the awful things that have happened in his life (cats dying, brother's failed suicide attempt). Yet strangely he can curb his behaviour when with friends, yet not with me....

I used to love him. He has a good job, is very intelligent yet has no values and a completely skewed attitude towards life and people in general. Everyone's out to get him. He drives like a twat, although he may drive slower if he is the right mood. Bloody hell this is turning into a right rant. I am so angry with him because he is choosing to behave like this and make us unhappy. I used to think he had a mental illness, but I'm now realising these are conscious decisions he's making.

He seems to relish being in a shit mood.

I need to stop there... I could go on.there are other women....

Top Fuckwit

Well you were all right, he has been behaving like an idiot in order to try to orchestrate a row so we don't have to go to counselling on Tuesday.

How can I put up with all this until a house comes up?

onesix - nail smile to face and practise non-committal "mm-hmm?" to everything he says. While inwardly chanting, "This too will pass, this too will pass."

Mulligan - welcome, sorry you have to be here. He sounds dreadful. Hold onto that anger, it's giving you strength!

Thanks Wellies. I have also read the 'Red flags' thread. Sooo many there. You'd think that we, as intelligent confident women would not be sucked in. Drip drip. Early declaration of love etc. I think I had every red flag going.

My mantra is onwards, upwards. For me and the dc. I'm actually thinking the kids would be better off with no contact, rather than the odd weekend when he fucks their heads up.

Hi ladies, hope you don't mind if I join in. I am 3 yrs out of an abusive relationship but still slightly haunted by it.
Please accept my aplologies for not reading previous threads, I am full of cold and feeling rotten (also a bit lazy if I'm honest )

Anyway, i was with my ex for 10yrs. Tbh I had no interest in him at first but he was so persistent and my self esteem so low that I was flattered.

The verbal abuse started early on, when I was pregnant with ds. The sexual abuse followed later during my second pregnancy but continued for a very long time until I eventually started "falling asleep on the sofa" (he used to abuse me in bed when he thought I was sleeping)

Anyway, I left him and moved on (albeit with a friend of his so non too clever but my ex WAS already with someone else by then)

I am very happy with my husband but we live in the same village I lived in with my ex. Ex moved 30 miles away. For some reason my ex AND his wife have systematically befriended friends of mine so that I now feel very isolated again.

Has anybody else had this happen, and how did you cope?

(should add that everybody but me, the kids and dh adores this man. They think he's soooo nice and don't see the real him - oh except my SW who doesnt like him and described him as passive aggressive whatever that means!)

Hi ladies, TGIS, eh!

Well my panic attacks have started returning, I suppose not unexpected. Hoping it's just the meds I'm on temporarily to deal with illness that cropped up. Meanwhile FW was total FW on Saturday but fairly reasonable on Sunday.

No actually, he wasn't reasonable, he just wasn't a frightening arse today, but he was still mean and obstructive, but sadly I am conditioned to find the lesser form of it "quite reasonable". Example - perhaps you can help me by telling me if this incident is normal or not; one of several similar today and constant, drip drip, even when it's not screaming and abuse:

I am phobic about spiders, (I wish I wasn't, don't want to hurt them etc, but anyway...) - there was one upstairs which I asked him nicely several times to put out of window. I reminded him that I deal with slugs, poor broken mice and rabbits brought in by naughty hunter cat (reverse situation, he gets freaked) for him, so please could he pop spider out as I won't sleep etc. He sat there ignoring me, smiling slightly and doing something on his phone for ages, as I stood in front of him like a supplicant.

In the end, DS came in and tried to move it, bless him and it escaped under FW's bed. FW then said, it's staying, I don't mind spiders. I said, trying to keep it light for sake of kids who were with us by now, well it's got eight too many legs for my liking in the house. He said the DCat has four too many legs for his liking. Kids horrified. I laughed and made it into a joke, fuming inside. Am I conditioned?

Sorry aspi xpost. I am so glad you've found happiness, and how horrible that ex fw is haunting you by befriending friends. Very annoying that others can't see his fwittery and horrible for you to feel isolated by his revenge - that's what it seems like?

Yes it is, he's annoyed that I've found happiness because "no one else would ever want me"

I know what his game is, I did go to counselling and she actually told me I needed to move away which really surprised me

Trouble is my eldest is on the autism spectrum so moving at the moment is very complicated.

Knowing what he's doing and trying to stop it affecting me are very different things . He has previously told me that I am wrong to not let him have control over my life as I am the mother of his kids which gives him the right to say what goes on in my house. Apparently it's a one way street though as when I said he could only have access to the kids if he didnt hit them he told me I had no right to say what goes on in his house!

It was at this point I requested a social worker to become involved but thats another story!

Hey all. Hey to the new posters. Hey to Nini, sorry to hear about some of your bad times on holiday, I'm not surprised you're feeling low now. You'll need a few weeks, i think, to process all that happened, does it change the situation between you? Hope your Relate session went ok today.

Trying, not I don't that incident is reasonable. It's abusive, yes in a more minor way but added in with everything else it's just horrible. I'm terrified of spiders too. My dad used to think it was hilarious to pretend to capture them and then just squish them. Then chase me with the spider-filled hankie till I was sometimes in tears. He was really mean to do that, but sometimes that's just dads. For your husband to be like that... no, not right. Hope you're doing ok.

Silver, something you said on another thread about a month ago (which I've only just read) from an OP who felt 'addicted' to her FW ex, and she asked you how you got things clear in your head - you said that you left and went to a hotel one evening after you got very upset, and almost instantly felt better. That's how it is with me. I can be crying hysterically, feeling so down that I can hardly move, and as soon as I leave with the kids and get back to my flat, it's as if it never happened. I think my flat really has become my sanctuary, I feel better being there with him than I do being in our house with him. But really, all my feeling unhinged and mad behaviour leaves me when i'm not around him. Even so, I can't seem to completely end things. I think there's definitely some 'addicted-to-him' issues in there, which makes me worry that I'm just going to keep going with him until I implode altogether.

I reckon our 'being abused' side can be triggered by a place, as well as by the abuser, pony. I also noticed that I was addicted to trying to talk to Ex-before-he-was-ex, each time I thought we might get somewhere this time, of course it never happened and we just went into the same old same old. As pathetic as it sounds, I preferred this to silence!

One of the reasons I cited in the divorce was that anything I said to Ex, like 'the cat is out', ordinary info giving, was never acknowledged by even a grunt. I asked him straight out to say something to let me know he had heard, so I didn't have to follow up every time with 'did you hear me?' but he just didn't. That has got to be deliberate on his part.

I am 'spring' cleaning the house, every surface is yuk! Despite Ex saying that he did DIY (in the settlement submission) the splattered paint on the side of the stairs from him painting the wall had remained there for the last 4 years. Actually, it cleaned off easily!

go silver go :)

I havnt caught up on all the latest posts im afraid, been going steadily downhill all day - throat has closed up and im aching everywhere. Lying in bed with a cuppa & the cat. I really wanted a lemsip but didnt kno NSDH didnt replace them when he used them all up - why would he, thats my job right?

Relate session went ok today, but dont think I articulated myself well. She wants to see us both nxt week so dreading that.

Promise i will catch up 2moro folks